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Should the "Metro" Concept be Revived for the GTHA?

All the 905 wants is for Toronto to subsidize their services. And why in the world would we want to do that?
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It only sounds ridiculous, because you haven't scratched the surface to see why things are so different on either side of this "imaginary" line. Trust me...the last thing you would ever want to do, is dilute the TTC. It barely survived having to supply the entire Metro area back in the day. Make it just another part of a GTA-wide and it could not subsidize it. The service the TTC now delivers would never be able to be maintained.

Agreed. Up to a point. We need to recognize that there are real regional transport challenges. The regional transit system is heavily focused on downtown commuters. But increasingly people travel elsewhere. If we are to have a system that can accomodate region-wide travel, we need an authority to co-ordinate such a service.

I will agree that extending the TTC would not make sense though, not unless the 905 is willing to pay for TTC levels of service.

Conversely though, it's a politically difficult to sell argument that the TTC should do everything possible to avoid subway/lrt expansion outside the 416, or that fares and service should not be better integrated. This is why I'd argue that Metrolinx should be responsible for the capital intensive subway (and possibly LRT) networks. Leave the bus service in every municipality to the local government. Toronto city council's only real issue then would be figuring out how to get us to the subway stations, for the large part.
 
I will agree that extending the TTC would not make sense though, not unless the 905 is willing to pay for TTC levels of service.

Which of course...they aren't. It really has less to do with how much the 905 tax payer is willing to fork over, and more to do with the built environment that can't support it no matter how much money you throw at it.


Conversely though, it's a politically difficult to sell argument that the TTC should do everything possible to avoid subway/lrt expansion outside the 416, or that fares and service should not be better integrated. This is why I'd argue that Metrolinx should be responsible for the capital intensive subway (and possibly LRT) networks.

Another recipe on how to destroy the TTC. (the same as privatization)

One of the secrets of the TTC's success, is they look after everything in-house (including maintenance). The TTC runs a completely integrated transit system.
 
Ryerson University symposium takes up the challenge of city-regions
Published on Saturday December 08, 2012
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/art...posium-takes-up-the-challenge-of-city-regions
Laurie Monsebraaten
Social Justice Reporter

It is a happy coincidence that the influential Economist magazine featured Toronto’s government “gridlock†in its Dec. 1 issue, says Anne Golden.

The former Conference Board of Canada president is using the same transportation metaphor for a symposium she is hosting next week on the future of Toronto and other large urban regions.

Golden, now a distinguished visiting scholar at Ryerson University, began planning her invitation-only gathering of respected urban thinkers six months ago, before chaos erupted at Toronto City Hall, prorogation shuttered the provincial legislature and Premier Dalton McGuinty threw in the towel.

But in light of Mayor Rob Ford’s legal woes, a possible provincial spring election and new leadership at Queen’s Park, Golden’s symposium: Governance Gridlock: Solving the Problem for 21st Century City Regions, couldn’t happen at a better time.

“With everything that is going on right now, I think there is a real opportunity for us to put this important issue back on the political agenda,†says Golden, who is co-chairing the event with Ryerson University President Sheldon Levy.

She hopes a report on participants’ suggestions for change will be ready early in the New Year for municipal and provincial politicians to consider.

It has been more than 15 years since Golden’s GTA task force examined governance, tax reform, service delivery and economic development in the Greater Toronto Area.

“The status quo is no longer an option,†Golden said at the time. “The GTA is a single economic entity. We are all in it together. And we need to develop the political capacity to make decisions on this basis if we are to succeed and thrive in the future.â€

But Queen’s Park never acted on her controversial recommendation to abolish the area’s five regional administrations in favour of a single GTA government to co-ordinate economic development, regional transit and planning, highways, waste management, police, water and sewer services from Burlington to Oshawa.

Instead, the Mike Harris government amalgamated Toronto into a megacity of 2.6 million, and downloaded housing and public transit onto municipalities, setting the stage for many of the battles playing out at city hall today.

In the early 2000s, the McGuinty Liberals tried to impose some order on the region. They created the Greater Golden Horseshoe Greenbelt to curb urban sprawl, the Places to Grow Act to direct growth, and Metrolinx to plan regional transit.

The Liberals also introduced the City of Toronto Act that gave Toronto a stronger mayor and more power to raise new revenues through measures such as the vehicle registration tax and the land transfer tax.

But with Ford turning his back on the new taxes, traffic gridlock increasing across the GTA and transit battles between Metrolinx and area municipalities far from over, Golden’s 1996 task force plea for a better way of doing business rings just as true today.

“If anything the situation has worsened, not improved,†Golden says. “The problems we identified in the task force remain.â€

Governance is not just about government structure, she notes. It is also about the way we elect or appoint political leaders and how we raise and control revenue. It also about how we engage business, community and union leaders, the public sector, voluntary organizations and citizen groups.

City-regions are the drivers of economic prosperity in the global economy, Golden notes. They are magnets for innovation, global investment and migration.

To succeed, they need money, governance structures and leadership to effectively guide where people will live, work, play and get around while attracting and keeping jobs, fostering well-being and protecting the environment.

“Everybody agrees cities are the engines of the economy. It’s almost a cliché,†she says. “All the major issues facing Canada from health and education to immigration and infrastructure, all are centred in cities. So what’s the answer?â€

Many of the 26 symposium participants agree city regions need more political power, money and respect from senior governments. But they acknowledge there is little public or political appetite to create new government structures during a recession when budgets everywhere are in deficit.

Instead, more single purpose bodies responsible for specific regional issues — such as Metrolinx for regional transit — may be the way to go.

Economic development, social housing, immigrant settlement, alternative energy, water and sewer services are just some of the services that would benefit from a regional approach, says symposium participant Alan Broadbent, chair of the Maytree Foundation and a catalyst for the C-5 initiative which brought together the mayors of the country’s largest cities.

They would be publicly accountable through boards of directors that are appointed by local councils, he suggests.

But unlike Metrolinx, which relies on Queen’s Park for funding and authority, these bodies need access to taxes or fees to raise their own money and the power to spend it, he says.

In the case of Metrolinx, a municipal gas tax, public parking tax or road toll could be considered. Other bodies could raise money through a regional sales tax or a special levy on the property tax.

Many city-regions such as Vancouver and New York have regional bodies or authorities that Toronto could emulate.

Most of them have no trouble raising the money they need through special taxes or fees tied to a specific outcome that everyone can see, he adds.

Paul Bedford, Toronto’s former chief city planner and a former Metrolinx board member, thinks a single tripartite forum of political, private sector and community leaders from across the region could meet regularly to guide regional issues.

Toronto Councillor Adam Vaughan, the only politician invited to the symposium, wants Queen’s Park to cede more power to Toronto. And in turn, he wants city council to relinquish some authority to local neighbourhoods.

“It’s about getting stuff out of the province that should be at the city level, getting stuff out of city hall that should be at the neighbourhood level, and making sure that cities and neighbourhoods have revenues that match their responsibilities,†he says.

For example, he would scrap the Ontario Municipal Board as the final arbiter for local planning decisions and allow municipalities — not the provincial Liquor Control Board — to license bars and restaurants.

He thinks neighbourhoods should control their green space through parks improvement boards, empowered with the ability to plan and spend public money raised through local development charges. In a similar vein, more public housing communities should be permitted to become co-operatives, so they can have more control over how their homes are maintained and managed, he says.

“That, to me, unlocks the gridlock and unleashes the creativity and allows a thousand little experiments to blossom,†he says. “It would move ideas and projects forward much more quickly than trying to put them through one centralized bureaucracy in a large government setting.â€

Under Vaughan’s “radical decentralization†vision, Toronto would not even need a mayor.

Ryerson politics professor Myer Siemiatycki warns that nothing will change unless the public pushes the politicians to act. So he proposes a team of young people in their 20s become local “good governance champions†to spread the word through public forums.

Former Toronto CAO and symposium participant Shirley Hoy laments the city’s “missed opportunity†to forge alliances with the regions when Mel Lastman and David Miller were mayors.

At the very least, Queen’s Park could encourage today’s local mayors and regional chairs to take a broader regional approach by tying provincial funding to regional initiatives, she says.

Hoy, head of the Toronto District School Board’s real estate arm since 2009, worries that many of the “gurus†gathering this week are no longer active players on the municipal scene.

But Broadbent figures there will be a handful of new ideas, energy and connections sparked at the meeting that will propel the issue forward.

“My guess is that people will listen to the discussion and end up saying: ‘I should be working with that person — we shouldbe working together.’ â€





here's a copy of her report, very applicable to this thread
http://www.openfile.ca/toronto/blog/2012/now-online-1996-greater-toronto-report-anne-golden
 
I strongly disagree with the idea. We don't have too many municipalities. If anything we have too few.

The TTC is overburdened as it is having to sacrifice better downtown service to serve Toronto's suburbs. With a regional transit agency the problem would only become more acute.

Perhaps Toronto should remain single tier, but include only the old city, while the former boroughs become their own single tier municipalities. That way, dtransit service would be much more convienent for downtown residents, because their transit service would no longer have to be sacrificed for the suburbs as the TTC would only serve the old city.
 
I like this idea, the 4 regional municipalities, Hamilton, and Toronto joined together at a regional level. A renewed form of "the 6".

A lot of talk about transit. There are other critical services that can be handled at a regional level, and directly impact development and therefore transit:
* Land-use planning
* Water supply
* Wastewater treatment
* Waste
* Energy

Having a regional vision on these matters is an exercise of managing growth. It worked under the old Metro, until water and sanitary servicing became uncontrolled with heavy finding from the province, exploding growth in the suburbs. I'd encourage everyone to read Shape of the Suburbs by former Toronto mayor John Sewell, it provides a lot of good context to the Metro days.

If the province is serious about managing growth within the Greenbelt and implementing complete communities and excellent transit, the planning of growth and land use has to come first. A renewed Metro could do that, with input from municipalities and the province at the same table.
 
If you guys get a chance, there is a new book out by former East York Mayor Alan Redway titled Governing Toronto: Bringing back the city that worked. I'm a little over halfway, and it is shocking to know there was no real logic to creating the megacity.

It makes the case for de-amalgamation, or at least decentralization. But I haven't gotten there yet.

Redway will be having a book signing on March 25th.
 
Agreed. Up to a point. We need to recognize that there are real regional transport challenges. The regional transit system is heavily focused on downtown commuters. But increasingly people travel elsewhere. If we are to have a system that can accomodate region-wide travel, we need an authority to co-ordinate such a service.

I will agree that extending the TTC would not make sense though, not unless the 905 is willing to pay for TTC levels of service.

One doesn't get to choose a low density car-dependent singe family home lifestyle and then complain about it is not convenient to use public transit to travel anywhere.

Yes, suburban people travel to other suburbs too, but the reality is public transportation is only viable for a certain density. Below that, it makes no financial sense, or you will have to bear long headways (30 minutes). So unless those suburbanites are willing to pay $8 bus ride, I fail to see a solution. You can't expect others to contribute to their financially unviable transit plans. Downtown gets better services because buildings are 6 inches from each other, not 600 meters.

If one wants to go from Markham to Brampton, probably the best way is still to drive. There is simply not enough ridership to warrant anything better because people are too spreadout, while for downtown bound trains, it is a different story.
 
One doesn't get to choose a low density car-dependent singe family home lifestyle and then complain about it is not convenient to use public transit to travel anywhere.

Yes, suburban people travel to other suburbs too, but the reality is public transportation is only viable for a certain density. Below that, it makes no financial sense, or you will have to bear long headways (30 minutes). So unless those suburbanites are willing to pay $8 bus ride, I fail to see a solution. You can't expect others to contribute to their financially unviable transit plans. Downtown gets better services because buildings are 6 inches from each other, not 600 meters.

If one wants to go from Markham to Brampton, probably the best way is still to drive. There is simply not enough ridership to warrant anything better because people are too spreadout, while for downtown bound trains, it is a different story.

Lots of people pay $8 now for bus rides to Toronto
 
Lots of people pay $8 now for bus rides to Toronto

that's certainly NOT because the TTC is too expensive.
The remaining $5 is the premium one pays for living in low density suburbs instead of the city, which is 630sq km where they go to work every day.

My point is, the lower the density, the worse transit will be, and it SHOULD remain so. It is a fair trade off and there nothing to complain about "it is so inconvenient to go from suburb A to suburb B". You choose the suburb and all the upside associate with it. Live with the downside as well.
 
that's certainly NOT because the TTC is too expensive.
The remaining $5 is the premium one pays for living in low density suburbs instead of the city, which is 630sq km where they go to work every day.

My point is, the lower the density, the worse transit will be, and it SHOULD remain so. It is a fair trade off and there nothing to complain about "it is so inconvenient to go from suburb A to suburb B". You choose the suburb and all the upside associate with it. Live with the downside as well.

and my point was that you were saying there is no solution unless suburbanites are willing to pay $8 for a bus ride.....since so many have shown they are willing, I would love you to tell us what "solution" that offers up.
 
Even without combining multiple transit system fares, that 905 bus ride probably already costs $8 (upfront fare plus the large tax-based subsidy).

But the problem isn't the cost of the bus ride, or even how far you have to walk to get to the bus stop, or how often that bus comes....it's the fact that's the best you can hope for, because higher order transit is simply out of the question based on the built form, which is never going to change (unless you bulldoze the 905 and start again from scratch).

This is why inner-city urban Torontonians shouldn't want to hitch their transit wagon to the rest of the GTA...suburban transit is the albatross around our necks.
 
Shouldn't be too shocking. After all, Harris led the Common Sense revolution, not the Logical Revolution.

Sounds like an interesting book.

Was it illogical though? Metropolitan Toronto didn't represent Toronto's real metro any more. If keeping a form of local government was desirable, a NYC or Montreal borough setup (with the central city being a borough itself) could have been implemented.
 
Metropolitan Toronto didn't represent Toronto's real metro any more.

That was not the purpose of Metro...it just seemed that way because Toronto's growth of the early postwar years was small compared to today. Metro was supposed to just be "the city", with room to grow. But still a manageable size for a municipality. A municipal entity the size of the GTA would be a nightmare. The "old" city loses out to the more suburban former boroughs as it is...can you imagine how much influence the even more badly managed 905 would have? We would be living in a suburban controlled nightmare (or even more than we are already).


If keeping a form of local government was desirable, a NYC or Montreal borough setup (with the central city being a borough itself) could have been implemented.

Well, that's kinda what we had. All Harris did was remove the lower tier of a two-tired municipal structure. And by the time 1998 rolled around, the upper tier already controlled 3/4 of everything anyway, so it was really not that big of a change.

It was the downloading that killed Toronto.
 
The "City of London" is still only 2.90 km[SUP]2 [/SUP]in area and with a population of only 7,375. (See link.) Compare that with Metro London at 8,382.00 km[SUP]2 [/SUP]and with a population of 13,614,409. People still think the British Parliament is in the City of London, when in fact it is in the City of Westminster.
 

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