urbanfan89
Active Member
Better yet kill it. No one will use the highway since it goes from nowhere via nowhere to nowhere.
|
|
|
Better yet kill it. No one will use the highway since it goes from nowhere via nowhere to nowhere.
carrefour
New Member
I like their (non)answer to this question :
25.Why are there two links “in close proximity” to each other (East Link in Clarington and West Link in Whitby)?
Early in the Environmental Assessment process, the Project Team completed a Transportation Problem and Opportunity Report. As part of the work associated with this document the need for various elements of the 407East and both north/south links was considered in the context of a future transportation network (highway and transitway corridor), including the Region of Durham. At that time it was determined that the optimum transportation network for the study area included the Mainline connecting the 407East in Pickering to Highway 35/115 in Clarington and two north-south links located in the east and west portions of Durham. The work associated with the report determined that future travel demand, including the movement of people and goods, required a combination of improvements to the Provincial and Regional road network, local and inter-regional transit and various travel demand management strategies were required to satisfy future growth.
The question should have been why spend the money for not 1 but 2 north-south highways going nowhere where it could be spent -
1. Electrifying Lakeshore East TODAY.
2. Increasing capacity on a designated truck route
3. Throwing the money into the lake
or
Why is it tht 30-year-old planning policies for the car designed for an older era still being implemented whereas those for public transit are tossed out the window after 5 years (re. Queen "subway", DRL, GO ALRT, Eglinton West, shall I continue...) ?
25.Why are there two links “in close proximity” to each other (East Link in Clarington and West Link in Whitby)?
Early in the Environmental Assessment process, the Project Team completed a Transportation Problem and Opportunity Report. As part of the work associated with this document the need for various elements of the 407East and both north/south links was considered in the context of a future transportation network (highway and transitway corridor), including the Region of Durham. At that time it was determined that the optimum transportation network for the study area included the Mainline connecting the 407East in Pickering to Highway 35/115 in Clarington and two north-south links located in the east and west portions of Durham. The work associated with the report determined that future travel demand, including the movement of people and goods, required a combination of improvements to the Provincial and Regional road network, local and inter-regional transit and various travel demand management strategies were required to satisfy future growth.
The question should have been why spend the money for not 1 but 2 north-south highways going nowhere where it could be spent -
1. Electrifying Lakeshore East TODAY.
2. Increasing capacity on a designated truck route
3. Throwing the money into the lake
or
Why is it tht 30-year-old planning policies for the car designed for an older era still being implemented whereas those for public transit are tossed out the window after 5 years (re. Queen "subway", DRL, GO ALRT, Eglinton West, shall I continue...) ?
AnarchoSocialist
Active Member
Short answer is that cars still rule. At the end of the day North America is still a car oriented society and a shift away from this will not be easy.
Of course there are other reasons that also play into this. Transit still doesn't have the same mega support from media, corporations, and the general public that automobiles do. And even when it does have support, it is often fragmented, leaving them battling each other and wasting huge amounts of time and energy.
There is also the fact that while transit does have more support than say 5 years ago, the debate often fails to put transit in a modern context, trying to understand how it can work for everyone, or most everyone, and taking into account the needs of all citizens. REX is a good example of a transit program that looks at the reality of the GTA and what kind of solutions are needed to develop a strong transit network. Transit City on the other hand is a good example of a program where it's goals and intentions are somewhat unclear and muddied; where streetcar enthusiasts are drooling with delight while those who are concerned about how well it will actually move people are left scratching their heads.
Same with high speed rail and TGV service. It is one thing to say 'we want fast trains between Montreal and Toronto.' It is another to also be able to answer even the most simple questions such as 'What happens to service for all the cities in between?' or 'How can this service be of value to the 3 or 4 million people who live in the suburban areas of the GTA and for whom driving to Union or Pearson to catch a train takes enough time to start reducing the savings that come from such a service?' If questions like these cannot be answered it is little wonder that support for high speed rail fails to get the attention of most people outside of city centres.
I agree with you that 2 connecting highways seems a little much, though I am not really against at least planning for a second one should it be needed. But so long as those in favour of transit or rail travel do not put forward more articulate, and relevant, arguments and fail to put a sustained effort into getting the publics attention and getting more people on board, not much is likely too change. And I suppose you can hope that one day wise and benevolent politicians find their way into office who will solve the problem with the wave of a wand, but given they are little more than creatures of public opinion, you are still back at square one.
Copper1212
New Member
There is no need for 2 connectors plus the 115. Why not re-root or eliminate it altogether. I don't see the purpose it serves in this scenario.
Towered
Senior Member
This basically sums up how I feel about it. I want to see a serious shift of funding from highways and roads to mass transit. It's been the opposite for far too long. Thankfully it looks like Metrolinx has its priorities straight and will set a course for finally correcting this unfortunate situation and bring us into 21st century kicking and screaming.
RedRocket191
Senior Member
I'm sure no one is surprised that the direction that Metrolinx is heading for is a pro-transit direction - because 90% of the duties outlined in the GTTA Act are about transit. However, the MTO retained alot of power over provincial highway policy. As I understand it, Metrolinx has free-reign over transit but can only make recommendations to the province about highways. Unfortunately, and I underline unfortunately, it may be possible for the 407 extension to be built regardless of the RTP calls for.
The Metrolinx RTP might not be able provide transit alternatives to eliminate the need for the 407 extension, as there isn't much in that area to build transit to. However, it might be able to eliminate the need for the Mid-Pen, 427, 404 and GTA-West projects.
4 out of 5 isn't bad, but if we can convince truckers to use the 407 as a cross-town bypass then we might be able to claim 4.5 out of 5.
Dan416
Senior Member
I have no problem with 407, 427 or 404 extensions. The Mid-Pen and GTA-West/Brampton highways we can do without.
RedRocket191
Senior Member
Every highway has one or more parallel rail lines which should be upgraded to reduce the need for an expansion. The only one which I've come to terms with is the 410, for reasons I'm sure everyone is aware of.
T
tangoplus
Guest
407 East
Any word on when the expansion is taking place, for beyond Brock Road?
Any word on when the expansion is taking place, for beyond Brock Road?
CharmAlarm
Active Member
Hipster Duck
Senior Member
I agree with that completely. I am a transit supporter, but I defer to the utility of a transit project where necessary. That's why I can't support Transit City for the life of me, even if I recognize that infighting between transit supporters on this continent is sort of like bums fighting over a scrap of bread.
We need to have sensible public transportation projects - both inter and intra city - that we can all rally around. If we had a large-scale association or lobby group that could define those projects and then use their considerable force to defend those projects, we would be much further ahead.
Mike in TO
Senior Member
Update:
Last week the Minister of the Environment approved the EA for the 50km Highway 407 eastern extension. The project will extend the toll highway from Brock Road in Pickering to Highway 35/115 in Clarington. A 407 East Advisory Committee will be established to oversee construction and address any concerns. Infrastructure Ontario has issued an RFQ to pre-qualify and shortlist teams to design and build the extension.
Last week the Minister of the Environment approved the EA for the 50km Highway 407 eastern extension. The project will extend the toll highway from Brock Road in Pickering to Highway 35/115 in Clarington. A 407 East Advisory Committee will be established to oversee construction and address any concerns. Infrastructure Ontario has issued an RFQ to pre-qualify and shortlist teams to design and build the extension.
Haljackey
Active Member
Hmm, so it's still under EA?
Any new news on the two north / south connectors between Brock Road and Highway 35 / 115? I can see how one might be needed as the 404 is way off to the west, but two of them?
Also, are the two links going to be tolled as well, or is it just going to the the 407? I'm all for tolling as long as the government is in charge and dedicates the funds to improving transport infrastructure in the province. This place badly needs transit expansions, a HSR / bullet train line and increased capacity on the existing highway and rail networks.
Any new news on the two north / south connectors between Brock Road and Highway 35 / 115? I can see how one might be needed as the 404 is way off to the west, but two of them?
Also, are the two links going to be tolled as well, or is it just going to the the 407? I'm all for tolling as long as the government is in charge and dedicates the funds to improving transport infrastructure in the province. This place badly needs transit expansions, a HSR / bullet train line and increased capacity on the existing highway and rail networks.
nfitz
Superstar
No, the EA has been approved.
They were part of the same EA. They were approved, here is the preferred alignment from the EA website. This also shows greenbelt and protected moraine in green (and dark green), and places that will be developed in white.
There's no indication how it will be funded yet; but I'd assume so. But if like the previous piece of 407, the funds don't go to transport infrastructure other than 407 - anything beyond that goes as profit to the investors.
cfloryan
Here
Well that took long enough! 3-4 years, seriously. let's get this thing built already 