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Plans to fill in Allen Road

I don't see the benefit of filling it in versus decking -- why eliminate a major road when it is easy to preserve?
 
I think the Allen should be extended south underground as a toll highway and coupled with a continuation of the subway south from Eglinton West. I know the subway line already continues southwest, but I see this as an opportunity to add subway capacity and allow for traffic to flow south to the Gardiner west. Let the private sector pay the capital costs of tunneling both the subway and expressway and recoup the costs through tolls. The city just pays the operating costs for the subway. There's a string of parks running all the way down to Front and Bathurst/Srtachan the make tunneling fairly easily. This would take care of the western portion of the DRL. I look forward to your criticism.
 
Euphoria said:
I think the Allen should be extended south underground as a toll highway and coupled with a continuation of the subway south from Eglinton West. I know the subway line already continues southwest, but I see this as an opportunity to add subway capacity and allow for traffic to flow south to the Gardiner west. Let the private sector pay the capital costs of tunneling both the subway and expressway and recoup the costs through tolls. The city just pays the operating costs for the subway. There's a string of parks running all the way down to Front and Bathurst/Srtachan the make tunneling fairly easily. This would take care of the western portion of the DRL. I look forward to your criticism.
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Well since you asked... How exactly would you get the private sector to pay the exuberant capital costs of tunneling?

You could rezone the adjacent areas for high-rises, but how on earth would the developers be able to propose 60 story condos without the people of Forest Hill and the Annex going absolute apeshit to their local councilors, MPs and MPPs?

Why would the developers dare touch this when they can for much less hassle, and without paying into this plan, propose 60 story condos in Humber Bay Shores, on Sheppard, or get involved in one of the areas of the city soon to be developed like the Portlands, or the Queensway, Six-Points in Etobicoke.
 
Sorry, southeast. You are correct. No, not satire at all. Open up the toll tunnel to tender and you'll see a line of consortiums a mile long ready to bid. The 407 is the world's most expensive toll highway, a license to print money. As for the string of parks running down to Christie Pits and Trinity Bellwoods, just look at a map. The alignment is pretty obvious through parks and a few north-south streets. I have prior posts on this that specify possible alignments.
 
We need a DRL to the west, and since the Allen is nothing more than a stub, tunnel it to the south under existing roads and parks, such as Winnett, followed by Arlington, and Hillcrest Park, then curve into Christie Pits. Tunneling under streets and parks is always easier than tunneling under buildings. Basically follow the alignment of buried Garrison Creek. That means you get stations at St. Clair and Arlington, Christie Station (overlap with the existing Bloor-Danforth station), Grace and College (or thereabouts), Dundas and Grace, Gore Vale and Queen (Trinity Bellwoods). There are streetcar stops at each of these points where the DRL would intersect with east-west streetcar lines. Finally, have the final subway stops on this western stretch of the DRL route back onto Queen/Richmond at Trinity Bellwoods (a branch of the DRL could still continue west at Queen). The expressway entrances and exits could be very discrete. Simply have single-lane ramps funnel onto the right-hand lanes of existing streets. In terms of where the expressway would merge with the roadway south of Queen, I would have it divide into two branches at Bathurst, so that its eastbound lanes exit spill out onto Adelaide just east of Bathurst. The westbound entry points onto the expressway would be just east of Bathurst on Richmond. The expressway exit to the Gardner could travel south under Bathurst or Niagara to a Front St. extension where it would travel westward. If the tolls are pricey and you amortize this over a long enough period, you've basically covered the subway tunneling capital costs for a sizable portion of the western half of the Downtown Relief Line. I think it's critical that we open up more of our best neighbourhoods. Areas like Corso Italia, Little Italy, Trinity Bellwoods (and by association West Queen West) should be very accessible. Also note that by building this expressway link to Adelaide, Richmond, and the Gardiner, it's possible to make a case for the eventual removal of the existing elevated Gardiner east of Bathurst/Strachan, since exits are created to the roadway in the core from the western Gardiner.
 
I've also argued for continuing the expressway east under Richmond and Adelaide (flowing in the same directions as these roads) to the DVP, and coupling this with the tunneling of the DRL as far as the Don, but people seem to become apoplectic and homicidal at these suggestions. I think we need to think a lot more outside of the box to get interesting things done in this city, especially when it comes to figuring out how to pay for them.
 
Maybe the tolls would be high. I doubt $30.00, but for the sake of argument I'll humour that amount. I still reckon that there are enough of the Bay St. crowd, and the less well-heeled wanting convenience from time to time, who are willing to pay. If I worked at King and Bay and thought I could high-tail it up the Allen to the 400 on a Friday so I could put my feet up at the cottage a half-hour sooner, I'd pay the toll. Not everyone would take it the entire 9 km, and not every day. There's a lot of money in this city and a lot of people desperate for a lighter commute. These projects would improve traffic and quality of life, period.
 
Euphoria said:
I think it's critical that we open up more of our best neighbourhoods. Areas like Corso Italia, Little Italy, Trinity Bellwoods (and by association West Queen West) should be very accessible.
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What about these neighbourhoods do you consider inaccessible at the present?
 
Toronto is one of the only major cities I can think of where some of the best neighbourhoods are off the tourism radar. Unless you're familiar with these areas, you're not likely to visit them because they're out of the way: How many visitors to Toronto in the late fall or winter are walking or taking streetcars from Osgoode to Trinity Bellwoods, or from Queen's Park to Little Italy? These destinations need to be on subway lines. I get it, you're worried about expressway exit/entrance ramps? Keep them discrete and on less pedestrian sections of major streets. No, this is not about surface expressways through neighbourhoods. C'mon, we need to be more sophisticated than that old dichotomy. My point is, reduce congestion, increase transit options, and maybe eventually remove the elevated Gardiner.
 
Have you heard that story about a lady named Jane Jacobs? Apparently she made quite the scene, back in the day. I think it was about a particular proposed highway coming south from the 401 into downtown but I'm not sure. ;)
 
Euphoria said:
Toronto is one of the only major cities I can think of where some of the best neighbourhoods are off the tourism radar. Unless you're familiar with these areas, you're not likely to visit them because they're out of the way: How many visitors to Toronto in the late fall or winter are walking or taking streetcars from Osgoode to Trinity Bellwoods, or from Queen's Park to Little Italy? These destinations need to be on subway lines. I get it, you're worried about expressway exit/entrance ramps? Keep them discrete and on less pedestrian sections of major streets. No, this is not about surface expressways through neighbourhoods. C'mon, we need to be more sophisticated than that old dichotomy. My point is, reduce congestion, increase transit options, and maybe eventually remove the elevated Gardiner.
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Why does every neighbourhood need to be on the tourism radar exactly?

This is Little Italy, not the Distillery District. What are tourists going to be gawking and taking photos of? 80 year old semi-detached homes? The local Starbucks?

You are proposing drastic changes to solve problems that do not exist.
 
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