Neptis' Review of Metrolinx's Big Move

[ehlow]

The Vaughan extension was pure politics and no one can say otherwise. It makes even less sense then Richmond Hill, which is why it's a shock it was built first.

I'm guessing it's because the Yonge line is already full (or closer to being full than the Spadina line). They are also hoping it will relieve Yonge by attracting people to the less-busy side

 

[MrsNesbitt]

I'm guessing it's because the Yonge line is already full (or closer to being full than the Spadina line). They are also hoping it will relieve Yonge by attracting people to the less-busy side

The problem I have with that is that it was and remains simply ridiculous to extend our subways so far into the suburbs that they even penetrate into sprawl-happy Vaughan. If politics were taken out of the equation and the goal was relieving Yonge from York Region riders, then that money and effort devoted to the TYSSE would have gone towards implementing AD2W service on the GO Richmond Hill and Barrie (passing through Vaughan) Lines.

 

[salsa]

I'm guessing it's because the Yonge line is already full (or closer to being full than the Spadina line). They are also hoping it will relieve Yonge by attracting people to the less-busy side

Nope. The riding of the finance minister at the time happened to be in Vaughan. So guess what, he financed the subway to Vaughan for political gain.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I'm guessing it's because the Yonge line is already full (or closer to being full than the Spadina line). They are also hoping it will relieve Yonge by attracting people to the less-busy side

The problem I have with that is that it was and remains simply ridiculous to extend our subways so far into the suburbs that they even penetrate into sprawl-happy Vaughan. If politics were taken out of the equation and the goal was relieving Yonge from York Region riders, then that money and effort devoted to the TYSSE would have gone towards implementing AD2W service on the GO Richmond Hill and Barrie (passing through Vaughan) Lines.

Nope. The riding of the finance minister at the time happened to be in Vaughan. So guess what, he financed the subway to Vaughan for political gain.

The worst part is that they OWN the Barrie Line! They could have set up 1/2 hour service to Bradford years ago and they haven't yet because of the ongoing need for tracks.

 

[TOareaFan]

The Vaughan extension was pure politics and no one can say otherwise. It makes even less sense then Richmond Hill, which is why it's a shock it was built first.

Please don't misinterpret this as an endorsement/support for the Vaughan extension....but is it really a surprise that it was always going to be built before extending the Yonge line.

Aside from the fact there does not seem to be uncontested support for the Yonge extension (given the pressure it puts on the line further south), the Spadina extension to York always seemed to be the "next" subway extension.....once it was there it should not shock anyone that politicos took it further...whether that made sense or not.

 

[ehlow]

The problem I have with that is that it was and remains simply ridiculous to extend our subways so far into the suburbs that they even penetrate into sprawl-happy Vaughan. If politics were taken out of the equation and the goal was relieving Yonge from York Region riders, then that money and effort devoted to the TYSSE would have gone towards implementing AD2W service on the GO Richmond Hill and Barrie (passing through Vaughan) Lines.

Well this is off topic but I do think going to York U, Finch and Steeles is likely to be worth it, because Finch & Steeles buses are very high ridership.

 

[MrsNesbitt]

The worst part is that they OWN the Barrie Line! They could have set up 1/2 hour service to Bradford years ago and they haven't yet because of the ongoing need for tracks.

It frustrates me. To. No. End.

Well this is off topic but I do think going to York U, Finch and Steeles is likely to be worth it, because Finch & Steeles buses are very high ridership.

I agree as far north as Steeles. Not because it's the municipal boundary, but because it's the furthest north that subway could be justified. Vaughan is ridiculous no matter how you slice it. As is the name "Pioneer Village" instead of "Steeles West", but that's another digression and frankly one that we could spend all day griping about.

 

[ehlow]

I agree as far north as Steeles. Not because it's the municipal boundary, but because it's the furthest north that subway could be justified. Vaughan is ridiculous no matter how you slice it. As is the name "Pioneer Village" instead of "Steeles West", but that's another digression and frankly one that we could spend all day griping about.

Well that name is clearly stupid ha ha. At least "Steeles West" is a useful name that shows what street it's on.

 

[MrsNesbitt]

Well that name is clearly stupid ha ha. At least "Steeles West" is a useful name that shows what street it's on.

Indeed. Though it could always be worse yet ("Black Creek Pioneer Village" anyone?). Then there was that proposal for a "Nelson Mandela Station" on the BD extension through Scarborough too...

[/DIGRESSION]

 

[salsa]

Councillors almost shat on Finch West as well. Someone wanted to rename it "University Heights" due to Jane & Finch stigma.

[/STUPID]

 

[MrsNesbitt]

Councillors almost shat on Finch West as well. Someone wanted to rename it "University Heights" due to Jane & Finch stigma.

[/STUPID]

This is the kind of reason that politicians need to kept at bay from transit meddling. In Toronto there's lots of [STUPID], sadly never a [/STUPID]

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Please don't misinterpret this as an endorsement/support for the Vaughan extension....but is it really a surprise that it was always going to be built before extending the Yonge line.

Aside from the fact there does not seem to be uncontested support for the Yonge extension (given the pressure it puts on the line further south), the Spadina extension to York always seemed to be the "next" subway extension.....once it was there it should not shock anyone that politicos took it further...whether that made sense or not.

I thought the Original plan was Finch West and then the LRT, but Greg decided he wanted to stay in his seat.


The most laughable thing about this is when people in West YR will have 8 min subway service off peak while Brampton, Markham, Milton and a host of other communities will have GO Buses until 2025.

 

[TOareaFan]

I thought the Original plan was Finch West and then the LRT, but Greg decided he wanted to stay in his seat.

As a York Student in the late 70's/early 80's the subway was "coming soon"....so I always thought the plan was to go to York....yes going beyond that was political but it should not shock anyone that that political decision was made before the political decision to extend Yonge to Richmond Hill.

 

[TJ O'Pootertoot]

Nope. The riding of the finance minister at the time happened to be in Vaughan. So guess what, he financed the subway to Vaughan for political gain.

Yawn, this conspiracy stuff is so 2004!
People have been trying to get it up to York for ages as it is (rather obviously) a major node. Simultaneously, the province passed new growth legislation that designated a chunk of land just north of York as a new downtown for Vaughan, something that had also been in the works for like 20 years. Also, the province is only covering 1/3 the cost but believe what you want.

We're getting off-topic but this stuff is just so old. Yes, arguably the Yonge side should have been done first except:
a) There's plenty of people on that thread who think it's just as stupid
b) There are, as we all know major downstream capacity constraints on Yonge
c) Building Spadina first helps alleviate those to a degree

Ergo building Yonge first doesn't make as much sense as it might seem at first glance.

We could take some pride in the fact our under-developed subway is actually going to where there's development but it's better to be like Munro and bitch bitch.

Every transit planning decision (for better or worse; mostly the latter) in this region is political in one way or another. The DRL was political over 50 years ago and if it gets built now, that will be politics too. York Region fought to get the line extended up into their node and paid their fare share AND it's already triggering major intensification which, I thought, was what we wanted suburbs to do. Better it should still be a field and we open more subdivisions in north Vaughan?

I don't doubt Sorbara was involved in the lobbying at some point but this talk of it being "the Sorbara line" or a "subway to nowhere" is just so passe and retrograde. I've said it in other threads but if this was 1970, y'all would be complaining about North York getting a subway up to Finch, where there's naught but farm fields.

The tri-tripartite Vaughan decision (i.e. including 3 governments not involved with Sorbara) was less political and more practical than the Scarborough line - both the Vaughan and Yonge extensions are directly linked to provincial planning policy and major growth centres, for starters - so chew on that.

 

[dowlingm]

The Feds were quick to pony up their share. Outer 416 and inner 905 are prov and fed battleground seats. David Miller wasn't going to look 2/3 of a subway in the mouth. Not much more to be said about Spadina Extension.