LCBO / The Beer Store

[W. K. Lis]

Laws against transporting booze across borders ‘ridiculous,’ says Stephen Harper
Harper was asked about the issue at a campaign rally Monday, following the end last week of a New Brunswick trial on the issue.

From The Star, at this link:

Stephen Harper says laws that prohibit people from taking alcohol across provincial borders are “ridiculous.”

He says that’s why the Conservative government brought in legislation allowing the practice — a private members bill nicknamed “Free My Grapes” became law in 2012 allowing for wine to cross borders, followed by additional changes in 2014 that freed up beer and liquor as well.

But it all requires legislation at the provincial level and not all provinces have the same regulations.

Harper was asked about the issue at a campaign rally Monday, following the end last week of a New Brunswick trial on the issue.

Gerard Comeau was charged with illegally importing 14 cases of beer and three bottles of liquor from a Quebec border town in October 2012 and fined close to $300.

His lawyers argue the law is unconstitutional, but the judge isn’t expected to rule until next year.

Harper, known more for his fondness for soft drinks than for alcohol, urged provinces to rethink their laws.

“My personal view and the view of our government is that’s ridiculous,” Harper said of the ban.

“That’s why we brought in federal legislation that does require mirror legislation at the provincial level, a couple of provinces have proceeded with similar legislation, not all have.

“But obviously I would in my campaign mode, non-partisan way, urge all provinces to adopt that legislation.”

 

[W. K. Lis]

I'm assuming that malt liquor (high-alcohol beer, usually 6-7%) would not be in grocery stores.

What about light beer?

 

[ttk77]

funny

I don't see why they wouldn't sell higher alcohol beers in grocery stores. There are a lot of good micro-brews in that range, or even higher. Wine is higher still, and they plan to sell that in grocery stores eventually.

 

[Northern Light]

LCBO on Coxwell (at O'Connor) is now closed for demolition, a temporary location has opened in the parking lot of the Shopper's Drug Mart at Woodbine and O'Connor.

The replacement store will be built on the current site.

 

[Skeezix]

So, it appears that 25 grocery stores in the GTA (60 province-wide) will be selling beer by the end of the year. I'm not a beer drinker (or much of a drinker generally), but I see this as good news. I'm just not happy at how overly bureaucratic it seems. I don't understand why they can't simply say that stores that meet certain conditions, and that pay for a permit, can sell beer and wine.

 

[ttk77]

Old prohibition mentalities die hard I guess. That and Ontario seems to like to do things the hard way, as if no other jurisdiction has gone through this booze liberalization process before.

 

[PinkLucy]

We have to keep it regulated. Otherwise, drunk teenagers will be running rampant on our streets and through our neighbourhoods.

ETA: /sarcasm, just in case someone thinks I'm serious.

 

[Skeezix]

I suspect secret deals with the Beer Store troika have something to do with it as well. But honestly.

Wouldn't it be ironic if we can soon buy weed more easily than booze?

 

[ttk77]

I suspect secret deals with the Beer Store troika have something to do with it as well. But honestly.

Wouldn't it be ironic if we can soon buy weed more easily than booze?

We're almost already there even without legalization. Thanks to the grey market with Vancouver dispensaries you can already buy it online. I'm sure the cops see it as illegal but that doesn't change the fact that incredibly easy to get.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Let's take a break and watch some TV. See link for an episode of Murdock Mysteries.

Murdoch investigates the poisoning of an anti-prohibition politician while Margaret Brackenreid hosts a visit from radical temperance advocate Carrie Nation.

Darn! Can't get away from this talk.

 

[CodeMonkey]

Old prohibition mentalities die hard I guess. That and Ontario seems to like to do things the hard way, as if no other jurisdiction has gone through this booze liberalization process before.

Yes, but unlike other jurisdictions, Ontario has that magical way of screwing it up when it does.

Another reason why they don't want to give it up is plain simple. It makes money, lots of money for the province.

 

[ttk77]

Yes, but unlike other jurisdictions, Ontario has that magical way of screwing it up when it does.

Another reason why they don't want to give it up is plain simple. It makes money, lots of money for the province.

I know this has come up a million times already, but I think the money argument is a little silly. Liberalization of liquor sales does not prevent the government from making craploads of money off of booze. We have plenty of examples of that right here in our own country, and I can't believe that our government is too stupid to see that. I'm more inclined to believe that beer store lobbying and lingering prohibitionist/puritanical influence are the real reasons for this gigantic mess.

 

[Skeezix]

Government revenue has nothing to do with beer sales, as the Beer Store monopoly is privately owned. The government can easily structure it so that revenues remain the same whether it is the Beer Store, or Loblaws, selling you the beer. If revenue were the sole issue, I would imagine revenues would increase if beer were sold in more outlets. There is the question of bottle collection, and the costs associated with that, but presumably that can be (and has been) worked out.

Wine sales are somewhat different, as most wine is sold through the LCBO which the government does own. I've seen arguments on both sides whether privatizing the LCBO would maintain or decrease government revenues. But in terms of beer, the issue is more straightforward.

 

[Bayer]

The Ontario system could better serve us without structural changes. Why can I get more products in a SAQ store serving a city of 8,000 than anywhere in Toronto? Do we need acres of Bailey's or Smirnoff when a smaller, regularly replenished, display would allow for more variety? I have complained to the LCBO directly about the lack of variety, and I was told inventory is handled by each store's manager. Managers, however, have told me that product selection and display are often dictated by head office.

On the other hand, my experience of another state monopoly, that of Pennsylvania, shows that we are not that bad. State stores are ugly, cheap and fluorescent-lit, and their wine selection is dismal. No beer; for that you need to go to repulsive private-sector stores where you must buy at least 24 bottles of any one beer at a time, or to some restaurants, where 6-packs are sold to go.

 

[gabe]

The Ontario system could better serve us without structural changes. Why can I get more products in a SAQ store serving a city of 8,000 than anywhere in Toronto? Do we need acres of Bailey's or Smirnoff when a smaller, regularly replenished, display would allow for more variety? I have complained to the LCBO directly about the lack of variety, and I was told inventory is handled by each store's manager. Managers, however, have told me that product selection and display are often dictated by head office.

On the other hand, my experience of another state monopoly, that of Pennsylvania, shows that we are not that bad. State stores are ugly, cheap and fluorescent-lit, and their wine selection is dismal. No beer; for that you need to go to repulsive private-sector stores where you must buy at least 24 bottles of any one beer at a time, or to some restaurants, where 6-packs are sold to go.

Utah is the worst!! Bartenders in restaurants must pour and mix drinks behind a "Zion curtain" which is just a frosted glass partition, that all restaurants are required to have, they have to block the view of drinks from people in dining room lol!!! All beer over 3.2% ABV is considered liquor and is thus subject to strict distribution laws and is not even allowed to be on tap in bars,which are only allowed to serve alcohol until 1am. Up until a few years ago public drinking in Utah had to be done in privately owned clubs which required memberships! Utah has a lot of ridiculous laws thanks to Mormon cult, they run that state.