GTHA Transit Fare Integration

[ShonTron]

They will.

http://gotransit.com/public/en/updates/schedulechanges.aspx

i just saw that as well. It makes the Danforth-Main Street transfer somewhat more enticing, now that a few more trains will stop between those stations. But it's still not terribly convenient to exit the subway, walk for 6-8 minutes (including getting out of the subway) to the GO platform and transfer there

Interesting that Lakeshore West isn't getting similar changes to serve Liberty Village better than the half-hourly schedule there.

 

[DarnDirtyApe]

I don't get it - they aren't adding to the AM westbound service, which has Danforth served only by trains arriving Union at 8:08, 8:42 and 9:10.

I have to be at work at 8:30, and many jobs start at 9. The current schedule doesn't actually work for people who don't want to be at work 15-20 minutes early and/or late.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Danforth will be served by trains arriving at 8:00, 8:08, 8:32, 8:42, 8:58, and 9:10. Stouffville trains will stop there now.

 

[salsa]

i just saw that as well. It makes the Danforth-Main Street transfer somewhat more enticing, now that a few more trains will stop between those stations. But it's still not terribly convenient to exit the subway, walk for 6-8 minutes (including getting out of the subway) to the GO platform and transfer there.

Kennedy GO should have been part of the pilot project. Much better transfer from the subway, greater time savings compared to the subway.

 

[nfitz]

There isn't even a bus/streetcar stop near Danforth GO Station.

Uh, yes there is. I use it all the time.

Kennedy GO should have been part of the pilot project. Much better transfer from the subway, greater time savings compared to the subway.

Agreed. Though it's just a 1-year trial (kind of like that 2-hour return St. Clair trial that started back in 2006 ...)

 

[DarnDirtyApe]

Oops, I missed that part. Still won't work for me...

 

[innsertnamehere]

They should have let people transfer at Kennedy. The walk is much shorter and its in a tunnel.

 

[ehlow]

It's good that they're thinking about this in general and providing another option, however, not including Dundas West station (Bloor) is insane.

Imagine all the people along Bloor West who could take the subway a few stops to Dundas West, then take a fast train to Union, assuming the frequent service is there.

That's other thing. Say you're commuting Yonge & Eglinton to Liberty Village, a pretty common commute that takes quite a while. This seems like the perfect candidate for this integration, you could use the subway to get to Union, then take GO to Exhibition, then walk 5-10 minutes.

The GO trip should be faster than the streetcars, but my questions are:
A. is the service frequent enough that the speed advantage still counts over the streetcar (do you have to wait 20 min if you miss the train)
B. You're competing against two frequent streetcars to LV, King & QQW, which are already covered by your token or metropass. Is this compelling enough to make you pay extra? The QQW streetcar has a very direct connection with the subway.

If the service frequency is there and the full trip travel time really is much less consistently, then maybe it's worth the extra $60.

Also, without through-routing like in SmartTrack, someone can't take the train from Danforth-Main station to LibVill.

Having said that, if say, you could travel within all the GO stations that are in the city of Toronto on your metropass or token, and they had frequent service both ways on each line now THAT would be something worth getting excited about.

On the plus side, it says it's a pilot project that could be expanded. However not including Dundas West or Kennedy is crazy.

 

[DarnDirtyApe]

They should have let people transfer at Kennedy. The walk is much shorter and its in a tunnel.

Yup, the time savings is greater if you are on the GO train for longer. As it is, the transfer from Main->Danforth eats up the majority of the time savings, plus you have to time it right so that you arrive neither early nor late for the train you want to catch.

My suspicion is that GO only agreed to do this for Danforth and Exhibition because they didn't want to cannibalize existing business from other 416 stations.

 

[innsertnamehere]

there is through routing on the lakeshore line, though not all trains do it and the trains spend a significant amount of time at Union.

The schedule showing which trains through route:

http://www.gotransit.com/timetables/en/PDF/Timetables/01150415/Table10.pdf

as for the lower frequency, you can simply give yourself a few minutes of buffer time. Unlike regular TTC use, you would have to start thinking in your head of what the schedule is, and make sure you are on the subway early enough to catch the train.

 

[Electrify]

It's a $60 sticker for Metropass to upgrade it to a TTC+GO pass for downtown Lakeshore GOtrain stations (Exhibition, Union, Danforth).

This will be great for Liberty village residents -- 65% cost savings over today for a daily commuter. It maths out to an average of $1.50 per GOTrain ride if doing 10 commuter roundtrips per week involving the covered GO stations. Good interim step before SmartTrack.

Not going to be useful to everyone, but many baby steps will be needed to turn GO from a 905 commuter into something very useful for 416 transit.

Another way to look at it is with 40 GO trips per month, transferring to and from the TTC will cost about 75 cents. And this does not include all other TTC rides which do not involve a GO train! This suggests that once Presto is system wide, there will be a 75 cent ride to TTC program. Assuming the parties involved can afford it.

Ideally they would have made it where a TTC Downtown Express sticker would have been valid, especially since that is only about $30. But conaidering the costs if the two fares it is pretty good.

 

[flyinggoats]

Bullshit, no Mimico yet again - Grimes is a loser councillor.

However, for $60 extra a month they can take their integration and shove it up their ***.

I'm sure this forum will soon fill up with "why not my station too?". GO plans for this experiment to be revenue neutral. In other words, the reduced revenue (from existing customers paying $60 per month instead of ~$170/month) will be offset by new revenue generated by new customers paying $60/month. The $60 sticker would unlikely be revenue neutral at Mimico and other stations.

Still, I emailed Grimes to request the expansion of integration, and I encourage others to do the same. If we put enough pressure on the politicians, maybe they'll be willing to subsidize fare integration.

 

[canarob]

Danforth will be served by trains arriving at 8:00, 8:08, 8:32, 8:42, 8:58, and 9:10. Stouffville trains will stop there now.

Seriously? You would think they would give us more service first before cramming even more people into our already packed Stouffville trains. Existing riders are going to hate this.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Yup, the time savings is greater if you are on the GO train for longer. As it is, the transfer from Main->Danforth eats up the majority of the time savings, plus you have to time it right so that you arrive neither early nor late for the train you want to catch.

timing wise, it takes roughly 25 minutes on the subway from Main to Union. Longer if you need to wait for another train at Union to pass before getting on the yonge line. 10 minute trip time from Danforth GO to downtown on the GO train, so even if you gave yourself 10 minutes to transfer, you would still get time savings. according to twitter its roughly a 5 minute walk to the GO platform from the subway, so giving yourself a 10 minute buffer to get there should be plenty. (time leaving your house so that by the time the subway gets to Main you have 10 minutes to get to danforth).


As a frequent user of Stouffville, they can fit a few more people standing at Danforth. Its going back that may be an issue as these new danforth riders will be "stealing" seats for the 10 minute ride from existing users. GO transit crowding levels are never horrible, and in the end can handle a bit of a higher load for short inner city trips like this.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

It's good that they're thinking about this in general and providing another option, however, not including Dundas West station (Bloor) is insane.

Imagine all the people along Bloor West who could take the subway a few stops to Dundas West, then take a fast train to Union, assuming the frequent service is there.

With the frequency they're offering, I don't really see the appeal of your scenario - you are paying a significant amount for a rather marginal benefit. I think as it stands now it has a better chance of being an appealing offer to people who are immediately around the stations.

Not sure about this conjecture - but all things being equal, I think it is more appealing to transfer from a low frequency ride to a higher frequency one than the other way around.

AoD