Glass requirements in Toronto highrises

[khris]

Was watching this video about the Millennium Tower in San Francisco. Ya, the one that's leaning. Apparently San Francisco does not require windows above 18 inches from the floor to be tempered, meaning when they shatter, they break into thousands of tiny pieces. They can be just regular glass that breaks into sharp shards. From all the balconies and windows that have fallen from buildings in Toronto, from what I've noticed, it's all been tiny pieces from tempered windows. So I was curious what Toronto's requirements are about this. Does anyone happen to know?

 

[DSC]

Was watching this video about the Millennium Tower in San Francisco. Ya, the one that's leaning. Apparently San Francisco does not require windows above 18 inches from the floor to be tempered, meaning when they shatter, they break into thousands of tiny pieces. They can be just regular glass that breaks into sharp shards. From all the balconies and windows that have fallen from buildings in Toronto, from what I've noticed, it's all been tiny pieces from tempered windows. So I was curious what Toronto's requirements are about this. Does anyone happen to know?

Balcony glass needs to be tempered, as far as I know, window glass does not.

 

[khris]

That seems crazy. I really feel like all the glass on building should be tempered.

 

[DSC]

That seems crazy. I really feel like all the glass on building should be tempered

It might be a good idea but tempered glass is MUCH more expensive and I doubt it is needed for most windows. PERHAPS for windows near the floor, that might be kicked. If you want it for all high-rise windows, why not in 2-storey homes too?

 

[lenaitch]

I think the larger, long-term problem facing these glass-fronted buildings will be deterioration of the framing, which will impact security of the panes. I think some buildings have already faced that.

Didn't some drunken lawyer launch himself a few years ago? That's more of an issue of strength of mounting vs. type of glass. Then again, you can't fully legislate against dumb.

 

[afransen]

I think the larger, long-term problem facing these glass-fronted buildings will be deterioration of the framing, which will impact security of the panes. I think some buildings have already faced that.

Didn't some drunken lawyer launch himself a few years ago? That's more of an issue of strength of mounting vs. type of glass. Then again, you can't fully legislate against dumb.

Not drunk, just stupid.

Garry Hoy (January 28, 1954 – July 9, 1993) was a Canadian lawyer who died when he fell from the 24th floor of his office building at the Toronto-Dominion Centre in Toronto, Ontario. In an attempt to prove to a group of prospective articling students that the building's glass windows were unbreakable, he threw himself against the glass. The glass did not break when he hit it, but the window frame gave way and Hoy fell to his death.[2]

Death of Garry Hoy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[whatever]

Balcony glass needs to be tempered, as far as I know, window glass does not.

Depends where it is, how high it is, and a bunch of other factors. Ideally it's tempered *and* laminated though.

It might be a good idea but tempered glass is MUCH more expensive and I doubt it is needed for most windows. PERHAPS for windows near the floor, that might be kicked. If you want it for all high-rise windows, why not in 2-storey homes too?

There's at least two panes of glass in each unit. Tempering the inside pane to protect against kicks isn't really helpful. It's the outside pane that would need the protection, if anything.

I think the larger, long-term problem facing these glass-fronted buildings will be deterioration of the framing, which will impact security of the panes. I think some buildings have already faced that.

Didn't some drunken lawyer launch himself a few years ago? That's more of an issue of strength of mounting vs. type of glass. Then again, you can't fully legislate against dumb.

Less so the frame and moreso the sealants. The TD accident was also an oddball. He'd done that same trick many times on higher floors and had no issue. What he didn't know was that the glass got thinner the lower you went on those towers.

 

[Admiral Beez]

It's the short half lives of the window seals that should be the greater worry. Many condos will need their Chinese-made or otherwise cheap window walls to be replaced within twenty years of completion. This may well bankrupt condo owners and corporations.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/throw-away-buildings-toronto-s-glass-condos-1.1073319

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/fears-that-shoddy-toronto-condos-could-become-future-slums-1.2796979

 

[afransen]

$20k per unit to replace the window wall is expensive but hardly ruinous. As long as they don't fail after 10 years, it's not so bad. A detached house has to pay similar order of magnitude costs for roof replacement every 25 years or so. Windows on a house could cost as much and need be replaced about as often as well.

 

[wopchop]

Balcony glass needs to be tempered, as far as I know, window glass does not.

Depends where it is, how high it is, and a bunch of other factors. Ideally it's tempered *and* laminated though.

There's at least two panes of glass in each unit. Tempering the inside pane to protect against kicks isn't really helpful. It's the outside pane that would need the protection, if anything.

The inner glass lite in your high rise windows needs to be tempered if it is acting as a guard (i.e preventing you from falling to your death). The outer lite does not, and it is typically heat strengthened, not fully tempered, to satisfy other structural requirements (i.e. wind load). If it is not a guard, then there is no code requirement to temper it.

For balconies it is different, the code requires all balcony glass to be safety glass, the type of safety glass is defined by the distance of the railing from the edge. Depending on that, it must be either heat strengthened laminated glass or heat soaked tempered.

For ground floors, I always recommend to temper both lites, as tempered is twice as strong as heat strengthened which is twice as strong as untreated glass. It offers cheap protection against vandalism.