Condo Boards & Reserve Funds: Perils Lurk in Older Condos

[investor]

Again, I've been doing this for over 5 years. The only advice from the city has been "hire a good lawyer".
They have told me that the condo would not have been registered due to these life safety issues, and, since it's been registered, there must be no life safety issues.
I lived in the condo for 4 months prior to registration, the city held up the registration because the developer had not planted enough trees in front of the building.
Also, since the areas in question are considered common areas (hte space between the drywall layers) I, personally, have no liability. I have also documented all correspondence with the city and developer, and my lawyer (real estate) has copies of this.



2 members of the three member condo board are friendly with the original developer, who still own 39 suites in the building....because they can't sell them.
I can only speculate as to why they refuse to respond to any requests by the residents.

The underground parking garage has a dirt floor, which turns to mud whenever it rains, the smell of mold and mildew in the garage is overwhelming. We've been requesting that this be resolved, again, for over 5 years.

IZ, here's what you do:

Prepare a brief and simple description of the problems that the condo faces and circulate it DOOR TO DOOR to your neighbors. Try and convince each of them to attend the next AGM and vote out the current directors. Get on the board yourself and work towards fixing the problems.

I know it's not easy and it will take a lot of your time but that's what you need to do to make changes.

 

[Edward]

Can't you just call the fire department and tell them there are safety hazards?

 

[investor]

Thanks Investor,

We've already started the process. We've had an'emergency meeting' last week, so that at the next AGM in January, we will be voting for 2 more board members, for a 5 member board. Many of the other residents are also annoyed.

Edward,
I've had the fire marshall inspect the suite, and he agreed that it is not 'right', however, he also informed me that the city has the last word, and since they've approved it, there isn't much the fire department can do. I don't know how true that is, but it's all I've got.
My neighbour has told me that the building inspector and fire marshall have told him that there is no problem with the way the building was 'renovated'.
Who's right? who knows?

I know that it must be terribly frustrating for you but the process will flush out the problems, I assure you, as long as you are patient. I've encountered a few of these unscrupulous developers in my career and the best thing that you can do is get the board members out of there as quick as possible.

 

[BuildTO]

Prepare a brief and simple description of the problems that the condo faces and circulate it DOOR TO DOOR to your neighbors.

This sounds like a good idea, and I might have suggested it myself. But be cautious. A friend of my boss moved into a house in a brand new subdivision. There turned out to be numerous problems with the quality of construction, some of them serious. This guy did exactly as above - wrote out a list of concerns and circulated it door to door. The developers (real slimeballs) are now suing him for slander, for I think more than a million dollars.

 

[screenplaying]

This sounds like a good idea, and I might have suggested it myself. But be cautious. A friend of my boss moved into a house in a brand new subdivision. There turned out to be numerous problems with the quality of construction, some of them serious. This guy did exactly as above - wrote out a list of concerns and circulated it door to door. The developers (real slimeballs) are now suing him for slander, for I think more than a million dollars.

Wow, does this ever scream of an Urban Toronto urban legend in the making.

'A friend of my boss'?
'for I think more than a million dollars'?

Dou have any further details? A copy of the list? A subdivision location? I'd love to know what was written. Who's the developer?

I truly believe and know there are real slimeball developers willing to spend lotsa funds trying to slap down and stop any criticism of their shoddy work... but you gotta give a little bit more info. Your post is only meant to scare a person from getting informed and keeping others informed.

 

[investor]

This sounds like a good idea, and I might have suggested it myself. But be cautious. A friend of my boss moved into a house in a brand new subdivision. There turned out to be numerous problems with the quality of construction, some of them serious. This guy did exactly as above - wrote out a list of concerns and circulated it door to door. The developers (real slimeballs) are now suing him for slander, for I think more than a million dollars.

It's not slanderous if it is true. If in fact the deficiencies exist within the existing condo board directors, then how is it remotely slandering for IZI to try and improve the situation by bringing the problems to the attention of the other owners in the building? This has little to do with the developer. It is the condo board that is responsible for the problems that he's described by failing to take action to remedy them.

 

[Observer Walt]

Be very careful about circulating anything unless you are absolutely sure that it is factual and can be demonstrated as such. For instance, don't make statements such as "doesn't meet standards" unless you have expert opinion (engineer or architect) that this is so.

For deficiencies in new construction, follow up through Tarion under terms of your warranty. However, note that Tarion applies only to "new construction". It does not cover conversions of old former industrial buildings, which is one of the drawbacks in purchasing an industrial loft conversion.

 

[investor]

Be very careful about circulating anything unless you are absolutely sure that it is factual and can be demonstrated as such. For instance, don't make statements such as "doesn't meet standards" unless you have expert opinion (engineer or architect) that this is so.

For deficiencies in new construction, follow up through Tarion under terms of your warranty. However, note that Tarion applies only to "new construction". It does not cover conversions of old former industrial buildings, which is one of the drawbacks in purchasing an industrial loft conversion.

Now you're a condo lawyer Walt? Thought you were an appraiser. I'm sure it's easy for you to walk through the place with your clipboard making little scribbly notations, but this guy seems to be living with a significant amount of distress that can be remedied fairly easily!

The guy has serious concerns with the way his condo/home/investment is being managed. He has every right to try and affect change in the management of the building. You shouldn't discourage him from doing that. He's not necessarily making accusations against the builder, he just wants perceived deficiencies repaired or replaced promptly to mitigate further damage to the reputation of the building and avoid additional disruptions and aggravation associated with the problems. If he's proven to be an alarmist then let his neighbor residents/owners make that determination.

 

[Observer Walt]

Investor, no I'm not a lawyer. I do have some idea, as do many others, about not exposing myself to liability by making statements which I can't prove or which are outside my areas of expertise.

I am not lacking sympathy for problems outlined by I-Z1. It's beyond me how the fire department can be unconcerned about conditions which would seem to create a fire hazard, or how the buildings department can be happy not having a set of "as built" drawings which they are supposed to have. I absolutely agree that I-Z1 should band together with other owners, and hopefully get some changes made to the condo board of directors, who sound ineffective.

An opinion from an independent engineer (one who is knowledgeable of the Building Code) would be helpful, although it would cost something to obtain.

 

[investor]

Investor, no I'm not a lawyer. I do have some idea, as do many others, about not exposing myself to liability by making statements which I can't prove or which are outside my areas of expertise.

I am not lacking sympathy for problems outlined by I-Z1. It's beyond me how the fire department can be unconcerned about conditions which would seem to create a fire hazard, or how the buildings department can be happy not having a set of "as built" drawings which they are supposed to have. I absolutely agree that I-Z1 should band together with other owners, and hopefully get some changes made to the condo board of directors, who sound ineffective.

An opinion from an independent engineer (one who is knowledgeable of the Building Code) would be helpful, although it would cost something to obtain.

Thanks ODUB, I think you and I agree on this one for a change. It does seem odd that the city would ignore potential hazards.

 

[BuildTO]

Wow, does this ever scream of an Urban Toronto urban legend in the making.

'A friend of my boss'?
'for I think more than a million dollars'?

Dou have any further details? A copy of the list? A subdivision location? I'd love to know what was written. Who's the developer?

I truly believe and know there are real slimeball developers willing to spend lotsa funds trying to slap down and stop any criticism of their shoddy work... but you gotta give a little bit more info. Your post is only meant to scare a person from getting informed and keeping others informed.

FYI: I've met the person in question. I did specify "I think for more than a million dollars" because I don't remember the amount exactly. This happened about a year ago. I don't intend to go further in posting details here because as I've stated, the person in question is being sued simply for pursuing repairs by the developer.

My post is not meant to scare, but rather give rational and reasonable advice, which is a characteristic of this forum.

 

[BuildTO]

It's not slanderous if it is true. If in fact the deficiencies exist within the existing condo board directors, then how is it remotely slandering for IZI to try and improve the situation by bringing the problems to the attention of the other owners in the building? This has little to do with the developer. It is the condo board that is responsible for the problems that he's described by failing to take action to remedy them.

It may be the condo board's responsibility, but the developer was responsible for the shoddy work in the first place.

The fact that something may be true does not preclude the possibility of being sued for slander. I support everything that I-Z1 is doing, but recommend caution.

 

[screenplaying]

FYI: I've met the person in question. I did specify "I think for more than a million dollars" because I don't remember the amount exactly. This happened about a year ago. I don't intend to go further in posting details here because as I've stated, the person in question is being sued simply for pursuing repairs by the developer.

So, um you still want me to trust your story without pointing me to any further info as requested? A year has passed. I'd like to search through the legal databases and figure out how the suit is going/went.

In my mind it's theoretically possible that the courts sided with the 'person in question' and I would be more than interested to read about it. Can you help a guy out? Private message me if you're feeling too exposed out here.

My post is not meant to scare, but rather give rational and reasonable advice, which is a characteristic of this forum.

Don't worry yourself... I wasn't scared.

You're trying to convince a person that has previously taken issue with some of those 'characteristics of this forum'. So you're going to have to work a bit harder. Creating a baseless urban legend doesn't do much for me.

 

[screenplaying]

Many of you seem to have a lot of faith in the city of Toronto's building inspectors and property developers.

That observation has made my day.

 

[screenplaying]

Why?

Check your private messages for an answer. I wouldn't want to libel anyone in the forum. My Catholic-raised ass hasn't been to church in a long time. So I make up for it by attending the worship services to city masters and developers offered here.