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Thread: TTC surface stop spacing

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    Sorry, politicians have been involved with transit planning since day one anywhere you go - involvement with politics is unavoidable. The question is the degree of involvement and the politics involved.

    AoD


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    Quote Originally Posted by AlvinofDiaspar View Post
    Sorry, politicians have been involved with transit planning since day one anywhere you go - involvement with politics is unavoidable. The question is the degree of involvement and the politics involved.

    AoD
    You sure do have to disagree with every single thing I say don't you?

    Anyway. Toronto (and Hamilton for that matter) have to choose a transit plan and stick to it. Coming up with a new plan every 2-3 years is clearly not working. That's why politics needs to be taken out of the equation. That's what Metrolinx SHOULD be doing. Sure there can be politicians sitting on Metrolinx, but as a whole Metrolinx should be doing more planning rather than just "coordinating" (i.e. rubber-stamping) municipal proposals. And of course it should be completely transparent and look at all options (I'm looking at you TTC).

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    CC:

    Not my job to agree or disagree with you. BTW, As it stands right now, Metrolinx can even be the one doing all the planning and it wouldn't make an iota of difference if and when provincial politics changes. You think that not having politicians on the board would make a difference if say Hudak became the premier, if the org doesn't have any independent ability to raise funds and able to act at arms-length? Recall who are the ones doing most of the talking right now over this whole row - not the prez/CEO, it's McGunity and Chiarelli.

    AoD
    Last edited by AlvinofDiaspar; 2012-Feb-24 at 20:55.

  4. Default

    Fair enough

  5. #80

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    back closer to the topic; speaking of stop spacing, can we just talk about St.Clair from SCW stn to Vaughan Rd for a minute? why does it stop at bathurst AND vaughan? it is literally one tiny block. it pisses me off every time. And did I mention the people wait inside SCW for the streetcar just to get off at Bathurst? why?! it should just stop at bathurst imo.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dandy Horse View Post
    back closer to the topic; speaking of stop spacing, can we just talk about St.Clair from SCW stn to Vaughan Rd for a minute? why does it stop at bathurst AND vaughan? it is literally one tiny block. it pisses me off every time.
    This was recently discussed on the St. Clair ROW thread. I think most people agreed that the Vaughan stop could go.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dandy Horse View Post
    And did I mention the people wait inside SCW for the streetcar just to get off at Bathurst? why?!
    While I wouldn't wait around to get the streetcar to Bathurst, if it was there in the station as I was coming out, I'd certainly take it. Why not? It's faster than walking. I think the possibility of using transit for such short rides is one of the pleasures of an extremely frequent service. I take the streetcar one or two stops lots of times when I'm shopping on Spadina -- why not? It's there and it's going where I'm going.

  7. #82

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    The Vaughan stop has to go or perhaps the Bathurst stop, afterall the SCW station is within walking distance from Bathurst - a few min. It seems strange it just comes out of that tunnel and it has to stop already. The problem on St. Clair is there are too many stops and stop lights since there are so many intersections to St. Clair

  8. #83

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    true. the sussex stop on spadina too

  9. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by Palma View Post
    The Vaughan stop has to go or perhaps the Bathurst stop, afterall the SCW station is within walking distance from Bathurst - a few min. It seems strange it just comes out of that tunnel and it has to stop already. The problem on St. Clair is there are too many stops and stop lights since there are so many intersections to St. Clair
    I am not sure if you live in the area, but the Bathurst Stop is pretty busy in the morning. Eliminating the stop is not going to improve dwell times much.

  10. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by scarberiankhatru View Post
    Removing stops anywhere is likely a non-starter due to the nature of our public consultation methods. A small group of 20 locals will show up and speak on behalf of the 2,000 that didn't bother to show up. A councillor or planner will introduce the issue with language as loaded as possible to trigger an outcome of some of the 20 people screaming about how their service is being destroyed and how it was unacceptable. Of course, the city could just remove a surface stop without telling anyone and we'd accept it.
    Some guy on Twitter is having a rather nasty turn berating me for suggesting that the Queen/Victoria stops could be removed given the proximity of Yonge Steet, especially the westbound stop that would practically serve Victoria and St. Mike's by way of the rear door. He started off with a harsh accusation and is continuing it because his wife has MS and I, personally, want to make her walk a bit further. (Never mind that the walk from the 506 to Toronto General would still be longer, or that Mount Sinai and PMH are longer walks still, even the walk to the entrance to Toronto Western from Bathurst/Dundas isn't much shorter.)

    When someone with a chip on their shoulder like that is going after someone publicly on Twitter who has no power to do anything about stop spacing, how do you have proper debates on these types of things?
    Last edited by ShonTron; 2013-Jun-18 at 22:16.

  11. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by scarberiankhatru View Post
    Removing stops anywhere is likely a non-starter due to the nature of our public consultation methods. A small group of 20 locals will show up and speak on behalf of the 2,000 that didn't bother to show up. A councillor or planner will introduce the issue with language as loaded as possible to trigger an outcome of some of the 20 people screaming about how their service is being destroyed and how it was unacceptable. Of course, the city could just remove a surface stop without telling anyone and we'd accept it.
    TTC should send some guys to paint over half of the redundant streetcar stops in the dark of night. By time Toronto wakes up and finds out the news, it will be too late to go back

  12. #87
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    Default

    Bathurst needs to stay since 7 runs on it and a transfer point. I use it a numerous times a year.

    Vaughan and one of the stops between Dufferin and Oakwood can go.

    All routes stopping at Victoria need to go as well at York, Simcoe. I can see Queen being an issue to a point, but we cannot stop just for a few riders regardless of their medical issue. Been there and done it.

    We need to form a group to go out at night and totally remove redundant stops regardless if it a streetcar or bus route if TTC is unwilling to do so. You need to remove everything related to the stop unless there is a shelter there. Then put up out of service sign on them and tell them where the next stop is located.
    Due Time restriction, visit my site https://www.flickr.com/photos/drum118/ to see updated photos of projects shot the last few weeks since I don't have the time to post them to various threads.
    See my videos on YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/Transitdrum118/videos

  13. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by ShonTron View Post
    Some guy on Twitter is having a rather nasty turn berating me for suggesting that the Queen/Victoria stops could be removed given the proximity of Yonge Steet, especially the westbound stop that would practically serve Victoria and St. Mike's by way of the rear door. He started off with a harsh accusation and is continuing it because his wife has MS and I, personally, want to make her walk a bit further. (Never mind that the walk from the 506 to Toronto General would still be longer, or that Mount Sinai and PMH are longer walks still, even the walk to the entrance to Toronto Western from Bathurst/Dundas isn't much shorter.)

    When someone with a chip on their shoulder like that is going after someone publicly on Twitter who has no power to do anything about stop spacing, how do you have proper debates on these types of things?
    I'm more upset that the streetcar doesn't pull right into the hospital and has a stop located IN her room! The nerve of this city to make her walk from Victoria and Queen ALL THE WAY to the hospital on the other side of the street/around the corner!

    Seriously though, if someone cannot manage the extra 200m from Church St, let alone the 100m from Yonge St without serious discomfort, then you are more than deserving of Wheel-Trans service. Yes, it costs more to provide, but as a society which looks out for those less fortunate it is a cost worthy of pursuing. Worth noting that this is also assuming that an electric wheelchair is unavailable for whatever reasons, as subsidizing such equipment may end up being more cost efficient than providing regular WT service.

  14. #89

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    Just wondering, has the TTC done any serious passenger counts at the various bus and streetcar stops? As I mentioned in the conclusions to my research paper regarding Transit City's stop spacing that I posted here, one of the proposed stops had such a ridiculously low passenger count that I needed to find another stop to finish my surveys.

    Laying stops down mindlessly may work for a new request stop surface route, but as ridership grows they should either remove unused stops or run a rapid/limited accompanying service to hit the most used stops.

  15. #90

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    Quote Originally Posted by Electrify View Post

    Seriously though, if someone cannot manage the extra 200m from Church St, let alone the 100m from Yonge St without serious discomfort, then you are more than deserving of Wheel-Trans service. Yes, it costs more to provide, but as a society which looks out for those less fortunate it is a cost worthy of pursuing. Worth noting that this is also assuming that an electric wheelchair is unavailable for whatever reasons, as subsidizing such equipment may end up being more cost efficient than providing regular WT service.
    Exactly, and that's precisely why Wheel-Trans will still be needed even when all the accessible streetcars come online and elevators installed in all the subway stations. But you can't tell someone angrily ranting at you on Twitter that, less it becomes an all-out flame war.
    Last edited by ShonTron; 2013-Jun-19 at 08:53.

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