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TTC: New Articulated Buses (In Delivery, Novabus)

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Electrify

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Just wondering if you think the TTC should look at articulated buses again. Yes, they had problems with them in the 80s and early 90s, but those buses were built in the USSR before the fall of the Berlin Wall! Other municipalities in Ontario and Canada use them, and most of them get far more snow with higher ridership than Toronto. Low floor artics can help us bring the number of passengers per bus to the same as our high floor buses.
 
Might be an idea for some of the busy suburban routes. Won't do much south of Bloor except perhaps Dufferin, as the streetcars tend to be on the busier routes, rather than buses. Capacity of one of those 18-metre articulated buses is probably about the same as one of those old small CLRV 15-m long streetcars we are getting rid of.
 
I previously read something about the bus bays at most stations not being able to fit a 18 metre long bus. Kind of true though as I see how it can cause issues such as bus crowding.
 
Dufferin could use 18 metre buses. Reduce the number of buses on the route, and improve the frequency.
 
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The TTC seems to have been scared off them after their awful eastern European built artics disintegrated on them back in the early 90s. However, the new Mt Dennis garage was designed to accommodate 60ft buses and the TTC would like to get some if they can get a manufacturer to guarantee them for as long as the 40ft buses. They did have an RFP a few years back looking for bidders for delivery in 2009-10 but they ended up going with yet more 40ft Orion VIIs instead.
 
Justin10000 said:
Dufferin could use 18 metre buses. Reduce the number of buses on the route, and improve the frequency.
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And except at Wilson, "bus bays" conveniently don't figure into the equation...unless there's an issue at the Dufferin Gate loop. (But at least the jog elimination would take care of the head-scratching over negotiating bendy buses around Gladstone way)
 
Artics are probably not a good idea without POP system...

Otherwise, reducing the number of buses just means more delays at stops, to wait for people to get onto the bus, and that means slower and more unreliable service, not to mention further reduced frequencies and capacities, partly negating the saving in labour costs, which is the whole point of using artics in first place.

adma said:
(But at least the jog elimination would take care of the head-scratching over negotiating bendy buses around Gladstone way)
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There wouldn't be a problem with the Dufferin Jog anyways considering that artics have a smaller turn radius than the regular 40 foot buses that currently go through there...
 
doady said:
There wouldn't be a problem with the Dufferin Jog anyways considering that artics have a smaller turn radius than the regular 40 foot buses that currently go through there...
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The turn radius would refer to the outer circle the front bumper if the bus follows. The trailer of an artic still cuts the corner a lot more than a standard bus, presenting problems at narrow corners such as at the Jog.

Anyways I do recall a TTC report mentioning they would monitor the performance of the new Nova Artics purchased by York Region for the Viva system and consider them in a few years. And looking at their specifications sheet, their articulated model has a wider turn radius then their standard model. I know the opposite is true with some other manufactures.
 
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adma said:
And except at Wilson, "bus bays" conveniently don't figure into the equation...)
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Many of the subway station bus platforms use those angled indentation-style loading areas. Artics won't fit in those. Obviously this could be easily solved, but it's something to consider.
 
Actually, I read it - thought the same thing - but it is possible :eek:. There are some routes where the buses seem to come in groups of 3, then a pause, then a group of 3. So if you have 2 artic buses with no grouping.... it is possible :p
 
I guess the suggestion is that the actual frequency would improve, rather than the scheduled frequency.
 
Riding an artic yesterday, I remembered another disadvantage of artics: they stop at every stop. With so many people on the bus, there is a request for every stop. Even without a request, there is more likelihood that at least one person is waiting at the stop. So this is on top of the increased time it takes to allow people to get onto the bus. It was quite annoying, especially considering that bus already 20 minutes behind schedule. Slower buses and lower frequency is not a good combination...
 
doady said:
Riding an artic yesterday, I remembered another disadvantage of artics: they stop at every stop. With so many people on the bus, there is a request for every stop. Even without a request, there is more likelihood that at least one person is waiting at the stop. So this is on top of the increased time it takes to allow people to get onto the bus. It was quite annoying, especially considering that bus already 20 minutes behind schedule. Slower buses and lower frequency is not a good combination...
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Each stop will also require more curb side space to pull into, else the tail end will just end up sticking out into the second lane if there are parked (just getting a smoke, be back in a minute) cars.
 
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