Adjei
Senior Member
I'm not complaining about that. I don't have any problems with it. I'm complaining about having two separate bus terminals for ttc and York region buses.
Toronto Spadina Subway Extension Emergency Exits | ?m | 1s | TTC | IBI Group
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W. K. Lis
Superstar
To those who complain about the real estate used by the new stations, are they okay with the real estate used by highway intersections?
400/407 intersection:
Image by Oscar Flores
Highway 407 Subway Station:
400/407 intersection:
Image by Oscar Flores
Highway 407 Subway Station:
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Tuck
Active Member
The space taken up by highways is often cited as inefficient and wasteful, yes.To those who complain about the real estate used by the new stations, are they okay with the real estate used by highway intersections?
400/407 intersection:
Highway 407 Subway Station:
But more than that, its more important for transit to be surrounded by high density development so that people actually use it and you're not left with empty stations. Transit stations are great for creating density, if you give them the opportunity to do so. Otherwise I feel its kind of a waste of resources. Though the 407 station is pretty much in the middle of no where so I can't say I care too much about that one specifically.
This comes down to fare integration, unfortunately. Finch is like this too, and its stupid.
Megaton327
Senior Member
There is no separate bus terminal for TTC buses as no TTC buses will service the area of VMC station. Not sure where you got that impression. There is the YRT bus terminal and the Viva mid-road station--there is no second terminal at all, and no TTC buses.
Adjei
Senior Member
I'm talking about Pioneer village station.
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
DonValleyRainbow
Senior Member
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amnesiajune
Senior Member
Because the TTC buses need to go into a fare-paid area, while the YRT buses need to go into an area outside of the fare-paid zone. Hopefully this will be obsolete soon but for the time being, the two bus systems need to be separated.
A street stop wouldn't be sufficient once the LRT is built. By having a bus terminal people can go directly down from any of the bus routes to the subway and LRT platforms. There also needs to be somewhere for the 199 bus to quickly turn around, and a "simple street stop" wouldn't provide that.
Steve X
Senior Member
They already ran a test train up there but not on it's own power.
TransitBart
Senior Member
This thing is shaped like a Cylon base star.
lead82
Senior Member
This project should have been a catalyst for integration of fares. Instead we get the same old policies. With Presto, integration can be possible between the various bus systems. There is no need to physically keep them separate.
As for Finch West, even with the LRT, the need for a large bus terminal isn't necessary. Sure they could have built a small turn around for 199 and 36 buses as part of one of the station entrances and provided a sheltered canopy. My point is that the building of a large terminal there is not warranted given that the only heavy bus traffic would be from Finch east to Yonge. The N/S routes are not frequent and will likely be reduced after the subway opens and the LRT will have an underground connection. Toronto has a tendency to overbuild in the suburbs and under-invest where it's needed.
Anyways, it's a moot point now as it's been built.
Tuck
Active Member
Sad but true. The "Fare integration takes time" excuse doesn't even work here - they've had a decade to figure it out.
Steve X
Senior Member
How many bus routes did you think is terminating there? Not a waste when they'll have 20 bus routes or branches going in different directions. Pioneer Village is suppose to become a major transfer point like Finch and Downsview. If they built one that doesn't have enough bus bays, buses would be fighting over them causing unnecessary delays and additional confusion. Of course we could have 6 different bus routes share a bus bay and let the whole place become a zoo with buses back onto the streets in rush hour.
For the TTC there is the 35A/C, 41A/B, 41E, 60B/D WB, 60 EB, 60E EB, 84D, 106 , 107 , 108, 195 plus W-T. TTC included 2 additional bays for unloading and future expansion for a total of 14. YRT have the 3, 20, 22A, 100, 107 and 165. They'll have plenty of expansion in the future. The TTC terminal would be fare paid zone while the YRT one won't be. Think of all the fare evasion that can easily happen if they had one terminal that's divided by a fence.
Finch was only originally planned for a tiny 4 bus pay terminal. None of them are artic bays. Of course this wouldn't work with 36 and the 199 heading in the station. They'll have to expand the bus terminal to accommodate the 36 using artics. This doesn't mean they'll need to expand the building, just the roadway and platform. They still got at least 4 more years till Finch West LRT opens.
lead82
Senior Member
If it wasn't for Rob Ford, FWLRT would be up and running already.
As for the terminals, it's mainly the 35, 60, and 195 routes that are frequent. The rest come once every 20-60 minutes. Same with the YRT routes. I'm not sure how many YRT routes will keep going to Pioneer Village, given that there is another bus terminal at VMC, and at Highway 407. These routes are not too frequent. One large terminal could have easily handled it at Pioneer Village. You do realize that with Pioneer Village, Highway 407 and VMC, there are 4 large bus terminals in such a small area with extremely low density. Instead of spending money on these large terminals, the TTC should have sold the land and integrated some commercial development into these lands.
As for the terminals, it's mainly the 35, 60, and 195 routes that are frequent. The rest come once every 20-60 minutes. Same with the YRT routes. I'm not sure how many YRT routes will keep going to Pioneer Village, given that there is another bus terminal at VMC, and at Highway 407. These routes are not too frequent. One large terminal could have easily handled it at Pioneer Village. You do realize that with Pioneer Village, Highway 407 and VMC, there are 4 large bus terminals in such a small area with extremely low density. Instead of spending money on these large terminals, the TTC should have sold the land and integrated some commercial development into these lands.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
It'll be decades before those bus terminals will have buildings put on top of them. Even then, I doubt they would be included in this list of bus terminals at this link.
Millennium Park Bus Depot – World’s Largest Bus Station
Chennai Mofussil Bus Terminus – World’s Biggest Bus Terminus
Port Authority Bus Terminal – World’s Busiest Bus Station By Volume of Traffic
Kamppi Center – Europe’s Largest Underground Bus Station
Millennium Park Bus Depot – World’s Largest Bus Station
Chennai Mofussil Bus Terminus – World’s Biggest Bus Terminus
Port Authority Bus Terminal – World’s Busiest Bus Station By Volume of Traffic
Kamppi Center – Europe’s Largest Underground Bus Station