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Waterfront Transit Reset Phase 1 Study

How should Toronto connect the East and West arms of the planned waterfront transit with downtown?

  • Expand the existing Union loop

    Votes: 179 73.4%
  • Build a Western terminus

    Votes: 10 4.1%
  • Route service along Queen's Quay with pedestrian/cycle/bus connection to Union

    Votes: 23 9.4%
  • Connect using existing Queen's Quay/Union Loop and via King Street

    Votes: 17 7.0%
  • Other

    Votes: 15 6.1%

  • Total voters
    244

EnviroTO

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While I agree that Toronto should raise property tax, I don't agree they should use that to expand transit; that money is needed for capital and operating needs for parks, long-term care, shelters, housing, culture, recreation, libraries, cycling, public realm/streetscapes and more.

Transit should be funded via road tolls, which the City agreed to do, passing it, only to have it vetoed by the province.
Metrolinx took over transit of regional significance. Local buses, streetcars, bike lanes.... that is for the city. If the city can't pay for the local services required to service the port lands they aren't setting development charges and property taxes appropriately.
 
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drum118

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Word is (others have more info), a test bed is to be setup on Cherry St ROW to tryout grass for QQE and Portland. Long over due and need to look at QQW as well.

QQE will go south on the New Cherry St and turn east on Commissioner St To a loop north of Commissioner before the bridge

No money for Cherry South Bridge and development of Polson years off, best to do Commissioner at this time so say TO and Waterfront Toronto.

Cost of Union still going up by delaying this project

Design at 30%
 

felix123

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Word is (others have more info), a test bed is to be setup on Cherry St ROW to tryout grass for QQE and Portland. Long over due and need to look at QQW as well.

QQE will go south on the New Cherry St and turn east on Commissioner St To a loop north of Commissioner before the bridge

No money for Cherry South Bridge and development of Polson years off, best to do Commissioner at this time so say TO and Waterfront Toronto.

Cost of Union still going up by delaying this project

Design at 30%
Thanks for the update. Design at 30% after more than a decade. See you all in 2289 for the grand opening!
 

DSC

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Word is (others have more info), a test bed is to be setup on Cherry St ROW to tryout grass for QQE and Portland. Long over due and need to look at QQW as well.

QQE will go south on the New Cherry St and turn east on Commissioner St To a loop north of Commissioner before the bridge

No money for Cherry South Bridge and development of Polson years off, best to do Commissioner at this time so say TO and Waterfront Toronto.

Cost of Union still going up by delaying this project

Design at 30%
This is generally correct, more info will be distributed very soon - there were a couple of advisory group meetings earlier in the week. It is also suggested that the Cherry St line should go south of the current loop and connect with QQE.
 

Jeff Morgan

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This is generally correct, more info will be distributed very soon - there were a couple of advisory group meetings earlier in the week. It is also suggested that the Cherry St line should go south of the current loop and connect with QQE.

@DSC was more info released? I haven't seen any new information for a while.
 

drum118

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With this talk about a bridge for the Eastern Gap, they need to think on how you plan to get ppl to it other than the car. The 30 minute bus service will not cut it for Cherry Beach.

If you going to put a bridge there, then the Cherry St LRT needs to be in place with a lift bridge over the shipping channel and a loop at the foot of the bridge before it opens.

Need to put in the missing South Cherry LRT bridge as well and do away with the plan loop.
 

DSC

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With this talk about a bridge for the Eastern Gap, they need to think on how you plan to get ppl to it other than the car. The 30 minute bus service will not cut it for Cherry Beach.

If you going to put a bridge there, then the Cherry St LRT needs to be in place with a lift bridge over the shipping channel and a loop at the foot of the bridge before it opens.

Need to put in the missing South Cherry LRT bridge as well and do away with the plan loop.
Let's not send this thread into fantasy land, please. We live in a City where we have been talking of the Queens Quay East LRT since about 2007 - THIS thread started in 2007 and I think there were meetings I went to in at least 2006. See: https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threads/queens-quay-lrt-brt-pic-march-28.2973/

Though an extension of the QQE LRT to the 'proposed' bridge to the island is certainly reasonable, the bridge will not be be built for decades (if ever). Let's keep THIS thread focused on Waterfront Transit Reset Phase 1.
 

drum118

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Let's not send this thread into fantasy land, please. We live in a City where we have been talking of the Queens Quay East LRT since about 2007 - THIS thread started in 2007 and I think there were meetings I went to in at least 2006. See: https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threads/queens-quay-lrt-brt-pic-march-28.2973/

Though an extension of the QQE LRT to the 'proposed' bridge to the island is certainly reasonable, the bridge will not be be built for decades (if ever). Let's keep THIS thread focused on Waterfront Transit Reset Phase 1.
I guess the bridge is fantasy land as it been around long before 2004 when transit planning took place for the Waterfront. Been waiting for QQE, let along to the shipping channel route since 2008 considering phase 1 of QQE was approved in 2010.

Even doing any extension is still in fantasy land.
 

EnviroTO

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If the Waterfront East LRT stops at Polson that seems like more than far enough for now. I would walk from there to Cherry Beach. There just isn't enough south of the ship channel to justify the expense of a lift bridge for transit nor all the seats on a streetcar. North of the ship channel is where all the development will be for the next 20 years.
 

DSC

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If the Waterfront East LRT stops at Polson that seems like more than far enough for now. I would walk from there to Cherry Beach. There just isn't enough south of the ship channel to justify the expense of a lift bridge for transit nor all the seats on a streetcar. North of the ship channel is where all the development will be for the next 20 years.
That is exactly why there is no serious talk of going south of the Ship Channel (at least in the foreseeable future) and also why the current discussions are of 'only' bringing the QQ LRT south to Commissioners Street - which avoids a crossing of the new Don River.
 

AlvinofDiaspar

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That is exactly why there is no serious talk of going south of the Ship Channel (at least in the foreseeable future) and also why the current discussions are of 'only' bringing the QQ LRT south to Commissioners Street - which avoids a crossing of the new Don River.

Plus the Portlands plans see to it that it will remain industrial in the foreseeable future. Can a case be made to extend the line further? Yes - especially if there is a serious attempt to build a bridge over the Eastern Gap (even then you have to wonder how much of a draw that would be), but it's all hypothetical at this point. It's like we're worrying about the plans when we can't even get what's truly needed off the ground.

AoD
 
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EnviroTO

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I thought that after deciding that the loop would be removed in the distillery district that the loop was moving to Polson, across the new river mouth. Has new material been presented with other loop locations? Other loops would occupy more immediately developable land or park space.

210621_slide57_polsonroutephase1.jpg
 

DSC

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The most recent discussions see the QQE LRT line linking to an extension of the Cherry Street line that would go under and just south of the rail berm and then this 'merged line would go south to Commissioners with a (temporary) loop just east of Cherry Street serving both QQE and Cherry. (The current Cherry loop will go as it would block a link under the berm due to height limitations.)

This will allow for the line to (eventually) continue along Commissioners and end at the Leslie St Barns and give the TTC a (much needed) additional link for the barns to the rest of the TTC system. There will be a public presentation on this 'plan' in October, or so I have been told. A loop at Polson (south of the new Don is certainly not rejected, it will just (probably) not happen for quite a while.
 

Rainforest

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With the municipal elections over - feel that the accumulated Eglinton East LRT surtax should be redirected to build Waterfront East LRT.

Eglinton East LRT is in limbo, anyway. With the $3B+ price tag, the city on its own will not fund that project. There is no provincial or federal contributions in sight till at least 2025/2026, and perhaps longer. Meanwhile, the funds already collected are probably sitting in a low-interest saving account, and gradually losing their purchasing power as the inflation exceeds the interest.

Waterfront East LRT is cheaper than Eglinton East LRT, and the city should be able to afford it. If I am not mistaken, ~ 1.2B has been collected. Perhaps not enough to fund the whole desired Lower Don Lands streetcar system, but at the very least should be enough to rebuild/expand the Union loop and build streetcar tracks on Queens Quay.

Once that segment is done, further expansions to the Commissioners, Leslie etc can be funded incrementally.
 

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