Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

[Streety McCarface]

Rain isn't really an issue for the SRT. The problem is ice, which Vancouver isn't really prone to (they never get more than a few days a month with a high temperature below zero). It's been a problem since the SRT first opened, and newer ICTS systems in places with cold winters (namely, the JFK AirTrain) have heated rails to avoid this problem.

I'm wondering if large heat coils (resistors) could be installed to mitigate delays during winter months. However, it'd sure as hell use a lot more electricity for such a small line.

 

[DSC]

Star's opinion!

 

[Rainforest]

Isn't there a separate thread for circular arguments?

Sure, there is a separate "Debate on the merits" thread.

But the haters do not want to post there, they are trying to poison this thread that is supposed to be about the technical solutions.

 

[Rainforest]

The rt works fine in vancouver. Toronto neglected it. And now we are here.

That's true, but there are two differences between their situation and ours. 1) The Vancouver system was built later than SRT, and some of the teething pains were addressed. 2) In Vancouver, Skytrain goes right through the downtown, while SRT connects to a terminal station at the edge of the "main" subway system.

 

[JSF-1]

The skytrain wasn't built all that long after actually. The first line of the Skytrain opened only 9 months after the SRT did. The SRT opened on March 22 1985, while the SkyTrains Expo line opened December 11 1985. In fact the ICTS trains in Vancouver actually pre-date the SRT by 2 years since a demonstration track was constructed in 1983 that carried passengers between two stops.

 

[Cobra]

Neglect got us here which in turn cause most of Scarborough to lose trust in the TTC and city hall.

So you can understand how they felt when they were being pitch a new technology a second time after the RT failure/neglect.

The Miller/Giambrone gang did a poor job at building that trust back...meaning there wasn't much listening going on.

 

[Streety McCarface]

Although we still don't have ridership numbers:

(Start at 7:30)

(start at 6:10)
(These aren't my videos. Hopefully Transmania won't hate me for this : P)

However, based on ridership levels in these videos, ridership on the Sheppard line seems to have improved drastically over the past few years. I really think an extension would make a lot more sense than the current SSE alignment.

 

[Avenue]

Why is there still sparsely placed singe family housing right on Sheppard itself and all around the Bessarion (as well as Bayview) station? Is it the zoning restrictions? Why is the area not getting all intensified?

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Rain isn't really an issue for the SRT. The problem is ice, which Vancouver isn't really prone to (they never get more than a few days a month with a high temperature below zero). It's been a problem since the SRT first opened, and newer ICTS systems in places with cold winters (namely, the JFK AirTrain) have heated rails to avoid this problem.

A heating system would cost less then LRT or a subway.

That's true, but there are two differences between their situation and ours. 1) The Vancouver system was built later than SRT, and some of the teething pains were addressed. 2) In Vancouver, Skytrain goes right through the downtown, while SRT connects to a terminal station at the edge of the "main" subway system.

But it speaks to how ill prepared the TTC and Ontario was and is today.

Why is there still sparsely placed singe family housing right on Sheppard itself and all around the Bessarion (as well as Bayview) station? Is it the zoning restrictions? Why is the area not getting all intensified?

When sheppard east does get completed, that whole area will be rezoned. And those residents forced out to Pickering, Oshawa and Barrie. That's how it usually works when these subways are built.

 

[Streety McCarface]

Why is there still sparsely placed singe family housing right on Sheppard itself and all around the Bessarion (as well as Bayview) station? Is it the zoning restrictions? Why is the area not getting all intensified?

Unfortunately, that is the case. What intrigues me is that this subway extension that's currently proposed might only have 1 stop because they don't want to rezone the corridor in between, as it would severely anger residents.

 

[BurlOak]

Unfortunately, that is the case. What intrigues me is that this subway extension that's currently proposed might only have 1 stop because they don't want to rezone the corridor in between, as it would severely anger residents.

Maybe the McCowan route is not the best for redevelopment.
SRT was likely a better route for re-development.

That's true, but there are two differences between their situation and ours. 1) The Vancouver system was built later than SRT, and some of the teething pains were addressed. 2) In Vancouver, Skytrain goes right through the downtown, while SRT connects to a terminal station at the edge of the "main" subway system.

Instead of the transfer LRT, they could have extended the SRT all the way downtown (through the Gatineau hydro corridor and Don Valley). They could have also have SkyTrain along Finch hydro corridor and from Kipling to Pearson. SRT and SkyTrain became obsolete because that's what the TTC wanted (inadvertently or not).

 

[sixrings]

I thought only LRTS and transfers severely angered scarborough residents.

Unfortunately, that is the case. What intrigues me is that this subway extension that's currently proposed might only have 1 stop because they don't want to rezone the corridor in between, as it would severely anger residents.

 

[Streety McCarface]

Maybe the McCowan route is not the best for redevelopment.
SRT was likely a better route for re-development.

If that were the case, it would have been redeveloped when the line opened 40 years ago. Make no mistake, building next to an active freight railroad is not very appealing

I thought only LRTS and transfers severely angered scarborough residents.

Those that don't live along the corridor's extraction sites, yes. However, this is democracy we're talking about and everyone has a say.

 

[JSF-1]

Well BurlOak is correct. McCowan is not the best for redevelopment. Hell it has no redevelopment possibilities at all outside of the Town Centre. Unless City Hall plans a complete upheaval of the Zoning by-laws in Scarborough (as it should do), every alignment outside of the SRT alignment limits development to the STC.

 

[11th]

Why is there still sparsely placed singe family housing right on Sheppard itself and all around the Bessarion (as well as Bayview) station? Is it the zoning restrictions? Why is the area not getting all intensified?

Those single family housing are now mid-rise condos, or in the process of being purchased and turned into such. That's the case for the Bayview to Leslie stretch. Can't do much for Yonge to Bayview unless they build the Willowdale station (a must, as the road network is already maxed out), raze the whole block and build a collector road parallel to Sheppard (a road connecting the 401W off-ramp at Bayview to Avondale).