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TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

Something to consider is that the TTC would've had to pay an extra 8% (customs tariffs for streetcars and LRT vehicles) if they were built in Germany.

well considering that I'd be getting a better guarantee of a better product overall I'll gladly pay that extra. The extra couldve been worked into the deal. Then again 20/20 hindsight is a beautiful thing
 
Something to consider is that the TTC would've had to pay an extra 8% (customs tariffs for streetcars and LRT vehicles) if they were built in Germany.

So, one level of government charges 8% on top of of what another level of government is spending. That gives them money to hand out to local transit projects.

I'm looking for the downside ;-)

- Paul
 
So, one level of government charges 8% on top of of what another level of government is spending. That gives them money to hand out to local transit projects.

I'm looking for the downside ;-)

- Paul
Indeed. The money never leaves the governmental coffers, so any tariffs are irrelevant. However getting a lower price or earlier/on-time delivery are real potential benefits.
 
Indeed. The money never leaves the governmental coffers, so any tariffs are irrelevant. However getting a lower price or earlier/on-time delivery are real potential benefits.
Wasn't BBD the lowest bid? If I am recalling that correctly, then adding 8% to their bid would not have produced a lower bid....would it?
 
Something to consider is that the TTC would've had to pay an extra 8% (customs tariffs for streetcars and LRT vehicles) if they were built in Germany.

We could have the same scenario as with Bombardier's Mexican plant with the components coming from Germany and being assembled here. I doubt we'd have had the same quality issues.
 
Don't know if 4425 got out last night for runs, but it was still in the service bay before I call it a night and still there as I type this.

BBD is down 8 weeks to get the remaining 6 cars here and have them in service by year end.

By right, 4402 should be at the gate for pickup on Friday, but don't expect it happening like getting all 6 cars here by Dec 14.
 
Don't know if 4425 got out last night for runs, but it was still in the service bay before I call it a night and still there as I type this.

BBD is down 8 weeks to get the remaining 6 cars here and have them in service by year end.

By right, 4402 should be at the gate for pickup on Friday, but don't expect it happening like getting all 6 cars here by Dec 14.

How do you track 4425 other than to use nextbus?
My source at Thunder Bay is away for two weeks, so I cannot provide photos til he comes back. If 4402 is shipped, I would like to document in my GO Transit column for Canadian Railway Observations
 
well considering that I'd be getting a better guarantee of a better product overall I'll gladly pay that extra. The extra couldve been worked into the deal. Then again 20/20 hindsight is a beautiful thing

A fully manufactured vehicle outside Canada would never make it past city hall, especially in Miller's era. Miller had to beg to get this order in and even hosted a meeting at MTCC while workers were on strike at city hall. It was the best they could get at that time which unfortunately end up in a giant rolling snowball mess. TO still ended up footing 2/3 of the $1.25B and I don't think we could afford an even more expensive option at that time and even now. I don't even think TTC want to reopen this topic and retender for another shit show at city hall. This city doesn't need to spend another dime for the same streetcars when there's billions of dollar backlogs for other transit projects.
 
Don't know if 4425 got out last night for runs, but it was still in the service bay before I call it a night and still there as I type this.

BBD is down 8 weeks to get the remaining 6 cars here and have them in service by year end.

By right, 4402 should be at the gate for pickup on Friday, but don't expect it happening like getting all 6 cars here by Dec 14.
Still a short time frame but wasn't the commitment to have them delivered by year end not necessarily in service.
 
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4423 was out running up and down Kingston Road tonight signed Training Car. Nice to see a Flexity on Kingston Road even though it'll be years before 502/503 is converted over. I would guess they were using Kingston Road rather than the usual run out to Neville since they've torn it up down there to do track replacement.
 
May've asked this before, though not sure if it was answered. Is there a general consensus on the pphpd capacity of the Outlook on, say, a route like 510. So that'd be with in-median operation and some small grade-separated portions. Now I know there's theoretical capacity under perfect conditions, and that the Outlook can carry ~250 riders. But I mean more like a ballpark estimate for day-to-day operations in peak conditions. Is this in the range of 5-7k passengers per hour per direction? Higher? Lower?
 
The 510 had a capacity of 1250 pphpd with the CLRV. Capacity will be 3120 pphpd with the LFLRV, operating at current headways. Max capacity of the LFLRV is 3900, on the King Line

http://www.ttc.ca/PDF/About_the_TTC/DRTES_Final_Report_-_September_2012.pdf (page 18)

For 5 to 7k pphpd, you'd need coupled trains, which the LFLRV is not capable. Our Flexity Freedom LRVs can be coupled, and those will offer capacity of 15,000 pphpd on the surface, at 90 second headways with three car trainsets.
 
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How do you track 4425 other than to use nextbus?
You can just use nextbus - http://webservices.nextbus.com/service/publicXMLFeed?command=vehicleLocation&a=ttc&v=4425

Drop the co-ordinates into Google maps to see where it is.

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The 510 had a capacity of 1250 pphpd with the CLRV. Capacity will be 3120 pphpd with the LFLRV, operating at current headways. Max capacity of the LFLRV is 3900, on the King Line

http://www.ttc.ca/PDF/About_the_TTC/DRTES_Final_Report_-_September_2012.pdf (page 18)

This footnote is the important piece:
"The capacity for the new LRVs with 3 minute headway is based on a 130 passengers per vehicle crowding standard"

130 usable capacity is well below the 250 quoted capacity.

That said, King is handling 55k passengers per day with a 1350pphpd capacity. So, a 2600 capacity (new cars, 3 minute frequencies) is 100k trips per day; about 1/5th of Bloor/Danforths passenger load at the time this document was published.
 
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