Yonge Sheppard Centre Renovations and Expansion | 123m | 35s | RioCan | Quadrangle

Pips

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Thank you Waterloowarrior for posting the application. I live at 2 Forest Laneway and am not sure whether to be pleased or upset by this.

I cannot tell from plans whether to interior walkways from the apartments to the mall will remain, but it looks as if the new condo will encroach over our inside connection. If I enlarge the plan the wording becomes illegible.

On another note, the 3 apartment towers are protected by a previous severance, but what could Riocan do if they were to repurchase those buildings?

I'm very interested in anyone's thoughts on this proposal.
 

Coltaine79

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I may be shunned for this but I would like to see the demographics/races/cultures expand. I would like to see more of a mix than a mix of Korean, Chinese and Iranians. Having a diverse community would attract better commercial tenants.
That's a great point, and there's no reason to shun you for saying that (sorry for my late joining to this thread).

I'm not a member of either of those 3 ethnicities you posted, and I've lived here for 4 years; and working in the area since 2006. One thing I've liked about the area is that I've never felt uncomfortable anywhere around here, despite being a member of an under-represented minority group. You can't necessarily say that about all of the neighborhoods in the GTA.

Too early for me to pass opinion about the Sheppard Centre reno, although I will at some point (I worked in that building for 6 years, so it's the source of many a memory. Definitely remember the Keg in the moat, but never had a meal or drink there!). I will say that I'm greatly looking forward to the various condos under construction (Menkes Gibson, Hullmark, and Emerald) as well as the Whole Foods (NOM!). Perhaps the additional population from those 6 buildings will give the area the boost it needs in terms of ethnic diversity as well as the "busy-ness" to attract more interesting retails shops/restos.

I'm vegetarian so I've never been to Owl of Minerva, BUT Nawab is supposed to make half-decent Indian food (4/5 on Yelp) and I personally know the crepes/desserts at Pastel Creperie are excellent.
 

sunnyraytoronto

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Those 6 condo towers (Menkes GibsonSquare, Tridel HullmarkCentre, and EmeraldPark) will NOT make the area more diverse ethnically,... it will solidify the mix previously mentioned,.... these groups were strongly marketed to during the sales of these condo units. The mix previously mentioned are more strongly represented in the condo towers than the single residential houses,... and as North York Centre gets more condos (already 60% condo residents) the previously mentioned mix will be more strongly represented.

Thus, bring on the ethnic malls,.... EmeraldPark was supposed to be Chinese mall (T&T bailed),.... Centrium was supposed to be Korean mall (cancelled),... first mall in North York Centre (new or existing) to go ethnic will be a real game changer.
 

Coltaine79

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Those 6 condo towers (Menkes GibsonSquare, Tridel HullmarkCentre, and EmeraldPark) will NOT make the area more diverse ethnically,... it will solidify the mix previously mentioned,.... these groups were strongly marketed to during the sales of these condo units. The mix previously mentioned are more strongly represented in the condo towers than the single residential houses,... and as North York Centre gets more condos (already 60% condo residents) the previously mentioned mix will be more strongly represented.

Thus, bring on the ethnic malls,.... EmeraldPark was supposed to be Chinese mall (T&T bailed),.... Centrium was supposed to be Korean mall (cancelled),... first mall in North York Centre (new or existing) to go ethnic will be a real game changer.
Be that as it may, I haven't felt uncomfortable in NYCC at any point in the last 7 years, so I don't think it'll start to happen now. Keep in mind that during Mon-Fri, 8am to 6pm, it's VERY diverse due to all the employers in this area.

An uncomfortably "mono-cultural" area would be parts of Scarborough or most of Brampton. Residential-only (no real businesses) and dominated by one or two ethnicities at any time during the week.
 

NorthYorkEd

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... these groups were strongly marketed to during the sales of these condo units. The mix previously mentioned are more strongly represented in the condo towers than the single residential houses,... and as North York Centre gets more condos (already 60% condo residents) the previously mentioned mix will be more strongly represented....
They are getting even more blatant with the marketing towards certain demographics. I'm thinking of the "88% SOLD!" banner for FLO condos (near Avondale area) and the aptly named, but perhaps a bit slyly, "88 Condos" project at 88 Sheppard. No doubt they are actively pursuing a certain buyer, which makes me wonder about whether or not we should make a long-term investment in this area when (or if) we decide to purchase a property.

Be that as it may, I haven't felt uncomfortable in NYCC at any point in the last 7 years, so I don't think it'll start to happen now. Keep in mind that during Mon-Fri, 8am to 6pm, it's VERY diverse due to all the employers in this area.
We've been here for a year, and I tend to agree. While we enjoy the diversity and a "healthy" representation of certain groups, we don't always sense the feeling is mutual. Gets pretty "chilly" sometimes in the elevators and hallways of my building, and in the local eateries and such. It's too bad, this could be an awesome community if everyone would relax a bit and smile. It often feels like there are several groups orbiting the same circles, but rarely connecting.

And for the love of all things holy, Sheppard Center needs a makeover stat. Even where I come from, backwater Nova Scotia, our malls are kept up-to-date with reasonably modern aesthetics. SC is one of those malls that you can't wait to get out of; it slowly drains you of any optimism, hope, or will to live.
 

investican

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I will agree which is a plus, that i've never felt uncomfortable in NYCC. I too am an NYCC Minority. I built a single family home in NYCC and lived there for a couple years, the demographics are pretty much the same as the condos. I have enjoyed establishments and restaurants from all demographics present in the area but it's still missing something core. If you look at Yonge/Eglinton, you have the same 3 demographics + all others and seem more in balance and harmony. My biggest pet peeve would have to be the 300 sqft shoe box retail along yonge that are all dry cleaners and/or cafe's that have annual turnover of tenants/owners. I understand a lot of the aforementioned new immigrants are looking to open businesses in the area and that's who it was marketed to but better opportunities are desperately needed. Jack Astor's has been a good addition and place is very busy.

I'm not sure if it's just me but Empress has those decent tenants + a theatre but something still seems to be missing there.

Also, There needs to be a Timmies between Wedgewood and Mel Lastman Square along Yonge.
 

NorthYorkEd

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If you look at Yonge/Eglinton, you have the same 3 demographics + all others and seem more in balance and harmony.
I agree. Y/E definitely feels more mature and settled, while NYCC still has a blend of old and new that makes it feel a bit "lost". We like the stretch from 401 to Finch, but once you get a few blocks north towards Steeles, the entire stretch looks like some bombed out hellhole of neglected strip malls and rough-looking apartments. I almost want to wear a hazmat suit when driving through it. And the residential spreads to the east and west are quiet enough, but poorly lit at night, and are a hodgepodge of new crammed-in mega-builds and rundown dumpy looking places.

Jack Astor's has been a good addition and place is very busy.
The neighborhood is starving for a cozy, neighborhood pub, and for now it has fit that bill with the rooftop patio. Although the service is somewhat lacking (we've been three times; first was great, second was going good until we got our meals and our server abandoned us, and the third time we never even got served and ended up leaving.) I'm hoping the announced "3 Brewers" will also warm things up a bit.

I'm not sure if it's just me but Empress has those decent tenants + a theatre but something still seems to be missing there.
I recall sunnyraytoronto mentioning that Staples used to be a Chapters. I wish they would go back to that. Maybe they were just ahead of their time, or maybe the entire Chapters retail future is doomed. Some type of place where people can browse, mingle, and enjoy a beverage. Staples is just so sterile and cold. They should downsize to an express-type model for quick supplies, but I assume they are there to mostly serve the local corporate offices. There also needs to be more bench seating in the mall so folks can hang out and people watch. I don't think there's any seating at all on the second retail level.

Also, There needs to be a Timmies between Wedgewood and Mel Lastman Square along Yonge.
How about a McCafe? :)

My hope for the Sheppard Center renovation is that it adds more high-quality retail, becomes a classier place you don't mind strolling into, and jumpstarts a spit shine and polish for many of the other old retail strips in the near vicinity, such as the piles of decaying garbage at Yonge and Florentine, Johnston Ave, etc. And by "spit shine and polish" I mean a bulldozer and demolition crew.
 

investican

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I agree. Y/E definitely feels more mature and settled, while NYCC still has a blend of old and new that makes it feel a bit "lost". We like the stretch from 401 to Finch, but once you get a few blocks north towards Steeles, the entire stretch looks like some bombed out hellhole of neglected strip malls and rough-looking apartments. I almost want to wear a hazmat suit when driving through it. And the residential spreads to the east and west are quiet enough, but poorly lit at night, and are a hodgepodge of new crammed-in mega-builds and rundown dumpy looking places.



The neighborhood is starving for a cozy, neighborhood pub, and for now it has fit that bill with the rooftop patio. Although the service is somewhat lacking (we've been three times; first was great, second was going good until we got our meals and our server abandoned us, and the third time we never even got served and ended up leaving.) I'm hoping the announced "3 Brewers" will also warm things up a bit.



I recall sunnyraytoronto mentioning that Staples used to be a Chapters. I wish they would go back to that. Maybe they were just ahead of their time, or maybe the entire Chapters retail future is doomed. Some type of place where people can browse, mingle, and enjoy a beverage. Staples is just so sterile and cold. They should downsize to an express-type model for quick supplies, but I assume they are there to mostly serve the local corporate offices. There also needs to be more bench seating in the mall so folks can hang out and people watch. I don't think there's any seating at all on the second retail level.



How about a McCafe? :)

My hope for the Sheppard Center renovation is that it adds more high-quality retail, becomes a classier place you don't mind strolling into, and jumpstarts a spit shine and polish for many of the other old retail strips in the near vicinity, such as the piles of decaying garbage at Yonge and Florentine, Johnston Ave, etc. And by "spit shine and polish" I mean a bulldozer and demolition crew.

North of Finch, it reminds me sort of LA with the plaza with 4587517216 crammed signs in Farsi and Korean. Couple good food places in there but until someone buys the 37.5 Acres where Centerpoint and the neighboring properties on Moore Park when Beecroft goes through for a mega development, it will very much stay that way (also plenty of immigrants have extremely overpaid for property on Yonge and they will need everything else developed for them to get a return).

Finch Ave W needs a lot more mixed-use not just condo/townhomes and Drewry/Cummer need some more infill townhome sites. Finch and North is extreme infancy stage. Also Hopefully, Newtonbrook Plaza Redevelopment will materialize relatively soon.

But my Favorite is the old Jewellery store at Yonge/Otonabee which is now a Chinese Nightclub called "MINT" AND a Lawyers office.

I've been to that Jack Astor's 3 times aswell. It was packed. Rooftop Patio full and had horrible service from some very rude waitresses. The Jack Astors on Don Mills is my favorite.

The stretch on Yonge on the west side just north of 401 has been recently purchased by new immigrants who have overpaid significantly on those sites + you have environmental and assembly concerns with the gas stations. These properties are very close to dense single family homes so I wouldn't expect high density which means it will be even longer for it is feasible for the new owners to sell or develop.

There are 3 McCafe's very close here at Yonge Sheppard, Bathurst Steeles and Hilda/Steeles so It will take a lot longer I think for another to show up but either that or Timmies to show up at Yonge/Finch


Also the Chapters at Yonge/Steeles closed 2-3 years ago, which is now a 24 hour Korean Supermarket. A chapters/Indigo is much preferred over a Staples--in any location
 
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investican

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Kinda offtopic, but I don't know if still there but from atleast 2-4 Years ago I remember seeing 15 Cars in the underground Parking at SC that seemed abandoned there for YEARS, covered in dust, filled with garbage bags and no license plates.
 

fiendishlibrarian

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Kinda offtopic, but I don't know if still there but from atleast 2-4 Years ago I remember seeing 15 Cars in the underground Parking at SC that seemed abandoned there for YEARS, covered in dust, filled with garbage bags and no license plates.
I remember that when I lived there. One was a huge, '73 or '74 pastel blue Cadillac Eldorado. Wonder if it's still there.

Edit: in terms of the pubs, the Firkin's remodel has really helped it, and cleared away some of the riff-raff. Boston Pizza is unbearable, and as mentioned that place that closed on Sheppard always seemed like a front to me. And incidentally the "coldness" referred to earlier won't change anytime soon as many of the tenants of those condos are overseas students with zero interest in the long-term development of the area. Similar phenomenon is happening along the condo corridor along Bay Street.
 
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Coltaine79

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The neighborhood is starving for a cozy, neighborhood pub, and for now it has fit that bill with the rooftop patio. Although the service is somewhat lacking (we've been three times; first was great, second was going good until we got our meals and our server abandoned us, and the third time we never even got served and ended up leaving.) I'm hoping the announced "3 Brewers" will also warm things up a bit.
err, i guess you are a new addition to the area so you missed the fact that we used to have 4 decent pubs! all within 200 metres of the Yonge/Sheppard intersection!

- Smokey Joe's -- the BEST summer-time patio, better than that chain restaurant (Jack Astor's) by far
- The Black Sheep -- I never went there, but one of my co-workers was a borderline alcoholic who loved it
- Stoney's -- not for me, but others liked it
- The Frog and Firkin pub -- the only one (in this list) still in existence! and it is still half-decent.


Also, UT just posted an article about the proposed Sheppard Centre reno, it sounds pretty good.
 

Coltaine79

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I remember that when I lived there. One was a huge, '73 or '74 pastel blue Cadillac Eldorado. Wonder if it's still there.
OMG I remember that! It was on P3 right (lowest parking level)? And nobody ever parked near it... in case it blew up or something... hahaha

I wonder if Rambo is still on P3. the car wash guy. he used to give me good deals on cleaning my car while i was at work.
 

maestro

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I remember living in an apartment building with the entire lower level full of old cars. Several years later, the new owners finally pulled them all out with a fleet of tow trucks. The building was full of seniors. One imagine the cars belonged to those that took their last drive in an ambulance.
 

investican

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OMG I remember that! It was on P3 right (lowest parking level)? And nobody ever parked near it... in case it blew up or something... hahaha

I wonder if Rambo is still on P3. the car wash guy. he used to give me good deals on cleaning my car while i was at work.
I don't know if it's the same guy but a guy who I saw clean cars in P3 all the time, cleaned my car without asking me when I was in the offices upstairs...He did a good job too.
 

NorthYorkEd

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err, i guess you are a new addition to the area so you missed the fact that we used to have 4 decent pubs! all within 200 metres of the Yonge/Sheppard intersection!

- Smokey Joe's -- the BEST summer-time patio, better than that chain restaurant (Jack Astor's) by far
- The Black Sheep -- I never went there, but one of my co-workers was a borderline alcoholic who loved it
- Stoney's -- not for me, but others liked it
- The Frog and Firkin pub -- the only one (in this list) still in existence! and it is still half-decent.


Also, UT just posted an article about the proposed Sheppard Centre reno, it sounds pretty good.
Yup, been here about a year now. Love the convenience and location, but not a lot of "community" feel. At least not yet.

I think Smokey Joe's has been renovated into a new restaurant/club ("Estrella"?). Always looked like a rough crowd around there until they closed up shop for renos.

Haven't been to the Frog, so can't comment.
 

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