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Ontario Line (was Relief Line South, in Design) | ?m | ?s

smallspy

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not necesserily. It really depends on how steep it is. A bigger concern is if they leave in a 100m long piece of track to have a straight enough platform.
Platforms don't have to be perfectly flat, but they need to at least be somewhat flat: +/- 0.3%.

The grade in that area is something like 4%. Thus you need to have a vertical transition curve from the steeper grade to the section of flat, and another vertical curve back to the grade. This means that the portal will actually get pushed out something like 2 or more platform lengths from its currently projected location. I haven't done any measurements, but this might actually put it so far east to be too low to cross the Don River.

Dan
 

TransitBart

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Yes, so this is the rendering released for Queen station that shows a super deep station box for the OL line at Queen. Meaning there's going to be 4 flights of stairs between the 2 lines.

View attachment 398641
It's striking and exciting to look at this and see the change in standards, scale, imagination from the original Queen station box to the new Ontario line. Seventy years has brought a lot of change.

Three thoughts:

1. You have to walk half a train length back from the Line 1 train to get to the first escalators down.
2. Are there two mezzanines - an upper and a lower? Clearly a large one above the Ontario Line platform level. At the top of the large escalator runs is that another mezzanine running the length of the platform below?
3. What is the large white box in the centre? Unexcavated ground, right?
 

EddyMCD

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Does the line actually need to be this deep? The travel times from the surface will be atrocious. Will make short streetcar trips more attractive than using the OL for some trips.
 

nfitz

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Does the line actually need to be this deep? The travel times from the surface will be atrocious. Will make short streetcar trips more attractive than using the OL for some trips.
No - but it's cheaper and faster than dealing with all the utilities under the streets.

On the other hand, because they have chosen to go so deep, it does given them flexibilities to put much shallower curves downtown, under buildings - which lets them claim that it need to be so deep because of the buildings.

But look at the Line 2 extension in Scarborough, which is as deep (if not deeper), but is entirely staying in the road-right of way south of Ellesmere.
 

leopetr

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Atrocious I tell ya!

Hahaha.

I love the outrage at having to go dow a few more escalator steps.

Oh the humanity!

I've spent decades reading threads on this forum about how Kennedy station is bad because people have to take several escalators to get from SRT to the Bloor-Danforth subway. People hated those escalators so much they got the province to spend many billions to extend the subway. Escalator loathing isn't new
 

44 North

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Here's an interesting one for legalese people. I get obtaining subsurface property rights form a single owner when tunneling below a residence. But how does that work with a multi-unit building with individual owners (i.e. a condo). Seems like a new one for this city.
 

EnviroTO

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I would imagine it would go through the condo board and would be handled like any other common area expense / asset. The portion attributed to each condo would be based on the same ratio used to determine the condo fees. The question in any particular condo would be whether or not to pay any money collected out, or to put in into the capital reserve fund or to use it to reduce fees.

I'm more curious what value is being set as a market rate for subsurface property rights. Maybe the Boring Company could solve the housing crisis.
 

innsertnamehere

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Here's an interesting one for legalese people. I get obtaining subsurface property rights form a single owner when tunneling below a residence. But how does that work with a multi-unit building with individual owners (i.e. a condo). Seems like a new one for this city
A condo corporation is essentially a single landowner which owners hold shares of. Those shares give them exclusive right to their units, and partial ownership of common area (like hallways, or, say, subsurface property rights).

So for the gov, they would just expropriate from the condo corporation like they are a single landowner, and the funds would be proportionately be distributed between condo shareholders.

That’s my understanding at least.
 

smallspy

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Here's an interesting one for legalese people. I get obtaining subsurface property rights form a single owner when tunneling below a residence. But how does that work with a multi-unit building with individual owners (i.e. a condo). Seems like a new one for this city.
Look into the history of the TYSSE. It's already happened.

Dan
 

nfitz

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If there's a cheaper way to build the Queen St. Station at a shallower depth, the private sector will find it.
Only within the limitations of their contract. If they can't move the tunnels horizontally, or change a creek crossing to ground surface from 50-metres deep - then it won't find the cheapest way.
 

EddyMCD

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The time from grade to track level will influence riders in different ways. A commuter riding the whole line won't really care. But if you need to take a quick trip for a few stops, if it takes you 3-5 minutes to get from grade-track on both ends, you may use another mode of transportation.
 

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