mdrejhon
Senior Member
Certain well-known NOLRT people — some of whom rarely rides a bus — do that to us a lot.
Hamilton Hamilton Line B LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx
- Thread starter Kiwi
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Rainforest
Senior Member
I'm not sure Ottawa is a good example of bus-to-LRT conversion. They had to put the central section of LRT in a tunnel, because they never had a suitable surface bus corridor through the city core. My interpretation of their troubles is that Ottawa transit authorities have no experience running underground transit. Once they learn how to do that, they will be fine.
In case of Hamilton, it should be possible to build surface bus lanes in a manner compatible with the future surface LRT. If so, the conversion can be smooth.
Streety McCarface
Senior Member
Even then, you're not going to get much out of converting a busway into surface LRT, especially surface LRT that doesn't have guaranteed signal priority. The capacity gains would be far too low to really justify the high cost of doing it. Ottawa is evidence of this.
ShonTron
Moderator
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Ottawa will do a lot better once the extensions are in place, especially with the transfers at Tunney's Pasture and Blair. It will speed up a lot of commutes. Hurdman badly needs to be rebuilt for better rail-bus connections.
Rainforest
Senior Member
Not sure I understand.
1. The primary reason for Ottawa's conversion is that they had to fix the central on-street Transitway section. Slater and Albert streets weren't suitable anymore for the volume. The LRT tunnel should improve the reliability and speed big time. The capacity increase is an added benefit, but probably not the main motivation in Ottawa's case.
2. For a surface bus lanes to surface LRT converion, the speed and reliability shouldn't change at all (unless a better signal priority is added), but the capacity should increase substantially. Thus if the bus system is at capacity, then I'd think the cost of conversion can be justified.
micheal_can
Senior Member
Actually, it is the best example for exactly the problems everyone will say. BRT does not make sense in modern cities. The ones in Winnipeg, York Region and Mississauga are all going to face a crunch where they will need to convert it to some sort of RT.
The construction of Line 1's extension to Vaughan was to replace Toronto's busways to York U.
mdrejhon
Senior Member
There is a place for good BRTs.
A-Line is a more appropriate place for a good BRT.
However, there's something called BRT creep.
Do not let this happen to Hamilton.
![IODl4KP[1].png](https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/attachments/iodl4kp-1-png.223578/ "IODl4KP[1].png")
![UXNZgUM[1].png](https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/attachments/uxnzgum-1-png.223579/ "UXNZgUM[1].png")
A-Line is a more appropriate place for a good BRT.
However, there's something called BRT creep.
Do not let this happen to Hamilton.
micheal_can
Senior Member
For those that want to understand the difference between BRT and BRT creep, think of it this way, if others cannot tell it is more than just a bus route, then it is not a BRT.
Hopkins123
Senior Member
You do understand that BRT can be upgradable to LRT , just like Ottawa's BRT network gradually being converted to light rail, correct? Asking for too much, too soon is probably what's dooming this project.
micheal_can
Senior Member
No, anything that is not Subways, Subways, Subways and being NDP./Liberal is what doomed this.
Fervid Corona
New Member
Post LRT task force to consider highway projects: Mulroney’s office
https://www.thespec.com/news-story/...-consider-highway-projects-mulroney-s-office/
https://www.thespec.com/news-story/...-consider-highway-projects-mulroney-s-office/
lrt's friend
Active Member
A capacity increase was the main justification for Ottawa's LRT tunnel. Other than congestion related delays, the speed of Ottawa's system was not expected to increase given that the Transitways were already grade separated outside of downtown. Buses can travel just as fast as trains in absence of congestion.
Unfortunately, Ottawa's LRT has not delivered a faster or more reliable transit system overall so far. Unless train reliability can be improved, Phase 2 extensions will make things worse, not better.
gibsonm
Active Member
Wow, Jane Jacobs would be turning in her grave. How backwards are these people to dilute rapid transit funding by bringing highways onto the table. So sad the total lack of awareness of good urban planning. Hamilton is already a city of highways. Cars already roar down the one way streets downtown as though they’re on expressways. Is it still the 1970’s? I’m sure Robert Moses would be proud. With some decent boulevards, light standards, tree planting, street furniture, and a rapid transit line (LRT), streets like King, Main, and James could be very nice places to walk and spend time on rather than pass through on the way to somewhere else. I’d love to see some of these one way streets restored to two-way, but there aren’t enough Hamilton councillors or Hamilton MPP’s who would see the value of such moves — even though they’re made in every other successful city!
mdrejhon
Senior Member
More clean power.
Attach a generator to the spinning Jane Jacobs and generate electricity.
Then Ford will be forced to build LRTs and electrify GO to use up the surplus electricity. Win-win-win.
Garbage!
I hereby figuratively attach 3 files to this.
<3 File Attachments: LoudBooingSong.mp3 LoudBooingMeme.gif LoudBooingVideo.mp4>
smallspy
Senior Member
Much of the reason why a lot of people are complaining about the LRT is because they now have a transfer where they didn't. Phase 2 is going to fix this for a majority of riders in Ottawa by getting rid of many of those transfers.
In light of that, I can't see how it will make things worse.
Dan