Toronto 50 Bloor Street West | 230.11m | 70s | Morguard Corporation | Pellow + Associates

[AlvinofDiaspar]

AG:

Yeah, dont get it it, three of the best proposed projects in the last year, and you get this....Nitpicking

Sorry, personally I will pick well-reasoned and presented "nitpicking" over fanboy Herbal Essence Yes! Yes! Yes! anyday - and I say that considering you haven't even bothered to say why those towers are the "best".

AoD

 

[Automation Gallery]

AG:

Sorry, personally I will pick well-reasoned and presented "nitpicking" over fanboy Herbal Essence Yes! Yes! Yes! anyday - and I say that considering you haven't even bothered to say why those towers are the "best".

AoD

After a re-design and most likely wanting another re-design cause the design isn't quite there yet is Nitpicking...
come-on everything cant just be, No! No! No! because its tall

 

[SP!RE]

Once again, Automation Gallery, we are seeing you, someone who says "Yes! Yes! Yes!" to every single tall tower and is satisfied with the whim of almost every developer on almost every tall project (I've always never seen you actually critique a project positive OR negatively, rather you accept what you see in front of you and don't question it), accuse those of us with standards as being anti-height. This is untrue and disingenuous to the process of critique and design development.

AoD along with myself and some others on the boards appreciate a well-done tall tower but point out flaws when we see them. Both AoD and myself said we support the project and many of its better facets, but that we want to see the tower improved. Not sure how that's a bad thing, unless you prefer to settle for less.

Yeah, dont get it it, three of the best proposed projects in the last year, and you get this....Nitpicking

Also, define what you mean by "best", because that sounds very subjective to me. 50 Bloor and 10 York may be TALL projects, but in my opinion they are not the best, and only stand a chance of being so if they are critiqued and improved.

For me, UT is about architectura critique and discussion; not just drooling over every single thing a developer proposes.

After a re-design and most likely wanting another re-design cause the design isn't quite there yet is Nitpicking...
come-on everything cant just be, No! No! No! because its tall

Where did we ONCE say that we oppose the height of this proposal?

Please learn to discuss, debate, and critique the various points of a project if you are going to try to engage me.

 

[Xray_Crystal_Junkie]

If you think this is above the aesthetic of One Bloor you need to tell me how to get some of those amazing drugs you're on.

 

[Automation Gallery]

Where did we ONCE say that we oppose the height of this proposal?

Please learn to discuss, debate, and critique the various points of a project if you are going to try to engage me.

Where did you get, we... i said you
SPiRE, you just have to read your posts, 99.9% of the time, you do not agree with the design, height, cladding, etc. etc. etc. of any proposed project in the early stages, no matter what height...
With all this this development going on in Toronto .... there must be something, off the bat, that strikes your fancy

Its very hard to debate without an argument, when two people have the complete opposite views, ...i may be a skyscraper fanboy on UT, but it does not make some of you, planners and architects.

 

[SP!RE]

This will be the last time I respond to you around here, but let me quickly sum up my response for you:
1) There are dozens of projects in this city that I absolutely love. I could easily list about 20 for you right now off the top of my head.
2) This doesn't mean, however, that just because there are lots of projects under construction in Toronto, that I like a proportionate number, nor do I settle for lower quality architecture with the same old excuses used to defend it.
3) You don't have to be a planner or an architect to engage people in architectural discussion. But you do have to offer critique.

One of my architecture profs made a great point when she told us that the best way to respect a fellow architect or architecture student's work is to offer a solid critique. Not handing off compliments that are not constructive or useful, but rather offering good suggestions for improvement.

No need to be so defensive when I complain and bitch about different designs... there is nothing to lose from analyzing the negative points (as well as the positive points, of course) of a design.

 

[Jaye101]

If you think this is above the aesthetic of One Bloor you need to tell me how to get some of those amazing drugs you're on.

I'm not a fan of One Bloor. I don't hate it, just not a fan. Other than the height, it seems pretentious. I like the proportions of the podium, but the tower looks like it will age very badly. It already looks dated to me. The design elements on the side are a tad cliché, probably because the proportions of the tower are typical of many condos built here over the last 10 years. It's not bad. But it's not as monumental and mature as 50 Bloor.

It all comes down to one's style. It's all subjective. And some of these renderings are deceptive, so who knows, maybe my opinion will change once (if) both are realized.

 

[DtTO]

Also, define what you mean by "best", because that sounds very subjective to me. 50 Bloor and 10 York may be TALL projects, but in my opinion they are not the best

This is definitely subjective. In my opinion, 50 Bloor, 10 York, Mirvish, MTCC, L Tower, ICE, Exhibit, River City, Massey, 1 Bloor, X2, RoCP, Pier 27, and Aura (if the curve is done correctly) are all cream of the crop.

If you think this is above the aesthetic of One Bloor you need to tell me how to get some of those amazing drugs you're on.

Actually, I also think that 50 Bloor is far more aesthetically pleasing than 1 Bloor, especially if they use high quality cladding. It looks retro-futuristic to me, in a good way. Also, from what we've seen so far, 50 Bloor will have the best podium (by far) in the city (excluding MTCC, and Mirvish).

 

[Xray_Crystal_Junkie]

I'm all for respecting one's opinion and sure it's subjective, but to a point.

You honestly mean to tell me you'd select this:

Over this:

One was designed by one of the best firms in this city, the other is known for designing malls. Can you tell which is which?

 

[TonyV]

This will be the last time I respond to you around here, but let me quickly sum up my response for you:
1) There are dozens of projects in this city that I absolutely love. I could easily list about 20 for you right now off the top of my head.
2) This doesn't mean, however, that just because there are lots of projects under construction in Toronto, that I like a proportionate number, nor do I settle for lower quality architecture with the same old excuses used to defend it.
3) You don't have to be a planner or an architect to engage people in architectural discussion. But you do have to offer critique.

One of my architecture profs made a great point when she told us that the best way to respect a fellow architect or architecture student's work is to offer a solid critique. Not handing off compliments that are not constructive or useful, but rather offering good suggestions for improvement.

No need to be so defensive when I complain and bitch about different designs... there is nothing to lose from analyzing the negative points (as well as the positive points, of course) of a design.

.. could add that Toronto can afford to hold out for architectural quality and to push for refinements. Perhaps a different city that is begging for development would just take anything. We shouldn't.

 

[Automation Gallery]

One was designed by one of the best firms in this city, the other is known for designing malls. Can you tell which is which?

Yeah, one looks elegant on that strech of Bloor, and the other one looks like it would look best in the Panama/ Miami waterfront

 

[timeo]

.. could add that Toronto can afford to hold out for architectural quality and to push for refinements. Perhaps a different city that is begging for development would just take anything. We shouldn't.

Agreed. Torontonians should demand and receive high-quality architecture, not just whatever a developer and their 3rd rate architecture consultant bandies in front of us. I hope the DRP rejects the tower portion and opts for a re-design. As it is, the upper half of the tower appears really incongruous to the rest of the tower and the podium.

 

[Critique]

I'm all for respecting one's opinion and sure it's subjective, but to a point.

You honestly mean to tell me you'd select this:

Over this:

One was designed by one of the best firms in this city, the other is known for designing malls. Can you tell which is which?

I hope your not judging 1 bloor by by how "pretty" the render is because it seems that is what you're doing by trying to compare two renders. Both buildings look amazing but I hold my previous say when I said that 50 bloor could possibly outshine 1 bloor. Both will be amazing additions to the skyline but 50 bloor simply has a better podium and the different designs throughout the building from bottom to top are all amazing and yet cohesive. They all add to the tower instead of trying to outshine each other. 1 Bloor is amazing but the whole wavy balcony thing has been done and done many times before (Chicago being the obvious example). However, Toronto is in need of atleast one building that looks like 1 bloor but we have all seen other buildings already try and copy the same design (such as the prelim render of 460 yonge). Again, I hope you're not judging 1 bloor so highly just because of that magnificent blue background and perfectly placed shadows. In the end it will all come down to the quality of the materials used. For the time being, lets just take a step back and wait and see if 50 bloor even gets accepted.

 

[Xray_Crystal_Junkie]

Sigh...

No I'm not making my judgement on the prettiness of the rendering.

I don't hate 50 Bloor, but to call it "elegant" or "cohesive" is, I'm sorry, not the proper use of those words.

The relationship between the podium and tower of One Bloor is cohesive and elegant. The form of the podium lines up with the sweeping balconies, drawing the eye skywards and creating a visually appealing structure from top to bottom.

50 Bloor is a bunch of modular pieces smushed together. There is little to no interplay between them. It's not the worst thing to be proposed/built in this city recently but it needs quite a bit of refinement.

Oh and as for materials. Who instills greater confidence: Great Gulf vs. Morguard?
Those who brought us "X" or "The Bay Club"?

FYI: The Bay Club

 

[Critique]

To be honest I don't like either X or Bay Club. Yes 50 bloor isnt exactly perfect just from that one render, which is their ONLY render. However, I think those different pieces fit together quite well and the podium is quite amazing just by it's sheer size. Yes, 1 bloor is quite nice with the lines as well but I don't think you're giving enough credit to 50 bloor. I simply think that 50 bloor is comparable to 1 bloor just by that one render.