212 King Street West | 311.8m | 80s | Dream Office | SHoP

daniel_kryz

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"Enough" is the atrium ceiling. I think most people can agree that it is a good-looking ceiling and is clearly interesting, thoughtful, and made with good materials. I would be happy to hear any objections.

While I like the terra cotta, there is no point in using it if it's barely noticeable in most renderings. We used to build with an emphasis on solid materials, which is the thing that makes buildings stand apart from each other. It gives them their own identity.
 

Mongo

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DRP is funny. they have approved some very wanky looking towers but when somebody put efforts into something nice they shot it down. i mean i do agree with some of the things they said but it doesn't mean you reject it.

I am still unhappy that the DRP shot down the Distillery District Rack House D design -- which had won an award from Architecture Magazine -- in 2012:

20120221-Mill-South-Distillery.jpg
 

Redflorist

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Does anyone know how long the DRP decision will delay the project by? It looks like they want a big redesign of the podium, so it could be a while.
 

Mercenary

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Is there one DRP that reviews all new construction in Toronto or are they segmented by the type of construction....commerical office building vs condo....
 

ProjectEnd

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We're more than a year out at the absolute shortest from here. Zoning needs to be approved, then SPA and Permits (though these can happen while zoning is getting finalized). They also need to find enough tenants to prelease the 650k office component. Nowhere near construction.
 

interchange42

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Does anyone know how long the DRP decision will delay the project by? It looks like they want a big redesign of the podium, so it could be a while.
The DRP cannot stop a project. The developers/architects simply have a chance to rethink aspects of it based on the responses (which, as you probably saw, can differ from member to member). If the Planning Department does not like what they see in a proposal, they can pick and choose aspects of the DRP commentary to needle the developers on, but ultimately it's Planning guidelines and regulations against which a proposal is reviewed, and that would be ongoing.
Is there one DRP that reviews all new construction in Toronto or are they segmented by the type of construction....commercial office building vs condo....
Toronto has one DRP, Waterfront Toronto has another, the U of T has another. The DRP members are professionals representing various specialities within architecture and landscape architecture.

Toronto also has a Planning Review Panel, or at least had one: they haven't met since December, 2019. (There have been two panels: 2016-2017, and 2018-2019.) I'm not sure if it's been decided that the 32-member civilian panels (members chosen by a civic lottery to represent many types of Torontonians) were deemed fairly useless, or if the next PRP is just on hold because of COVID.
Does that mean that the construction can begin sometime soon? It has several hundred rental units, so the faster it comes up the better for the city's housing supply
Like @ProjectEnd said, there are all those approvals to gain first, and those take time as various departments at the City review all the documents. (Frankly, I'm not all that worried about luxury rental unit availability, it's the affordable ones that the city is sorely lacking in.)

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AlvinofDiaspar

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The DRP cannot stop a project. The developers/architects simply have a chance to rethink aspects of it based on the responses (which, as you probably saw, can differ from member to member). If the Planning Department does not like what they see in a proposal, they can pick and choose aspects of the DRP commentary to needle the developers on, but ultimately it's Planning guidelines and regulations against which a proposal is reviewed, and that would be ongoing.

Toronto has one DRP, Waterfront Toronto has another, the U of T has another. The DRP members are professionals representing various specialities within architecture and landscape architecture.

Toronto also has a Planning Review Panel, or at least had one: they haven't met since December, 2019. (There have been two panels: 2016-2017, and 2018-2019.) I'm not sure if it's been decided that the 32-member civilian panels (members chosen by a civic lottery to represent many types of Torontonians) were deemed fairly useless, or if the next PRP is just on hold because of COVID.

Like @ProjectEnd said, there are all those approvals to gain first, and those take time as various departments at the City review all the documents. (Frankly, I'm not all that worried about luxury rental unit availability, it's the affordable ones that the city is sorely lacking in.)

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For completeness' sake I think TCHC has a DRP as well. Anyways, for all the bellyaching as to how the DRP killed a project - it didn't - it is either the proponent dumbing it down because they couldn't/wouldn't build what they have originally proposed, or it couldn't get approved by other authorities as is due to other reasons.

Repeat after me - the DRP is advisory in their role.

AoD
 
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DavidCapizzano

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Are they committed to terra cotta? It gets proposed a lot but it always seems like the first material to get chopped because of cost (I'm guessing because it has to come from the states)
 

ProjectEnd

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NBK is probably the largest supplier - they're based in Germany. Terra Cotta is expensive, but if done right, can be cost-effective. Novus has NBK products cladding its podium, for example, as does the new Perkins & Will building at U of T Mississauga.

 

daniel_kryz

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Sure, buildings are built differently now than in the past. I'm not sure what point you're getting at here?
Aesthetics. That's my point.

It doesn't matter how obsessed architects & developers are with modernism, most people don't like indifferent glass boxes... and 212's tower looks like it can be built in any city. If they expanded the use of terra cotta, it would actually have an identity and wouldn't be sooo boring.
 

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