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Suburbs lose out to the bright lights of downtown

Uncle Teddy

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Suburbs lose out to the bright lights of downtown

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...the-bright-lights-of-downtown/article1881319/

CHRIS ATCHISON
From Tuesday's Globe and Mail
Published Monday, Jan. 24, 2011 5:14PM EST
Last updated Tuesday, Jan. 25, 2011 6:22AM EST

The recession of the early 1990s devastated office markets in major Canadian cities. Back then, real estate watchers noted a marked increase in companies fleeing downtown cores for the fast-growing suburbs.

Companies, nursing their battered bottom lines, found cheaper rents and in some cases lower taxes in suburban industrial parks. In many cases, their employees, many of whom had long since settled in the outlying areas, were only too happy to make the move.

But during the recession of 2008, the same industry watchers noticed a near 180-degree shift. Companies in Toronto, Calgary, Montreal and Vancouver started migrating back downtown, led by financial firms and business-services providers.

The result? According to a recent report by real estate consultancy CB Richard Ellis Canada, vacancy rates in the fourth quarter of 2010 stood at 8 per cent nationwide for downtown office space, compared with 11.2 per cent out in the suburbs. The same report found that average downtown Class A rents were $6.50 per square foot higher than those in the suburbs, where rents have failed to bounce back as quickly.

Why have downtown markets seemingly bucked recessionary pressures at the expense of their once-resilient suburban competitors?

According to John O'Toole, CBRE's Toronto-based executive vice-president, Canada's office market isn't necessarily seeing a full-fledged flight from the suburbs into the city core. Instead, financially sound companies in knowledge-driven sectors, who already occupy urban offices, are gobbling up more downtown space.

Adding to this, suburban office markets in major cities – many of which host major U.S. multinationals – have been beaten down by economic circumstances south of the border. “Take the Greater Toronto Area as an example,†Mr. O'Toole explains. “Part of the reason we haven't seen the absorption of space in the suburbs is largely because of the number of Canadian head offices of large U.S. corporations that have facilities there.â€

The story is different for major Canadian firms.

Telus, Royal Bank and CI Investments have occupied hundreds of thousands of additional square feet in Toronto's core over the past two years. Major factors were the chance to embrace strong branding opportunities – namely, the signage on the top of the building and the naming rights that major corporations so highly covet – and attract well-educated, sophisticated workers.

“Tenants and their employees are really looking for more of the amenities that downtowns have to offer,†Mr. O'Toole says.

“What's really important when you look at some of the users who have expanded or made a commitment downtown – like Royal Bank with their new building and Telus with theirs – is that it's all about retention and attraction of employees.â€

And if that means shrinking the size of cubicles to cut costs and maintain that downtown presence, so be it. Ten to 15 years ago, Mr. O'Toole points out, the average employee might occupy 250 square feet of space. Today it's as little as 125 square feet.

Some firms, however, will maintain their suburban presence, among them pharmaceutical and engineering companies as well as big consumer brands, predicts Stan Krawitz, president of Toronto-based real estate brokerage Real Facilities Inc.

But firms looking to gain an employee recruitment or retention advantage by clustering downtown – say, big banks, insurance companies and some tech firms – will gladly pay more in rent.

“If your employee base is the knowledge worker who is between 20 and 30 years old, it doesn't matter what you offer them – if you relocate to the suburbs, they're not going,†Mr. Krawitz says.

“That's why you see the escalation in demand for brick-and-beam space, that's why you see the ad agencies clustering together.â€

In the case of Edmonton-based architecture and engineering firm Stantec, a decision to consolidate its seven Toronto-area offices in 2008 was followed by an appeal from downtown-based employees after a possible suburban relocation was floated.

The firm eventually decided to not only maintain – but soon expand – that urban presence despite having to pay an extra $10 a square foot for downtown space.

“Our architectural group was in the downtown core, and they felt that staying there was important to attracting and retaining the young people they wanted to be part of their future,†says Stantec's vice-president, Brian Sirbovan.

The rise in demand for LEED-certified space and availability of public transportation are significant for driving or keeping some firms downtown, says Jan Sucharda, president and chief operating officer, Canadian commercial operations, for property-management firm Brookfield Properties.

Many major tenants, he says, insist on being in either newly built or retrofitted buildings that carry LEED certification. “Then when you add the fact that people can take transit, walk or ride a bike to work, it reduces the carbon footprint for the entire organization rather than seeing a parking lot full of cars in the suburbs,†he adds.

It's a trend he sees continuing as cities and provinces upgrade their infrastructures and transportation to ring people downtown.

“I can only imagine it getting stronger.â€
 
Is this thread meant to be "Glen bait"?

hahahahaha... I was thinking the exact same thing!

Walked down York to see the QQ revamp bash at Harbourfront last week, and the Telus building looks really, really good at street level now. The light 'sculpture' on the York side of MLS was very cool as well -- once they get the last of the construction out of the way, this will be a very pleasant stroll down to the waterfront on a summer's day.
 
images


The amount of occupied office space in the City of Toronto declined between the first
quarter 2001 and second quarter 2003, after which the total occupied office space
remained stable until the fourth quarter 2004. Between 2001 and beginning of 2003 the
amount of occupied office space within the City of Toronto declined by more than 7
million square feet, the bulk of which (4.8 million square feet) was lost in the downtown
core.

Beginning in the first quarter 2005, the total amount of occupied office space within the
City of Toronto began to expand for the next three years and peaked in the second quarter
2008. Between the beginning of 2005 and the middle of 2008 the amount of occupied
office space in the City increased by almost 7.5 million square feet. During this time the
majority of the expansion in occupied office space, almost 5 million square feet, occurred
in the downtown core. Between the second quarter 2008 and the first quarter 2009 the
amount of occupied office space in the City declined by almost 1.7 million square feet.
Approximately 50% of the reduction in occupied office space occurred in the downtown
core. The net impact is that the total amount of occupied office space (104 million
square feet) in the City today (Q1, 2009) is virtually the same as in 2000 (104 million
square feet, Q1 2000).


Between the first quarter 2002 and the fourth quarter 2008, total occupied office space in
the “905†area increased by almost 9.2 million square feet. In the first quarter 2009 the
occupied office space in the “905†area declined by almost 400,000 square feet.

http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2009/ed/bgrd/backgroundfile-20271.pdf

-----------

The article posted dose not really conflict with what I have been saying. Yes downtown is a desirable place to work, especially for certain demographics. Yes, there is a premium to be paid for locating in the downtown. What I have been saying is that his premium should be realized through increased assessment values not different tax rates between classes. If all of the premium is consumed by taxes, then there is little incentive to develop. So this demand will go unfulfilled. The article also ignores the the impact that tax rates have on non Class 'A' and Brick and Beam offices. Are these areas going to be as desirable when all the small stores and restaurants that animate the areas around them close (as will happen when CVA caps expire)?
 
Mmm-hmm. Yeah we already know this is a problem from the hundred of times you've posted these facts.

What I'm more interested in knowing is whether or not this new administration will tackle the problem or pander to the taxpayers.
 
Not quite related, but interesting.

Ready to rev up Toronto’s economy

January 28, 2011

John Spears

How about this to get Toronto’s economy moving:

• A “Toronto Fund†sponsored by major Toronto-based pension funds, for firms having trouble with conventional financing;

• Additional tax incentives for firms heading into Toronto;

• Cooperating with Toronto’s neighbours in luring investment to the area.

Councillor Michael Thompson takes the chair of the city’s new economic development committee for the first time Friday.

And in an interview with the Toronto Star, he showed he won’t be afraid to take some new directions.

It’s the first taste of being on the inner circle for Thompson, who has represented Ward 37 Scarborough Centre since 2003, but was on the opposition side of council under former mayor David Miller.

And while Thompson thinks the city is in good shape to take advantage of an economic upswing, he’d like to see the city give the business community a boost.

One of his ideas is a “Toronto Fund’ that could finance up-and-coming businesses that have trouble getting conventional funding.

He cites a Scarborough firm he knows that has a fat order book but needs financing for materials. He thinks some of the biggest pension funds that make their home in Toronto might consider creating a fund to give firms such as these a leg up.

“Why not?†he asks. “I might be crazy, but I think there’s an opportunity. I’m requesting meetings with them and we’re trying to set that up right now.â€

He recognizes the funds have to be prudent and subject such loans to the “same rigorous process†that all other investments go through.

“They can say: ‘You’re crazy,’ or ‘We can’t do it because of our mandate,’†he says. “But I need to ask that question.â€

The city should think about measures of its own, Thompson says.

“Municipal taxes are still too high and that creates a problem with our competitiveness,†he says.

A tax freeze is one thing, but “as a city we don’t create enough incentives for businesses to come to our city.â€

Toronto already offers limited tax incentives, but more may be needed, says Thompson.

Toronto’s competitors, especially in the U.S., offer come-ons, he says: “There are land incentives. There are tax forgiveness incentives for an extended period of time — of course you have to create a number of jobs. That’s an area we need to look at.â€

Getting new businesses in isn’t the whole story. Getting existing businesses to stay is also crucial. Thompson says he’d like to get a better grip on why businesses leave Toronto. He’s talking to Ryerson University about carrying out some research.

He also wants to look across the city’s municipal boundaries and create tighter links with the rest of Greater Toronto in promoting the region — something that neither David Miller nor Mel Lastman had the patience for.

Will Mayor Rob Ford want to?

“Mayor Ford and I have not had this discussion, but I do intend to talk with him about the opportunities awaiting us,†says Thompson.

“I think we need to park our differences and focus on how we apply our collective strength to the opportunity.â€

He’s not looking to scrap Toronto’s existing promotional agencies, but wants to develop a more regional approach.

“It would be my dream to have one organization a represents the (Golden) Horseshoe that looks at economic opportunities for our area, so everybody would be part of that. You need to have all the thinkers at the table.â€

The idea isn’t new, but is waterlogged. Almost two years ago, a summit of city, federal, provincial and private sector leaders urged the creation of a regional agency, but nothing has come of it.

Thompson says he’ll push for it, along with many other ideas: using colleges and universities to grow the economy; attracting more foreign small- and medium-sized businesses; reaching out to immigrants.

“We’re going to be bold, we’re going to be purposeful, we’re going to be focused,†he said. “We’re going to look at how we can create an enabling opportunity to the business community, to the investment community, to youngpeople, to new arrivals.â€

http://www.thestar.com/business/article/929587--ready-to-rev-up-toronto-s-economy

Glen, have you considered talking to Michael Thompson? He might be more receptive to your ideas than Ford.
 
A similar story in New York the other day. UBS moved its New York operations and 2000 employees from Manhattan to the suburbs, but is now regretting the decision as it's having trouble recruiting. The company is thus looking to sell its brand new and giant facility, and replace it with new space downtown.

New York Times story:

Now, though, UBS is having buyer’s remorse. It turns out that a suburban location has become a liability in recruiting the best and brightest young bankers, who want to live in Manhattan or Brooklyn, not in Stamford, Conn., which is about 35 miles northeast of Midtown. The firm has also discovered that it would be better to be closer to major clients in the city.

As a result, UBS is seriously considering a reverse migration that would bring its investment banking division and up to 2,000 bankers and traders back to Wall Street and a new skyscraper at the rebuilt World Trade Center, according to real estate executives and city officials.
 
"And if that means shrinking the size of cubicles to cut costs and maintain that downtown presence, so be it. Ten to 15 years ago, Mr. O'Toole points out, the average employee might occupy 250 square feet of space. Today it's as little as 125 square feet."

So Glen does this mean that the data moving forward will reveal an explosion in new office jobs downtown? You sited that there is approximately the same amount of office space (I'm sure a lot of it was converted to residential as we don't see any office building demolition occuring) ten years ago vis a vis 2009 downtown. Forget for a moment that 2009 is a peak recessionary comparison year. So are there a lot more workers downtown or is the boss taking up a huge amount of space while the workers toil in half the office space they did in 2000? In essence would the data not be indicating that a stagnation in the volume of space would need a lot more workers to fill it?
 
"And if that means shrinking the size of cubicles to cut costs and maintain that downtown presence, so be it. Ten to 15 years ago, Mr. O'Toole points out, the average employee might occupy 250 square feet of space. Today it's as little as 125 square feet."

So Glen does this mean that the data moving forward will reveal an explosion in new office jobs downtown? You sited that there is approximately the same amount of office space (I'm sure a lot of it was converted to residential as we don't see any office building demolition occuring) ten years ago vis a vis 2009 downtown. Forget for a moment that 2009 is a peak recessionary comparison year. So are there a lot more workers downtown or is the boss taking up a huge amount of space while the workers toil in half the office space they did in 2000? In essence would the data not be indicating that a stagnation in the volume of space would need a lot more workers to fill it?


But it's all relative right ? The devleopments in the suburbs also feature smaller and smaller working space.
 
^Do they? I have no knowledge either way but the article was only refering to downtown figures. We don't know if suburban office size has also shrunk. Perhaps some else knows.
 
^Do they? I have no knowledge either way but the article was only refering to downtown figures. We don't know if suburban office size has also shrunk. Perhaps some else knows.

I'm sure it's the same ... based on what I've seen ... same issues apply that would lead to it.
 
I just wish they'd spread out maybe a little. Do they all need to be right at King and Bay? How about moving jobs to Yonge and Eglinton for example? There's quite a huge gap from being right downtown and even being in say Scarborough.
 
I just wish they'd spread out maybe a little. Do they all need to be right at King and Bay? How about moving jobs to Yonge and Eglinton for example? There's quite a huge gap from being right downtown and even being in say Scarborough.

Interesting, while clearly that's what the province is going for, not so much downtown vs Yonge and Eglinton but downtown / Markham Center / Airport Corporate center / NYCC / Vaghan / so on ...

i.e. decentralized, personally I wish it good all go downtown, or maybe 80% at th every least. That's how the large cities of the world today were built. But I don't think that's the future.

The Y&E, Y&B, and Y&S (st.claire) nodes have always had relatively low vacancy rates but no demand for large contiguous blocks and generally that's why there haven't been new developments i.e. the turn over i.e. other companies moving out, supplies enough *new* space for companies to move in.

I think at one point there was a plan for a Y&E office building. I think the only way it'll happen if one large tenant commits to say 40%+ of the space, I don't think that'll happen.
 

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