Rob Ford's Subway plan and the 2001 Rapid Transit Expansion Study

[denfromoakvillemilton]

http://transit.toronto.on.ca/archives/reports/rtes2002.pdf

Look at the RTES and the last two maps. The only differnce is eglinton and the dixie extension.

Now my question is. If this way the plan prior to Miller, then why are all upset when Rob Ford, for all intents in purposes, is going back to that plan?

 

[valvenis]

1. Going back from this map to either of those maps, isn't all that enticing.

2. The proposed timeline 2015 is unrealistic.
3. Rob Ford's map ignores construction on anything other than Sheppard and replacing the SLRT. Toronto needs more transit than that.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I don't disagree that this plan is better and covers WAY more ground, but people need to stop acting like ford came up with new ideas.

 

[valvenis]

I think the problem is that Rob Ford didn't come up with new ideas or build on existing ones. He or his people just drew two lines on a map and ignored the transit issues on the ground.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Rob Ford just wants to get the unclean underground and out of sight when he drives his SUV, so they don't in his way.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Rob Ford just wants to get the unclean underground and out of sight when he drives his SUV, so they don't in his way.

Okay but how is his plan any different then want Torontonians wanted before?

 

[Paleo]

Look at the RTES and the last two maps. The only differnce is eglinton and the dixie extension.

Um Richmond Hill? I'd also say Eglinton is a big deal. Your opinion may differ.

 

[DSC]

Of course subways are "better" at moving large numbers of people, with fairly few stations to slow them down, but they are also FAR more expensive than LRT which is cost-effective even in areas where there are not enough pssengers to make a subway even vaguely sensible. One has to look at all modes of urban public transit (bus, LRT and subway) and select the mode most likely to provide enough capacity for a reasonable amount of time. On most (all?) the proposed Transit City routes buses are already reaching their limit or exceed it, but few, if any, are likely to reach the 'break-even point for a subway for MANY years, LRT is thus a better solution unless we want to invest lots of money into building subways for our grandchildren! The problem with Ford's 'plan' is that it uses our very limited financial resources to serve very few people. Transit City was not "ideal" but it did use the funds we have in a far more sensible fashion. Before you say "private sector funding' you may want to think about why Ford's plan for a privately financed subway is not going anywhere.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Um Richmond Hill? I'd also say Eglinton is a big deal. Your opinion may differ.

Richmond Hill is going to happen at some point regardless its in the Metrolinx plan, that's why I didn't say anything.

 

[k10ery]

Okay but how is his plan any different then want Torontonians wanted before?

Good question. I'd say it's because the 2001 plan was from the last time a guy from the suburbs was mayor. It was a bad plan then and it's a bad plan now.

James Bow says that when the 2001 plan came out, inner city councillors flipped, and Mel Lastman was forced to say that Eglinton would be prioritized over Sheppard.

Rob Ford got elected by putting the Lastman coalition back together. It's odd to me that a guy from Etobicoke is against the original Eglinton plan and for Sheppard. But there are clearly a lot of anti-development homeowners along Eglinton that never wanted Miller's Eglinton LRT to go past their houses. I'm pretty sure Rob was one of them. The all-underground plan makes it much harder to get the Eglinton line out there, ever.

 

[EnviroTO]

The difference is that his plan is to build LRT under Eglinton, replace SRT with LRT between Kennedy and SCC, and subway in northern Scarborough.

 

[Dan416]

Wait Ford hasn't shown any inclination that he's going to replace the SRT with subway though, since the SRT is being incorporated into the Eglinton line

 

[gweed123]

Wait Ford hasn't shown any inclination that he's going to replace the SRT with subway though, since the SRT is being incorporated into the Eglinton line

I think that was a brilliant piece of maneuvering by Metrolinx on that one. They gave him Sheppard (mainly because they knew there wasn't a chance in hell of it flying, and that he was a 1 term mayor, so even if it did somehow get legs, it could be cancelled before anything substantial took place there).

Metrolinx also knew that a B-D extension would mean years of delays, but they had a chance to eliminate one of the big gripes with the SRT: the forced transfer at Kennedy. By making it a through-line, they made the line a lot more useful. They also got to save Eglinton, the centrepiece of the Toronto section of the Big Move.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I think that was a brilliant piece of maneuvering by Metrolinx on that one. They gave him Sheppard (mainly because they knew there wasn't a chance in hell of it flying, and that he was a 1 term mayor, so even if it did somehow get legs, it could be cancelled before anything substantial took place there).

Metrolinx also knew that a B-D extension would mean years of delays, but they had a chance to eliminate one of the big gripes with the SRT: the forced transfer at Kennedy. By making it a through-line, they made the line a lot more useful. They also got to save Eglinton, the centrepiece of the Toronto section of the Big Move.

But thanks to McGuinty they lost the western part. What's the point of getting off at black creelk?

 

[gweed123]

But thanks to McGuinty they lost the western part. What's the point of getting off at black creelk?

That cut (along with the cuts to Finch West and Sheppard) were made almost a year prior to Ford getting elected. They have no link whatsoever.