Roads: Ontario/GTA Highways Discussion

[drum118]

HOV lanes are pointless. It just causes a lot of weaving, and you get people who park in that lane driving the speed limit because they have two passengers. I would rather we had toll lanes with transponders, automatic fine on entry without transponder, and only buses, etc. are exempted on the toll.

Unless there 3 or more in a vehicle using the HOV, the HOV lane is a joke and a waste of lane use.

After doing a photo shoot in Burlington today, I would be lucky if I got pass by a dozen vehicle carrying 2 people while driving 120 in the passing lane of the QEW between Burlington and Oakville who were passing us. I lost count after 100 single driver and would say over 300 pass us while doing 120 or the stop and go traffic.

Only saw 1 OPP unmarked car on my trip from London to Burlington by the 403 and have seen them follow single drivers on the QEW that did nothing. Was really attempted to use the HOV lane when seeing these speeders passing me before hitting the stop and go area, but chose to obey the rule of the road other than speeding since I was going with the flow at the time.

Seen next to no enforcement of any HOV lane in NA. Have seen a lot of Sunday drivers in the HOV lane to the point we have to pass them in the passing lane. Seen a few locations where HOV were to go in only to become a passing lane in the end.

Want to enforce the 2 plus rider of the HOV lane, install cameras on the barrier or poles with 3-6 shots or more to prove you were illegally in the wrong.

 

[lenaitch]

This is one problem with the HOV concept. Because it is adjacent to the normal Lane 1(passing lane, high-speed lane, rail lane, etc.), some feel it is like a 'higher speed' lane and that somebody doing the speed limit is somehow obstructive. If you want to overtake somebody in an HOV lane, you have to exit to the passing lane then re-enter, but there are rules where you can exit the lane.

 

[afransen]

This is one problem with the HOV concept. Because it is adjacent to the normal Lane 1(passing lane, high-speed lane, rail lane, etc.), some feel it is like a 'higher speed' lane and that somebody doing the speed limit is somehow obstructive. If you want to overtake somebody in an HOV lane, you have to exit to the passing lane then re-enter, but there are rules where you can exit the lane.

This causes chaos and is dangerous. You are advocating passing on the right, which is illegal and dangerous (though necessary given Ontario driving culture). HOV lanes are kind of a stupid idea, unless we are reserving them for true HOVs like buses.

 

[Transportfan]

Yes, in 2002. But national & provincial legislation has moved a long way since then, as well as widespread awareness of the impacts/implications of climate change. I think it's perfectly reasonable to have an EA on the project.

Climate change has nothing to do with the area the highway would pass through though.

Not to mention the growth in electric cars, and the fact the doom and gloom scenarios the scientists back in the 80s predicted to have happened by now have failed to materialize.

 

[turini2]

Climate change has nothing to do with the area the highway would pass through though.

Not to mention the growth in electric cars, and the fact the doom and gloom scenarios the scientists back in the 80s predicted to have happened by now have failed to materialize.

Building a new highway has everything to do with climate change. Induced demand leading to continued car dependency, continued urban sprawl, damaging/destroying important habitats and watersheds, loss of high quality farmland so close to the GTHA etc etc.
Hence the need to redo the EA as noted above to meet current legislative standards.

Sure an electric car is better for the climate, but it's still a car - with all the damaging consequences that result from a car orientated lifestyle...

 

[kamira51]

HOV lanes are pointless. It just causes a lot of weaving, and you get people who park in that lane driving the speed limit because they have two passengers. I would rather we had toll lanes with transponders, automatic fine on entry without transponder, and only buses, etc. are exempted on the toll.

I have to disagree with you there. My father and I carpool to work and use the HOV lanes whenever possible. It's a very useful system.

Building a new highway has everything to do with climate change. Induced demand leading to continued car dependency, continued urban sprawl, damaging/destroying important habitats and watersheds, loss of high quality farmland so close to the GTHA etc etc.
Hence the need to redo the EA as noted above to meet current legislative standards.

Sure an electric car is better for the climate, but it's still a car - with all the damaging consequences that result from a car orientated lifestyle...

Then let's start building new railway corridors that benefit people who dont work in downtown Toronto. Expand GO into a regional rail service. that's how you get people off the road.

 

[DirectionNorth]

Then let's start building new railway corridors that benefit people who don't work in downtown Toronto. Expand GO into a regional rail service. that's how you get people off the road.

Transportation is a large part of climate change. So is paving over farmland.

 

[innsertnamehere]

HOVs are useful in specific contexts if you ask me.

locations like the QEW through Oakville were a terrible decision. MTO chose to build 1 HOV lane there instead of 2 GP lanes. Huge waste of capacity for what is a high traffic commuter route.

the 400 though, I’m more supportive. HOVs discourage hyper commuters from Simcoe County but provide the necessary capacity for recreational trips which tend to be multi passenger anyway.

 

[afransen]

I have to disagree with you there. My father and I carpool to work and use the HOV lanes whenever possible. It's a very useful system.

In my experience, the vast majority of the time there is no travel time savings using the HOV lanes. And the HOV lanes cause traffic with people merging in and out of those lanes.

 

[afransen]

HOVs are useful in specific contexts if you ask me.

locations like the QEW through Oakville were a terrible decision. MTO chose to build 1 HOV lane there instead of 2 GP lanes. Huge waste of capacity for what is a high traffic commuter route.

the 400 though, I’m more supportive. HOVs discourage hyper commuters from Simcoe County but provide the necessary capacity for recreational trips which tend to be multi passenger anyway.

Just about every car on the 400 on summer weekends is multi-passenger. What would an HOV lane achieve?

 

[innsertnamehere]

Just about every car on the 400 on summer weekends is multi-passenger. What would an HOV lane achieve?

Provides capacity for weekend peak traffic while discouraging single occupant commuters during the week.

because so many cars are multi-passenger, the HOV would effectively have the same capacity of a GP lane on weekends when it is most needed, but provides lower capacity on weekdays when you want to try to discourage single occupant trips.

 

[afransen]

Meh... tolls!

 

[lenaitch]

This causes chaos and is dangerous. You are advocating passing on the right, which is illegal and dangerous (though necessary given Ontario driving culture). HOV lanes are kind of a stupid idea, unless we are reserving them for true HOVs like buses.

Not advocating - just observing. One problem with HOV/HOT lanes is that they are somewhat of a 'roadway within a roadway' with their own set of rules. Exiting them, for whatever reason, can pose challenges to some drivers since you are moving directly into the so-called high speed lane, even if the intent is to continue to move towards an exit.

BTW, passing on the right on a multi-lane roadway, in and of itself, is not illegal in Ontario.

 

[Bojaxs]

I've lived in Oakville my whole life and the HOV lanes on the QEW have accomplished not very much since their inception in 2011. They perhaps help to alleviate congestion on the weekends, but that's about it. I often find myself passing people on the HOV lane during peak traffic hours because someone is attempting to get off the HOV into the general purpose lane and is finding it difficult. All the while holding up everyone else in the HOV lane and slowing down traffic on the left/ passing lane.

As someone in this thread mentioned earlier. I think replacing the HOV lane with two general purpose lanes and tolling the furthest, left lane would be ideal. Allow buses and "greener" vehicles to travel freely on the tolled lane, or offer discounts.

 

[afransen]

I've lived in Oakville my whole life and the HOV lanes on the QEW have accomplished not very much since their inception in 2011. They perhaps help to alleviate congestion on the weekends, but that's about it. I often find myself passing people on the HOV lane during peak traffic hours because someone is attempting to get off the HOV into the general purpose lane and is finding it difficult. All the while holding up everyone else in the HOV lane and slowing down traffic on the left/ passing lane.

As someone in this thread mentioned earlier. I think replacing the HOV lane with two general purpose lanes and tolling the furthest, left lane would be ideal. Allow buses and "greener" vehicles to travel freely on the tolled lane, or offer discounts.

Tolling would be ideal, because it would give people reason to think about whether they really want to use that lane. I see lots of people diving for the HOV lane when the highway is empty and then proceed to drive in it at 100 kph. It's almost like they derive entertainment value from being able to use it or something. Meanwhile they are getting passed by free-flowing traffic in the general purpose lanes and causing road-rage passes in the HOV lane--people cross the double lines, or aggressively pass in the dashed mixing zones.