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Ontario Northland/Northern Ontario Transportation

The new routes are nice, but they weren't a replacement for the Northlander, they were put in place to address major gaps left by Greyhound and others. The one trip along Lake Superior connects to a minbus service operated out of Thunder Bay (Kasper). It is nice to see ONTC fill these gaps, but this is a separate issue than what was promised in 2012.
Looking at the map, Off the top of my head, I don't recall Greyhound providing any service between Timmins and Matheson - let alone 2 buses a day. Nor do I recall them serving Manitoulin Island.

What was promised in 2012 that wasn't delivered? The only broken promises I recall were Tories ones to restore rail service to Toronto.
 
Looking at the map, Off the top of my head, I don't recall Greyhound providing any service between Timmins and Matheson - let alone 2 buses a day. Nor do I recall them serving Manitoulin Island.

What was promised in 2012 that wasn't delivered? The only broken promises I recall were Tories ones to restore rail service to Toronto.

Greyhound never provided service to Timmins. That has long been ON territory, and even when the Northlander existed, there was one bus a day to Cochrane (via Hghway 655), a bus connecting to the train, and and two buses south to North Bay. The Timmins bus terminal is the old T&NO/ONR railway station downtown. There used to be other operators providing service to Manitoulin Island, Espanola, and Elliot Lake, which ON does now. Like I just said, it's nice, but not the enhanced bus service promised in return for cancelling the Northlander.
 
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Like I just said, it's nice, but not the enhanced bus service promised in return for cancelling the Northlander.
What was the promised service that was not delivered?

I wish I could see pre-2012 bus timetables somewhere for the routes that existed back then.
 
The new routes are nice, but they weren't a replacement for the Northlander, they were put in place to address major gaps left by Greyhound and others. The one trip along Lake Superior connects to a minbus service operated out of Thunder Bay (Kasper). It is nice to see ONTC fill these gaps, but this is a separate issue than what was promised in 2012.

I used to take the Northland bus on occasion from Sudbury to Toronto from 2003 through 2009. There were three trips a day back then, along with Greyhound-operated express runs (Greyhound would not stop between Barrie and Sudbury, except a rest stop at Parry Sound, and no new passengers allowed to board). I quite liked the early evening ride from Sudbury on the ON bus - much quieter and less crowded than the Greyhound, making up for the extra hour it took with the local stops. I also used to sometimes take VIA up for the novelty, back when it was a morning departure from Union, getting off at Sudbury Junction (with an expensive taxi ride to the city centre) or Capreol (where a Sudbury Transit bus would get you downtown).

As for Orillia, I'm surprised that Northland still serves the station, rather than a location closer to Highway 11. I fear that Northland will move to a spot by the highway inconvenient for local residents, but there are a few decent options: the Georgian College campus (near the OPP headquarters) would be close to the highway, but at least serve a trip generator and be accessible to a local bus route. Even the Best Western at Highway 12 and Memorial Drive would work - there's a place to wait out of the cold or rain, with nearby fast food - precedent was set for a hotel stop in Bracebridge.

Apparently ON is still shopping its options. The city has the building (old train station) up for sale and whether it would be considerd as a bus terminal would be up to the new owner. At least the station is accessible to city transit. A highway stop would really suck and there aren't that many suitable sites either NB or SB.
 
Apparently ON is still shopping its options. The city has the building (old train station) up for sale and whether it would be considerd as a bus terminal would be up to the new owner. At least the station is accessible to city transit. A highway stop would really suck and there aren't that many suitable sites either NB or SB.
It's not a terminus as far as I know. Surely all the need is a pole on the street with the bus stop sign. Perhaps in front of a convenience store that sells tickets on the side. Certainly used to be a lot of town that got served that way in the day ...

There's no indication that buses are going to stop serving Orillia - despite the overly dramatic headline.
 
It's not a terminus as far as I know. Surely all the need is a pole on the street with the bus stop sign. Perhaps in front of a convenience store that sells tickets on the side. Certainly used to be a lot of town that got served that way in the day ...

There's no indication that buses are going to stop serving Orillia - despite the overly dramatic headline.

Nope, just a route stop with a big lot for the buses to manoeuver. It could be easily accommodated by a number of businesses in the city if they are willing and the lot, approaches, etc. are suitable. There might be a corporate position against on-street stops; liability and that type of thing. I don't know. No clue of what headline you speak.
 
Happily, Northland's MO isn't late-Greyhound, pulling out of downtowns in favour of highway truck stops and third-tier airports in big cities like Edmonton Saskatoon and the Regina Airport. Sudbury's ONTC terminal isn't great, but it replaced a decrepit A&W restaurant. The North Bay terminal has a direct pedestrian connection to Northgate Mall. The Bracebridge stop could be at the Walmart at the end of the highway ramp, but it's actually at a hotel closer to downtown.

Orillia Transit isn't great, but it does connect to places very close to Highway 11 interchanges, such as Georgian College, Orillia Mall, and the Wal-Mart. So I figure no matter what, there will be a bus connection.
 
Would it be any cheaper to run a DMU train rather than a loco plus coaches?

It would be nice to have both an overnight train to Cochrane, and a couple of daytime bus trips to North Bay. The train would arrive to Toronto in the early morning, and leave in the late evening. If possible, it should take a bit longer, ~ 7 hours instead of 5, between Toronto and North Bay, to give the passengers more time to sleep. Perhaps all stops between Toronto and North Bay can be skipped, who needs them at night. After North Bay, the train would make all stops en route to Cochrane.

The two daytime bus trips would make all stops between Toronto and North Bay.
 
Would it be any cheaper to run a DMU train rather than a loco plus coaches?

It would be nice to have both an overnight train to Cochrane, and a couple of daytime bus trips to North Bay. The train would arrive to Toronto in the early morning, and leave in the late evening. If possible, it should take a bit longer, ~ 7 hours instead of 5, between Toronto and North Bay, to give the passengers more time to sleep. Perhaps all stops between Toronto and North Bay can be skipped, who needs them at night. After North Bay, the train would make all stops en route to Cochrane.

The two daytime bus trips would make all stops between Toronto and North Bay.

It likely would.

Leaving the bus as it is would be a good thing. The train at one time got to Cochrane late in the night. and for many people, a better schedule.
 
Would it be any cheaper to run a DMU train rather than a loco plus coaches?

Not necessarily. Staffing requirements are the same. Maintenance requirements, although different, will likely be the same monetarily. Track charges may be the same (but may not be - it is dependent on how CN is).

Dan
 
It's gonna be "Toronto's fault" somehow that this will quietly moulder and die, rather than Northern Ontario falling for some obvious "economy with the actualité" during the election.
 
It's gonna be "Toronto's fault" somehow that this will quietly moulder and die, rather than Northern Ontario falling for some obvious "economy with the actualité" during the election.

If we don't get what we feel we deserve, it is always Toronto's fault.
 
Ontario Northland recently purchased two F40s for the Polar Bear Express (confirmed in comments).

176832
 

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