Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s

[Jonny5]

Ford is making some kind of "transit related announcement" this afternoon...

EDIT: This could be it...

Premier Doug Ford to fast-track construction of housing adjacent to new transit stations

The Progressive Conservatives want to expedite construction of thousands of homes at more than a dozen new transit stations to help Ontario from rebound the COVID-19 pandemic, the Star has learned. “This is a major change from the way Toronto has built transit before,” says a source.

www.thestar.com

 

[rbt]

Ford is making some kind of "transit related announcement" this afternoon...

I'm not entirely sure why housing adjacent to transit needs to be fast tracked. Even the fastest of stations will take a couple years to design and build; that should be ample time for nearby developers to complete their paperwork for their development.

 

[allengeorge]

My reading is that it’s supposed to reduce costs for developers by reducing the length and variability of the approvals process - and allow the province to share in the (supposed profits?)

On the second point, a quote from the article/ an unnamed government official: “ the legislation would also “give the province more flexibility to enter into joint ventures with developers and landowners.””.

 

[NoahB]

It also allows the Province to expropriate land before the hearings for it are finished. (Which the Star repeatedly said were non-binding anyway but can still delay a project for a whole year)

Everything he announced today seem to be 'common sense policies for speeding up projects.'

I'm cautiously optimistic. It's interesting though that this new legislation only applies to their 4 priority projects.

 

[allengeorge]

I believe the biggest change the government made to existing lines is increasing the radius that’s applicable for increased density.

It’s unclear if Toronto will let that fly, given that it would cut deep into the yellowbelt.

 

[NoahB]

I believe the biggest change the government made to existing lines is increasing the radius that’s applicable for increased density.

It’s unclear if Toronto will let that fly, given that it would cut deep into the yellowbelt.

This is the one thing I'm happy that Toronto won't get much say in. Bloor Street was supposed to intensify with the construction of the subway but the city barely rezoned to allow for that.

In Vancouver, Translink *requires* that cities upzone around new stations as a condition for the station's construction. That should be the model here too.

 

[Towered]

This is the one thing I'm happy that Toronto won't get much say in. Bloor Street was supposed to intensify with the construction of the subway but the city barely rezoned to allow for that.

In Vancouver, Translink *requires* that city upzone around new stations as a condition for the station's construction. That should be the model here too.

I was going to say, the province could start this initiative now along already existing transit lines. It's kind of ridiculous that after more than 50 years after the subway was built along Bloor, most of the street is still lined with 2-3 storey buildings.

 

[robmausser]

It’s unclear if Toronto will let that fly

 

[Jaye101]

This is the one thing I'm happy that Toronto won't get much say in. Bloor Street was supposed to intensify with the construction of the subway but the city barely rezoned to allow for that.

In Vancouver, Translink *requires* that cities upzone around new stations as a condition for the station's construction. That should be the model here too.

Fun fact, Toronto never wanted the subway on Bloor.

 

[warrens]

On the second point, a quote from the article/ an unnamed government official: “ the legislation would also “give the province more flexibility to enter into joint ventures with developers and landowners.””.

That's got to be a good thing. Look at the station designs for Crosstown.... they are pretty much all standalone buildings that could've been a multi-story, multi-purpose building of some sort. Sherbourne Station is an example of what I mean. If nothing else, it'd have given more people an opportunity to have a direct connection to public transit without having to go outside.

 

[rbt]

That's got to be a good thing. Look at the station designs for Crosstown.... they are pretty much all standalone buildings that could've been a multi-story, multi-purpose building of some sort. Sherbourne Station is an example of what I mean. If nothing else, it'd have given more people an opportunity to have a direct connection to public transit without having to go outside.

Crosstown definitely missed a trick BUT waiting (as we are with GO stations) until a private developer is ready is also not terribly efficient. There's got to be a way to build a station with the foundation for supporting another structure over it, without needing someone immediately ready to build in the air-rights.

Big question about Ontario Line is will stations without an immediate joint venture still be able to support construction above it at a later date for a reasonable price?

 

[ARG1]

Crosstown definitely missed a trick BUT waiting (as we are with GO stations) until a private developer is ready is also not terribly efficient. There's got to be a way to build a station with the foundation for supporting another structure over it, without needing someone immediately ready to build in the air-rights.

Big question about Ontario Line is will stations without an immediate joint venture still be able to support construction above it at a later date for a reasonable price?

Can't you just have the exits built with temporary structures until a developer is ready? I know that this isn't exactly the most marketable solution but its a solution nonetheless.

 

[warrens]

Big question about Ontario Line is will stations without an immediate joint venture still be able to support construction above it at a later date for a reasonable price?

You probably don't want building construction going on directly above an active TTC station.

No, the design would need to be integrated from the outset. Residential properties need things like loading bays, elevators, bike parking on the main or B1 levels.

Now I say all this, but how many OL stations would it need to apply to? Probably just Cosburn and Gerrard Square, right? Maybe Moss Park? East Harbour is a special case due to GO integration.... Osgoode, Queen/Yonge, Pape, Science Centre are going under existing stations. There's no space at Exhibition. King/Bathurst is fully built up already and there are protected heritage properties to consider. Queen/Spadina is probably going 100% under the street to accommodate transfers. Corktown is getting pretty full, too.

I know, right, it's super weird to think that we are contemplating building subway stations where there's already.... you know.... people!

 

[TheTigerMaster]

You probably don't want building construction going on directly above an active TTC station.

No, the design would need to be integrated from the outset. Residential properties need things like loading bays, elevators, bike parking on the main or B1 levels.

Now I say all this, but how many OL stations would it need to apply to? Probably just Cosburn and Gerrard Square, right? Maybe Moss Park? East Harbour is a special case due to GO integration.... Osgoode, Queen/Yonge, Pape, Science Centre are going under existing stations. There's no space at Exhibition. King/Bathurst is fully built up already and there are protected heritage properties to consider. Queen/Spadina is probably going 100% under the street to accommodate transfers. Corktown is getting pretty full, too.

I know, right, it's super weird to think that we are contemplating building subway stations where there's already.... you know.... people!

Thorncliffe Park could recieve a similar treatment too. A shopping complex connected straight to the subway would do well there

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Crosstown definitely missed a trick BUT waiting (as we are with GO stations) until a private developer is ready is also not terribly efficient. There's got to be a way to build a station with the foundation for supporting another structure over it, without needing someone immediately ready to build in the air-rights.

Big question about Ontario Line is will stations without an immediate joint venture still be able to support construction above it at a later date for a reasonable price?

Can't you just have the exits built with temporary structures until a developer is ready? I know that this isn't exactly the most marketable solution but its a solution nonetheless.

I’m pretty sure the Crosstown’s exists were designed with that specific intention. At least some of them.