Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s

BurlOak said:
If the Ontario Line Business Case shows that it's much better than the DRL, I wonder what the DRL business case showed.
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It showed it was a hell of a lot more useful to travellers when it went to Science Centre Station and double that to Don Mills Station. The city scaled its ambitions to what seemed financially possible and designed the next Stubway to Pape.
 
W. K. Lis said:
People are now at the point where we want SOMETHING built already... yesterday!
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Agree.

Build something and if it becomes saturated, then we build the Relief Line Relief Line. It’s bone-headed or brain dead or both to think that in Manhattan North this will be the last subway line. It won’t.
 
I shudder to think how long Relief Line 2 would take to study, plan and build.
 
TransitBart said:
Agree.

Build something and if it becomes saturated, then we build the Relief Line Relief Line. It’s bone-headed or brain dead or both to think that in Manhattan North this will be the last subway line. It won’t.
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This kind of approach has never worked out.
 
Love the facetious leaps of logic being displayed in this forum of late. Who cares if the Ontario Line is not heavy rail in the same vein as the existing subway network? It'll be fully grade separated and even tunneled underground over 60% of its route length, plus gives us 15 stations in relative immediacy instead of just 8. I was never a fan of the DRL skipping a Parliament Street intersecting stop as that's a major juncture that'd serve a lot of densely populated communities and nodes to the north and south (Regent Park, Cabbagetown, Distillery District). It's also asinine not to utilize the rail corridor as ROW when both corridors overlap so closely through Riverdale.

So to say everything about the OL is bad is probably stemming more from who's delivering it than actual legitimate faults.
 
Hopkins123 said:
Love the facetious leaps of logic being displayed in this forum of late. Who cares if the Ontario Line is not heavy rail in the same vein as the existing subway network? It'll be fully grade separated and even tunneled underground over 60% of its route length, plus gives us 15 stations in relative immediacy instead of just 8. I was never a fan of the DRL skipping a Parliament Street intersecting stop as that's a major juncture that'd serve a lot of densely populated communities and nodes to the north and south (Regent Park, Cabbagetown, Distillery District). It's also asinine not to utilize the rail corridor as ROW when both corridors overlap so closely through Riverdale.

So to say everything about the OL is bad is probably stemming more from who's delivering it than actual legitimate faults.
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You are aware that the Prov has literally scrapped a plan, and a couple years of the Prov's very own studies on the northern leg, for...a concept? Sure I get the "build something" mentality. But if that holds water how about we build pre-something, the plan that preceded something. That's something too. Starting from scratch, and that's being hopeful it continues from the starting phase, is a fairly legitimate fault.
 
Hopkins123 said:
Love the facetious leaps of logic being displayed in this forum of late. Who cares if the Ontario Line is not heavy rail in the same vein as the existing subway network? It'll be fully grade separated and even tunneled underground over 60% of its route length, plus gives us 15 stations in relative immediacy instead of just 8. I was never a fan of the DRL skipping a Parliament Street intersecting stop as that's a major juncture that'd serve a lot of densely populated communities and nodes to the north and south (Regent Park, Cabbagetown, Distillery District). It's also asinine not to utilize the rail corridor as ROW when both corridors overlap so closely through Riverdale.

So to say everything about the OL is bad is probably stemming more from who's delivering it than actual legitimate faults.
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Clearly you didn't actually read any of the criticisms of the Ontario line concept.

The line just had a business case, and a really shitty one at that (full of confirmation biases). If that is enough to convince you that the plan is sound and automatically superior to the Relief line plan, then there is a problem.
 
We'll all be arguing about this till next year when a more detail design emerges. Ultimately we need more information. Can this be built at a reasonable price within budget?

One thing the business report is right. The Don River and East Harbour area is prone to flooding. How do we know the RL won't flood? There is also a high risk the station box might flood during construction causing unforecasted delays. The DVP in the area floods every year. Underground parking garages along QQ floods for weeks, how do they plan to keep the station dry?
 
Hopkins123 said:
I was never a fan of the DRL skipping a Parliament Street intersecting stop as that's a major juncture that'd serve a lot of densely populated communities and nodes to the north and south (Regent Park, Cabbagetown, Distillery District). It's also asinine not to utilize the rail corridor as ROW when both corridors overlap so closely through Riverdale.
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You greatly overestimate the drawing power of Parliament St.

Plus, there were/are to be stops at Sherbourne and Sumach. Those would cover very, very large swatches of the neighbourhoods that you are so worried about.

Dan
 
Allandale25 said:
Is there a full version of that map available? What's the source?
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Its an updated snap of a larger map I've posted before on the Fantasy Thread...my update of the Metrolinx map with everything that's been put on the table in the GTHA, made with Inkscape. Just cross-posted the full one here.
 
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Hopkins123 said:
Love the facetious leaps of logic being displayed in this forum of late. Who cares if the Ontario Line is not heavy rail in the same vein as the existing subway network? It'll be fully grade separated and even tunneled underground over 60% of its route length, plus gives us 15 stations in relative immediacy instead of just 8. I was never a fan of the DRL skipping a Parliament Street intersecting stop as that's a major juncture that'd serve a lot of densely populated communities and nodes to the north and south (Regent Park, Cabbagetown, Distillery District). It's also asinine not to utilize the rail corridor as ROW when both corridors overlap so closely through Riverdale.

So to say everything about the OL is bad is probably stemming more from who's delivering it than actual legitimate faults.
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We already know what Michael Shambles sardine cans are like in Scarborough. He's not an expert he's a pusher. Just like the RT disaster it will be 85% full on the first day with no room for expansion because everything is stretched to the limit just to make his product viable.

smallspy said:
You greatly overestimate the drawing power of Parliament St.

Plus, there were/are to be stops at Sherbourne and Sumach. Those would cover very, very large swatches of the neighbourhoods that you are so worried about.

Dan
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I thought Toronto was done building subway stations under highways but this city never ever learns.

The daily overcrowding on the sidewalks and surface routes on King through to Parliament turns sparse to the east so no. Regent Park is only expected to have 12,000 people when it gets fully built out and most of anyone using this line wouldn't walk to it because their up by Gerrard. There's probably at least half that in the office buildings down in the area, then you add active student centres and hangouts and closer proximity to tourist areas. Note I'm not including any future planned offices or condos in the area either.
 
Forgotten said:
I thought Toronto was done building subway stations under highways but this city never ever learns.
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What highway are they planning on building over either of those stations, on either of the planned alignments? The only highway located close to a station would be at the Exhibition Station on the Ontario Line.

Forgotten said:
The daily overcrowding on the sidewalks and surface routes on King through to Parliament turns sparse to the east so no. Regent Park is only expected to have 12,000 people when it gets fully built out and most of anyone using this line wouldn't walk to it because their up by Gerrard. There's probably at least half that in the office buildings down in the area, then you add active student centres and hangouts and closer proximity to tourist areas. Note I'm not including any future planned offices or condos in the area either.
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Daily overcrowding? Please. The area is busy and getting busier, but let's not conflate the reality with the area as it sits now and with what is likely to happen in the near future with any fantasy visions of what it might become in some sort of idealistic world.

As for Regent Park, it's always going to be a long walk from the bulk of neighbourhood no matter when you situate the station. Siting the station at Parliament or at Sumach isn't really going to change things greatly.

Dan
 
smallspy said:
What highway are they planning on building over either of those stations, on either of the planned alignments? The only highway located close to a station would be at the Exhibition Station on the Ontario Line.
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Probably referring to the Sumach station from the previous plan that was to be built under the Richmond/Adelaide overpass.
 
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