Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s

[DKB]

Would it make sense to bring down queen street street cars to tunnel level via portals. (between approx. sherbourne and spadina)?

 

[syn]

People complaining about noise?
How is this an issue when we have Line 2 being exposed literally meters away from apartments and houses around Old Mills, Keele, High Park with not many problems? (other than the recent screeching problem which is happening underground)

If anything we as riders lose the great views the Ontario line would have providedat the bridgesat the Don River.

The gov should just provide incentives to upgrade the windows of the affected areas or something.

The areas of exposure in these sections are quite small. In the case of Old Mill, it really doesn't impact residential areas as it travels above a park and the Humber River.

With the OL, the above ground portion is quite long. At 90 second frequencies, along with GO traffic you're left with an understandable problem for local residents. This is before we even address capacity concerns (for both GO and the OL).

 

[11th]

Stupid part is that one of the reasons we have the SSE extension is to eliminate the transfer from the subway to the RT. Elevating the Ontario Line at Don Mills just creates another Kennedy station and we're back to the drawing board.

The transfer at Kennedy is detested not just because of the underground-to-elevated characteristic, but because a big portion of the passengers getting off at Kennedy have their destinations beyond Kennedy. The SRT is seen as an extension of B-D line.

 

[syn]

Just noticed this in a Star article

"After hours of deputations from the public, the committee approved a motion Tory introduced that requested Metrolinx mitigate negative impacts of the new transit projects, consult with communities, and consider building additional sections of the Ontario Line underground."

Seems like there will eventually be some major changes to this line.

 

[Hopkins123]

Just noticed this in a Star article

"After hours of deputations from the public, the committee approved a motion Tory introduced that requested Metrolinx mitigate negative impacts of the new transit projects, consult with communities, and consider building additional sections of the Ontario Line underground."

Seems like there will eventually be some major changes to this line.

There's nothing wrong with tunneling some parts. It's a given the section along Pape, for instance, must be tunneled. We're just being granted with the Ontario Line the opportunity to do a mixture of at-, below- and above-grade segments, in ways the City's DRL proposal simply would not have allowed. Better to tinker with the proposal we've got presented in front of us now than abort it and go back to the drawing board yet again as has been the case one too many times with this City's planning governance.

 

[syn]

There's nothing wrong with tunneling some parts. It's a given the section along Pape, for instance, must be tunneled. We're just being granted with the Ontario Line the opportunity to do a mixture of at-, below- and above-grade segments, in ways the City's DRL proposal simply would not have allowed. Better to tinker with the proposal we've got presented in front of us now than abort it and go back to the drawing board yet again as has been the case one too many times with this City's planning governance.

They're already back at the drawing board. The DRL south was much further along in the design phase than the OL.

The problem with the OL's 'mix' is that it proposes above ground rail through dense areas and requires technology that severely hampers capacity. It makes no sense, especially when you're building full capacity subways in low density suburbs.

This is why the OL's south alignment may see many changes based on what the city wants.

 

[smallspy]

The transfer at Kennedy is detested not just because of the underground-to-elevated characteristic, but because a big portion of the passengers getting off at Kennedy have their destinations beyond Kennedy. The SRT is seen as an extension of B-D line.

More than half of the people getting off of the subway at Kennedy are not getting onto the SRT.

Dan

 

[Krypto98]

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but what is the estimated travel time for the Ontario line end to end. The current best time is 1 hour going from Exhibition Go to Danforth Go, line 2 to pape and the 25b bus to science center.

 

[NoahB]

The areas of exposure in these sections are quite small. In the case of Old Mill, it really doesn't impact residential areas as it travels above a park and the Humber River.

With the OL, the above-ground portion is quite long. At 90 second frequencies, along with GO traffic, you're left with an understandable problem for local residents. This is before we even address capacity concerns (for both GO and the OL).

There's literally an apartment building on top of the station and apartments all around at Old Mill. Similar situation at High Park Station. I train watch over the Humber River bridge all the time. The train isn't that loud at all. The traffic on Bloor is louder!

 

[NoahB]

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but what is the estimated travel time for the Ontario line end to end. The current best time is 1 hour going from Exhibition Go to Danforth Go, line 2 to pape and the 25b bus to science center.

Going from King Station to Downsview Park (16km total, 16 stations in between, and many tight curves) takes about 36 minutes. I imagine it would be similar?

Currently, the Ontario Line page says it takes 17 minutes from Throrncliiffe to Queen. That's 9 stations end to end and about 10km.

 

[cplchanb]

There's literally an apartment building on top of the station and apartments all around at Old Mill. Similar situation at High Park Station. I train watch over the Humber River bridge all the time. The train isn't that loud at all. The traffic on Bloor is louder!

honestly it just sickens me that the minute number of these whiners are holding millions of potential riders hostage for another generation because of their personal distastes. You dont like it? move out! youre
living in a CITY FFS.... are they honestly expecting sound levels to be like a rural suburb? just listening to some of the petty grievances some of the people have and the councillors who would bend over to them just makes my blood boil.
these nimbyers are the prime reason why our infrastructure is so incomplete and disjointed. toronto has continually bent over and lubed up to their selfish demands just to garner votes and be spineless to the bigger picture.

 

[syn]

There's literally an apartment building on top of the station and apartments all around at Old Mill. Similar situation at High Park Station. I train watch over the Humber River bridge all the time. The train isn't that loud at all. The traffic on Bloor is louder!

Right. But that's relatively small compared to the OL exposure, above ground for about 2km downtown.

These trains are expected to be louder and more frequent as well.

 

[syn]

honestly it just sickens me that the minute number of these whiners are holding millions of potential riders hostage for another generation because of their personal distastes. You dont like it? move out! youre
living in a CITY FFS.... are they honestly expecting sound levels to be like a rural suburb? just listening to some of the petty grievances some of the people have and the councillors who would bend over to them just makes my blood boil.
these nimbyers are the prime reason why our infrastructure is so incomplete and disjointed. toronto has continually bent over and lubed up to their selfish demands just to garner votes and be spineless to the bigger picture.

Of course not. The problem is that they're adding a significant amount to an already dense urban area. No reason it can't be underground.

It's funny when people complain about holding transit back for a generation, because that's what the Ford's managed to do as soon as they took office. If people in the suburbs are supposed to have all their demands met (or so we're told) then why should it be any different for people in the city, the one area where underground transit makes the most sense?

 

[cplchanb]

Of course not. The problem is that they're adding a significant amount to an already dense urban area. No reason it can't be underground.

It's funny when people complain about holding transit back for a generation, because that's what the Ford's managed to do as soon as they took office. If people in the suburbs are supposed to have all their demands met (or so we're told) then why should it be any different for people in the city, the one area where underground transit makes the most sense?

I honestly dont get the fetish that every metro must be underground to be successful. there are plenty of successful over ground metros around the world that can be used a reference. right now we are too inclined to cater to the 5% rather than the 95% who just want something convenient that can take them from a to b. The drl, allen express, sheppard stub, Scarborough RT cancer and others are all this way because a few loud people dissented and the politicians catered to their demands without considering what the vast majority wanted. They should put these large infrastructure projects to a referendum and decide based on simple majority.

 

[syn]

I honestly dont get the fetish that every metro must be underground to be successful. there are plenty of successful over ground metros around the world that can be used a reference. right now we are too inclined to cater to the 5% rather than the 95% who just want something convenient that can take them from a to b. The drl, allen express, sheppard stub, Scarborough RT cancer and others are all this way because a few loud people dissented and the politicians catered to their demands without considering what the vast majority wanted. They should put these large infrastructure projects to a referendum and decide based on simple majority.

No one is suggesting overground trains can't be successful. It's funny you call the Scarborough RT a cancer - perhaps that might help you understand why local residents would be against a long stretch of additional overground transit.

In this particular context overground means reduced capacity, both for TTC and potentially future GO expansion.

There are plenty of good reasons this should be underground, the least of which are noise concerns (not that those aren't valid either).