News   Dec 11, 2019
 391     0 
News   Dec 11, 2019
 494     4 
News   Dec 11, 2019
 834     7 

Ontario Line (was Relief Line South, in Design)

sixrings

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Messages
4,254
Reaction score
1,336
As a downtown elite, you can justify and make excuses for your position all you want. I rode that line in the 70's and 80s. Streety is correct, they were busier than Chester, Donlands and Main combined. You are just spouting your "urban vs suburban" BS to try and baffle us. As for Eglington...now that it is down to two traffic lanes each way permanently...well I guess you'll be celebrating
I see you spent your Sunday dipping into your buck a beer case. Hope you have some coffee for the morning.
 

syn

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 26, 2007
Messages
4,271
Reaction score
1,737
As a downtown elite, you can justify and make excuses for your position all you want. I rode that line in the 70's and 80s. Streety is correct, they were busier than Chester, Donlands and Main combined. You are just spouting your "urban vs suburban" BS to try and baffle us. As for Eglington...now that it is down to two traffic lanes each way permanently...well I guess you'll be celebrating
What about the rest of them? How far apart are they? How many buses/lines serve these stations?

Is Warden now a dense urban environment after 50+ years?
 

bbanner102097

New Member
Member Bio
Joined
May 2, 2019
Messages
10
Reaction score
10
The Technical Advisor assignment for the full line is posted on MERX:

Two things, among many others, jump out to me as concerning: the unachievable delivery schedule that has the TA starting by November 2019 and having the RFP for the main design-build contract issued by September 2020 with a full reference concept design, scope, utility issues, property impacts, risk transfer regime, and performance/output specs, etc. completed; and the fact that this assignment is not planned to have a guaranteed maximum price (see Schedule 4) all the way through to end of construction in 2027 😉.

How do IO and Mx get away with procuring these monster consultant assignments, with little to no firm scope and achievable deliverables established, and still satisfy public procurement standards and withstand the scrutiny of the AGO? This will be a cash cow for the hand-picked, likely international consulting firm and their sub-consultant buddies. There are a lot more interesting tidbits in the document that I don't have time to go into right now.

I heard Ben Spurr of The Star will have a piece tomorrow on the concerns from the Riverdale community. Before people dismiss this as the usual Nimby-ism, hopefully they consider the ridiculously compressed timeframe for this assignment and assess how much time and effort Mx can actually put toward consultation, options analysis and mitigation efforts.
 

raptor

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 23, 2007
Messages
2,652
Reaction score
3,577
The Technical Advisor assignment for the full line is posted on MERX:

Two things, among many others, jump out to me as concerning: the unachievable delivery schedule that has the TA starting by November 2019 and having the RFP for the main design-build contract issued by September 2020 with a full reference concept design, scope, utility issues, property impacts, risk transfer regime, and performance/output specs, etc. completed; and the fact that this assignment is not planned to have a guaranteed maximum price (see Schedule 4) all the way through to end of construction in 2027 😉.

How do IO and Mx get away with procuring these monster consultant assignments, with little to no firm scope and achievable deliverables established, and still satisfy public procurement standards and withstand the scrutiny of the AGO? This will be a cash cow for the hand-picked, likely international consulting firm and their sub-consultant buddies. There are a lot more interesting tidbits in the document that I don't have time to go into right now.

I heard Ben Spurr of The Star will have a piece tomorrow on the concerns from the Riverdale community. Before people dismiss this as the usual Nimby-ism, hopefully they consider the ridiculously compressed timeframe for this assignment and assess how much time and effort Mx can actually put toward consultation, options analysis and mitigation efforts.
Or, perhaps, this schedule is rather normal, and all other transit projects before it were too stretched out?
 

bbanner102097

New Member
Member Bio
Joined
May 2, 2019
Messages
10
Reaction score
10
Or, perhaps, this schedule is rather normal, and all other transit projects before it were too stretched out?
I doubt those with experience and appreciation for the amount of technical, environmental, commercial and legal work that still needs to be done on this project would agree with this. The knock-on effects of having the portals on the west side of the Don on planned USRC projects (train storage and signalling), the Gardiner re-alignment, the East Harbour TOD, flood protection, re-alignment of the Bala Sub into Corktown Commons, etc. have yet to be fully realized (or honestly acknowledged). All of this at the same time that Mx is desperately scrambling to lock down the scope for the Mother-Of-All-DBFOM's, to finalize a coherent RFP document that will retain the interests of the international bidders, their lenders, and their insurers.

Of course, I'm not even flagging the issues abound with the proposed alignment at the other end at Exhibition. This is all just political window-dressing, imo.
 

raptor

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 23, 2007
Messages
2,652
Reaction score
3,577
I doubt those with experience and appreciation for the amount of technical, environmental, commercial and legal work that still needs to be done on this project would agree with this. The knock-on effects of having the portals on the west side of the Don on planned USRC projects (train storage and signalling), the Gardiner re-alignment, the East Harbour TOD, flood protection, re-alignment of the Bala Sub into Corktown Commons, etc. have yet to be fully realized (or honestly acknowledged). All of this at the same time that Mx is desperately scrambling to lock down the scope for the Mother-Of-All-DBFOM's, to finalize a coherent RFP document that will retain the interests of the international bidders, their lenders, and their insurers.

Of course, I'm not even flagging the issues abound with the proposed alignment at the other end at Exhibition. This is all just political window-dressing, imo.
I have two words for you: beaurocracy and consultants. Other countries can build transit faster.
 

syn

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 26, 2007
Messages
4,271
Reaction score
1,737

CapitalSeven

Active Member
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 25, 2007
Messages
788
Reaction score
222
I predicted this on July 24, but I guessed 60 trains per hour. Not too far off. I lived on DeGrassi for a while in the 80s and can still remember how the GO trains brought life to a stop for a few seconds now and then. But not 80 times an hour.
 

Admiral Beez

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 28, 2007
Messages
7,562
Reaction score
1,758
It's never going to be built, so don't sweat it. We're now 30% or 439 days into DoFo's 1,017 day tenure as premier. In that time nothing has been formally planned, no environmental reviews or feasibility studies have been completed, nor have the past approved DRL plans been reviewed and formally adjusted.

Halloween marks the halfway point of DoFo's government, let's see if anything is underway anywhere in railed transit.
 

crs1026

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Oct 16, 2014
Messages
5,650
Reaction score
6,281
^These folks might actually help in arguing against a design that uses smaller trains but pushes the envelope in frequency to achieve the desired capacity. Bigger trains that run less frequently might appeal to these folks.

- Paul
 

Admiral Beez

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 28, 2007
Messages
7,562
Reaction score
1,758
^These folks might actually help in arguing against a design that uses smaller trains but pushes the envelope in frequency to achieve the desired capacity. Bigger trains that run less frequently might appeal to these folks.

- Paul
I'd like to see the DRL run the exact same trains as the other three main lines. A disparate fleet may offer savings upfront, but not when you need to dig it out again to expand to "regular" subways in 30 years.
 

Top