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Ontario Line (was Relief Line South, in Design)

Hopkins123

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Ontario Line is a subway or what? if not subway then promise is broke!
Scarborough RT is not a subway but we regard it as such, and even display it on our subway maps, likewise the soon to be completed Eglinton Crosstown Line. This semantics game UTers like to play in a bid to win arguments is pathetically sad.
 

Deaf_Torontian

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Scarborough RT is not a subway but we regard it as such, and even display it on our subway maps, likewise the soon to be completed Eglinton Crosstown Line. This semantics game UTers like to play in a bid to win arguments is pathetically sad.
I know Scarborough RT is not a subway and RT just like Vancouver SkyTrain but my question is ... ABOUT ONTARIO LINE: Ontario Line will have a subway or what? that all I need to know because I do remember all rumours said Relief Line will be Subway like 100% PROMISED! then now Ford changed it? New "Ontario Line" and Train will not be Subway? will be Light Train? make me sad because I always want to see Toronto Downtown like Manhattan mean we need more Subway Line and Station in Toronto Downtown area, sighing
 

junctionist

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Just as the Model T Ford was fine for its time. No side windows. No air-conditioning. No mirrors.


From link.

The Tesla Model E would be fine for today or tomorrow.


From link.

The bad news would be that there would be much more parts that could and will break down, and you can't fix it by yourself.
Electric motors are simpler and lower maintenance than internal combustion engines. Teslas don’t even need oil changes. The downside is that for a lot of people, Teslas aren’t fine for today or tomorrow on account of the charging time needed to get maximum range.
 

W. K. Lis

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Steve Munro rebuttal to Metrolinx "Business Case" is at this link.

...Broadly speaking, the Ontario Line is projected to cost about 50% more than the Relief Line South while delivering twice the length of new rapid transit. The roughly 10% discount assumed for P3 delivery is dubious, especially if the project is rushed, and therefore not specified in sufficient detail, to meet a political opening date rather than one that is technically and professionally responsible.

From a staging point of view, beginning the tunnel at the southwest end of the line while the maintenance yard will be at the northeast guarantees that a staged opening of the core section will be impossible. This presents the political problem that the city will endure all of the upheaval of construction on faith that the entire line will actually open when promised.

Important questions remain about the degree to which use of the GO corridor might compromise future GO plans for additional service and electrification. That has a value, but it is not included in the Ontario Line’s cost.

Overall, there are some ideas in the Ontario Line that are worth looking at in detail, but Metrolinx really needs to get beyond its love for condescending remarks about the existing TTC/City plans which were shaped by the political environment of their day, including the then-orthodoxy at Queen’s Park.

Phil Verster and his crew now must deliver, and there will be a strong incentive for Metrolinx to present the best possible face for the project. A good comparison has been the Scarborough Subway project which, regardless of one’s opinion on the scheme, suffered from low-balling the cost estimate practically from the day it was proposed. The degree to which accurate information about that line was hidden is now well-known. Metrolinx is an even more secretive organization than the City/TTC and there is little reason to expect that they will be forthcoming with information.

Whatever it is called, a Relief Line linking Don Mills to downtown is too important to be fouled up in posturing and secrecy.

Personally, I think that Steve Munro is a better "expert" on transit than the alleged experts at Metrolinx... and much better than the post-secondary school dropout, Doug Ford. (Doug should go back to what he is better qualified for, pushing a broomstick.)
 

syn

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Steve Munro rebuttal to Metrolinx "Business Case" is at this link.

Personally, I think that Steve Munro is a better "expert" on transit than the alleged experts at Metrolinx... and much better than the post-secondary school dropout, Doug Ford. (Doug should go back to what he is better qualified for, pushing a broomstick.)
Outstanding article. Does a great job outlining the flaws in the plan and the lowballed cost.

Thanks for sharing.
 

Streety McCarface

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Steve Munro rebuttal to Metrolinx "Business Case" is at this link.




Personally, I think that Steve Munro is a better "expert" on transit than the alleged experts at Metrolinx... and much better than the post-secondary school dropout, Doug Ford. (Doug should go back to what he is better qualified for, pushing a broomstick.)
It shouldn't have to take Steve's time to actually refute the business case, it was done extremely poorly and any civil engineer could figure that out just by looking at the cost breakdown. Thank god we still have Munro, he's probably the last sane voice the City of Toronto, the news media, the TTC, and Metrolinx will listen to.
 

BurlOak

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If the Ontario Line Business Case shows that it's much better than the DRL, I wonder what the DRL business case showed.
 

sixrings

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If the Ontario Line Business Case shows that it's much better than the DRL, I wonder what the DRL business case showed.
Probably not much. The DRL was developed by elites who have money. People with money like paying higher taxes for no good reason. So logic goes out the window. Plus Doug was smart enough to rename the line "Ontario" because one day it will be such a great line it will likely extend out of Toronto. Pickering perhaps?
 

dowlingm

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Depressing if's true that Mr. Shambles is making a balls of OL as he did SmartTrack and Glen Murray's high speed rail.
 

Rainforest

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I think there will ultimately be a case to have it go to Markham’s dense city centre that’s currently being developed. By then, though, the relief line might need a relief line of its own.
And that's why it might be Relief Line 2 that goes to Markham Centre. RL 1 will not have enough capacity for that.
 

MisterF

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There's already a rapid transit line to Markham Centre: the Stouffville GO line, which will be upgraded to RER. A new subway to Markham Centre would do little more than duplicate existing infrastructure for no reason. Let's stick with building subways where they make sense.
 

sixrings

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There's already a rapid transit line to Markham Centre: the Stouffville GO line, which will be upgraded to RER. A new subway to Markham Centre would do little more than duplicate existing infrastructure for no reason. Let's stick with building subways where they make sense.
The Stouffville GO line costs significantly more than a etc token and is therefore an attack on poor people. When will the elites learn that not everyone can afford to live in Toronto. They shouldn't be punished with a long commute which costs significantly more.
 

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