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What I find surprising is that it took a siege and the invoking of the Emergencies Act to have a clamp down on crowd funding sources plus all the corrupt money that gets laundered here. Why was it never scrunitized nor dealt with years ago? Almost every other country knows it is basic 101 to control the flow of money and especially foreign money. What this shows is that our institutions are weak at enforcement and persecution.

A few years ago there was a report on corrupt money laundering and how it funds our economy. The most appalling part was that it’s so intertwined in the economy that going after it (if we even have the resources) will take down the economy and jobs. The banking sector is also so opaque that it refuses to cooperate with any sort of investigation that deals with corrupt money cause they make a pretty penny off of it.

What I’m getting at here and it has shown to the world, we talk a good game but have no substance what so ever. I’m willing to bet that if the US didn’t voice concern and offer assistance there wouldn’t be the urgency to invoke the Emergencies Act. It’s also sad that we can’t deal with these protestors as we’re too afraid and use the excuse of the Charter of Rights. Too bad we couldn’t hose them down with water cannons like they do in Europe and leave them to hang to dry in the cold.

My 2 cents.

 

[Admiral Beez]

I am almost sympathetic to some of them - misguided, but a good number of them aren't truly dreadful people.

Good people on both sides? Sounds too close to Trump for my liking.

Bergen pushed O'Toole to back convoy saying there are 'good people on both sides': sources

Interim Conservative Leader Candice Bergen pushed predecessor Erin O'Toole to show support for the Freedom Convoy protest, arguing last week there are 'good people on both sides,' an echo of the phrase made infamous by former U.S. president Donald Trump after a Unite the Right rally in...

www.ctvnews.ca

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Good people on both sides? Sounds too close to Trump for my liking.

Bergen pushed O'Toole to back convoy saying there are 'good people on both sides': sources

Interim Conservative Leader Candice Bergen pushed predecessor Erin O'Toole to show support for the Freedom Convoy protest, arguing last week there are 'good people on both sides,' an echo of the phrase made infamous by former U.S. president Donald Trump after a Unite the Right rally in...

www.ctvnews.ca

Not so much so good people on both sides, as a way to justify bad behaviour - but being proportionate.

AoD

 

[Admiral Beez]

What I find surprising is that it took a siege and the invoking of the Emergencies Act to have a clamp down on crowd funding sources plus all the corrupt money that gets laundered here.

I imagine tons of money is laundered in Canada. When we invite investor class immigrants to Canada do we care where the money came from to open that industrial bakery, restaurant, imp/exp firm or other business? Or those international students that all our universities now covet, where is that money for tuition coming from? Or all the dirty money buying up our real estate? Do we care? Of course not.

 

[lenaitch]

Well you can call it that. I am more interested in exactly who did what and why - and then have head(s) fall accordingly after those has been ascertained. Is this just a simple leadership issue - or is it mixed in with all sorts of organizational dysfunction that we would all be better for aired out in public when the dust settles?

I want to see heads fall - but only the deserving heads fall.

AoD

Prefaced by the reality that I know nothing about the internals of the OPS, it could well be one is a child of the other; internal command disfunction born of poor leadership. It seems the current flavour of police chief is one that fills a lot of social justice adjectives that seem to be wanting when the poo hits the fan. Like any corporation, ineffective/disfunctional/weak, etc. leadership skates along when times are good. According to the press, it is complained that his a yeller. I worked for one of those. Always motivational.

I can't recall if it was in this forum or another, but I speculated not long ago that one of the reasons the other major policing partners might be reluctant to commit their personnel into the fray was the want of a viable tactical plan. Seems I might have been right.

What I find surprising is that it took a siege and the invoking of the Emergencies Act to have a clamp down on crowd funding sources plus all the corrupt money that gets laundered here. Why was it never scrunitized nor dealt with years ago? Almost every other country knows it is basic 101 to control the flow of money and especially foreign money. What this shows is that our institutions are weak at enforcement and persecution.

A few years ago there was a report on corrupt money laundering and how it funds our economy. The most appalling part was that it’s so intertwined in the economy that going after it (if we even have the resources) will take down the economy and jobs. The banking sector is also so opaque that it refuses to cooperate with any sort of investigation that deals with corrupt money cause they make a pretty penny off of it.

What I’m getting at here and it has shown to the world, we talk a good game but have no substance what so ever. I’m willing to bet that if the US didn’t voice concern and offer assistance there wouldn’t be the urgency to invoke the Emergencies Act. It’s also sad that we can’t deal with these protestors as we’re too afraid and use the excuse of the Charter of Rights. Too bad we couldn’t hose them down with water cannons like they do in Europe and leave them to hang to dry in the cold.

My 2 cents.

To me it just another example. In financial terms, events like the Panama Papers et al have highlighted our weakness in areas such as money source tracking and corporate governance disclosure. It is also apparent in areas such as international diplomacy, peacekeeping, defence, etc. It seems we loose interest the minute after the speech is made.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Prefaced by the reality that I know nothing about the internals of the OPS, it could well be one is a child of the other; internal command disfunction born of poor leadership. It seems the current flavour of police chief is one that fills a lot of social justice adjectives that seem to be wanting when the poo hits the fan. Like any corporation, ineffective/disfunctional/weak, etc. leadership skates along when times are good. According to the press, it is complained that his a yeller. I worked for one of those. Always motivational.

I can't recall if it was in this forum or another, but I speculated not long ago that one of the reasons the other major policing partners might be reluctant to commit their personnel into the fray was the want of a viable tactical plan. Seems I might have been right.

To me it just another example. In financial terms, events like the Panama Papers et al have highlighted our weakness in areas such as money source tracking and corporate governance disclosure. It is also apparent in areas such as international diplomacy, peacekeeping, defence, etc. It seems we loose interest the minute after the speech is made.

The Star article was certainly suggestive of what you've said about internal strife - and yes, I think you did mentioned about the reluctance to commit personnel (there is also reports of front line frustration with not being able to act, and no plans for action even after the additional resources had been provided).

re: transparency - I think we are one of the very few jurisdictions around that doesn't offer any degree of transparency around ownership and control of numbered companies as well. Successive governments not having done much about these issues is maybe suggestive of how dependent our economy is on these quasi-(il)legal activities.

AoD

 

[lenaitch]

The Star article was certainly suggestive of what you've said about internal strife - and yes, I think you did mentioned about the reluctance to commit personnel (there is also reports of front line frustration with not being able to act, and no plans for action even after the additional resources had been provided).

re: transparency - I think we are one of the very few jurisdictions around that doesn't offer any degree of transparency around ownership and control of numbered companies as well. Successive governments not having done much about these issues is maybe suggestive of how dependent our economy is on these quasi-(il)legal activities.

AoD

Or at least overly beholden to corporate donations and/or not wanting to impair international investment. Jeez, we wring our hands over whether we should allow a Chinese company (by their law under the control of the state) to take over strategic resource companies.

 

[Bjays92]

Good people on both sides? Sounds too close to Trump for my liking.

Bergen pushed O'Toole to back convoy saying there are 'good people on both sides': sources

Interim Conservative Leader Candice Bergen pushed predecessor Erin O'Toole to show support for the Freedom Convoy protest, arguing last week there are 'good people on both sides,' an echo of the phrase made infamous by former U.S. president Donald Trump after a Unite the Right rally in...

www.ctvnews.ca

There can be good people on both sides, we know this especially because there are people who have managed to get out one way or another.

I am in no way advocating absolving these people of their actions, they must still take responsibility, but like AoD said, many of these people have been preyed on and deceived. While there are racists and bigots in their midst, there are also people who genuinely believe they're doing what's right and what's best. It's sad, it's sad they can't see what's really going on, it's sad they can't look around and see their surroundings, and they need to be held responsible. But many people are there because they genuinely think they're saving our country and that means they want to save our country and it's worth them putting themselves on the line to save it. To that end it's almost noble if it wasn't so pitiful.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

There can be good people on both sides, we know this especially because there are people who have managed to get out one way or another.

I am in no way advocating absolving these people of their actions, they must still take responsibility, but like AoD said, many of these people have been preyed on and deceived. While there are racists and bigots in their midst, there are also people who genuinely believe they're doing what's right and what's best. It's sad, it's sad they can't see what's really going on, it's sad they can't look around and see their surroundings, and they need to be held responsible. But many people are there because they genuinely think they're saving our country and that means they want to save our country and it's worth them putting themselves on the line to save it. To that end it's almost noble if it wasn't so pitiful.

I wouldn't go so far as "saving the country" - the country didn't need "saving", and we just had a fully democratic election 6 months ago. Just that I think being duped, immature, unthinking and acting on passions is not as serious a transgression as planning and orchestrating this exercise, and from the looks of it - consorting with radicals outside our borders to sow chaos. The former need to be held to account - by leaving the blockades now, or else. The latter need to be exposed, investigated and subjected to the fullest extent of the law - they are the brains behind this, and some of them are highly trained individuals who were previously tasked with safeguarding us - if they using these skills and turning against our country on account of acting against lawful policies, they need to be held fully accountable for their behaviour.

AoD

 

[Bjays92]

I wouldn't go so far as "saving the country" - the country didn't need "saving", and we just had a fully democratic election 6 months ago. Just that I think being duped, immature, unthinking and acting on passions is not as serious a transgression as planning and orchestrating this exercise, and from the looks of it - consorting with radicals outside our borders to sow chaos. The former need to be held to account - by leaving the blockades now, or else. The latter need to be exposed, investigated and subjected to the fullest extent of the law - they are the brains behind this, and some of them are highly trained individuals who were previously tasked with safeguarding us - if they using these skills and turning against our country on account of acting against lawful policies, they need to be held fully accountable for their behaviour.

AoD

The country doesn't need saving I agree. I'm just saying that's how these people see it and it's what they believe.

 

[Jonny5]

Good people on both sides:

RCMP charge four men with plotting to murder officers in connection with Coutts border protest

The arrests began after RCMP tactical officers raided two camper trailers and a mobile home on 1st Avenue North in Coutts shortly after midnight on Monday

www.theglobeandmail.com

Four Alberta men are in custody accused of plotting to murder RCMP officers and nine other people are facing weapons and mischief offences as part of what RCMP say was a significant and organized threat by a heavily armed group at the Coutts border protest RCMP say possible ties to larger extremist groups remain under investigation, and that more charges are possible, related both to the group and to other illegal activity at the border blockade.

A photo released by RCMP after the arrests showed a large cache of firearms and ammunition seized from the property, including 13 long guns, many with scopes, as well as loads of ammunition, high-capacity magazines, handguns, body armour, a large machete, and walkie-talkies.

Social-media posts by several of the individuals reflect anti-vaccination, anti-mask, conspiracy and anti-government sentiment. Body armour seized by RCMP in the raid includes patches identified with conspiracy and far-right movements. On social media, Mr. Carbert and Mr. Lysak have both interacted with posts by a man described by the Canadian Anti-Hate Network as the leader of a radical far-right movement that wants to bring about the dissolution of Canada, and the formation of a new country. ”I will die fighting for what I believe is right and I mean this,” Mr. Carbert wrote in October.

The self-described good apples tossed themselves into the rotten basket with, at best, childishly-naive ignorance, but more likely wilful ignorance.
"If I don't see the guns, they're not there! If I don't shoot anyone, it's not my fault!"

There's no excuses left now. Anyone continuing to participate in any of these protests, in any capacity, stands in full support and solidarity with the hate-filled violent views of the arrested and all of their associates at the other protests. No exceptions.

 

[Richard White]

Good people on both sides:

RCMP charge four men with plotting to murder officers in connection with Coutts border protest

The arrests began after RCMP tactical officers raided two camper trailers and a mobile home on 1st Avenue North in Coutts shortly after midnight on Monday

www.theglobeandmail.com

The self-described good apples tossed themselves into the rotten basket with, at best, childishly-naive ignorance, but more likely wilful ignorance.
"If I don't see the guns, they're not there! If I don't shoot anyone, it's not my fault!"

There's no excuses left now. Anyone continuing to participate in any capacity in any of these protests stands in full support and solidarity with the hate-filled violent views of the arrested and their associates at the other protests. No exceptions.

If the Conservatives keep supporting the "protests" it will only hurt them in the long run.

I understand they are the opposition and it is their job to provide an opposing viewpoint but there is a time and place for everything.

You're right. This isn't a protest anymore, it is becoming an organized attempt to use force against this nations government.

First they protest, next Theresa Tam, Dr Njoo and Minister DuClos are kidnapped or attacked.

This is likely why the Emergencies Act was invoked. The government didn't want to wait until something happened before acting.

 

[Admiral Beez]

I understand they are the opposition and it is their job to provide an opposing viewpoint....

So are the NDP, Greens and Bloc, unofficially, and they're criticizing the PM and government for not acting sooner or more effectively, rather than siding with the rebellion. That's smart opposition.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Good people on both sides:

RCMP charge four men with plotting to murder officers in connection with Coutts border protest

The arrests began after RCMP tactical officers raided two camper trailers and a mobile home on 1st Avenue North in Coutts shortly after midnight on Monday

www.theglobeandmail.com

The self-described good apples tossed themselves into the rotten basket with, at best, childishly-naive ignorance, but more likely wilful ignorance.
"If I don't see the guns, they're not there! If I don't shoot anyone, it's not my fault!"

There's no excuses left now. Anyone continuing to participate in any of these protests, in any capacity, stands in full support and solidarity with the hate-filled violent views of the arrested and all of their associates at the other protests. No exceptions.

The article didn't get fully into this - but some Redditors did:

https://www.reddit.com/r/alberta/comments/sta0xk/_/hx2qlgz

Note how certain individuals associated with Ezra's trope made a showing.

AoD

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

If the Conservatives keep supporting the "protests" it will only hurt them in the long run.

I understand they are the opposition and it is their job to provide an opposing viewpoint but there is a time and place for everything.

You're right. This isn't a protest anymore, it is becoming an organized attempt to use force against this nations government.

First they protest, next Theresa Tam, Dr Njoo and Minister DuClos are kidnapped or attacked.

This is likely why the Emergencies Act was invoked. The government didn't want to wait until something happened before acting.

Wait a minute - while I am sure some of them would like to do harm to our health officials, there is no evidence of actual plans to do that (that we know of).

AoD