581 Parliament St.

[Admiral Beez]

https://cabbagetowner.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/581_Parliament_St_Brochure.pdf

Yes, yes, yes! I am so pleased that this blight in Cabbagetown is going to be demolished and replaced with residential units. In my 23 years living in CT I’ve always hated how this gas station broke up the pedestrian retail strip on the east side Parliament St. between Winchester and Amelia. I hated how cars would dangerously cut in front of walking pedestrians and endanger northbound cyclists. I don’t know why this corner of Amelia and Parliament attracted so many beggars, addicts and mentally ill street people but this gas station seems to be a beacon to them. The litter and public urinating won‘t be missed. Demolishing this gas station can only improve this area of the city. I do hope there will be street facing retail in addition to residential.

 

[whatever]

That's potentially great for the neighbourhood, though I do wonder about how this impacts drivers. If the Church/Dundas Esso goes, and then this Petro-Canada closes, there really aren't many remaining options for gas in downtown east.

And it's not that we need gas stations that look like suburban filling stations with the big canopy roofs and a dozen pumps and a convenience store / Tim's attached. I know some European cities just have curbside pumps that look like they wouldn't take up much more space than a parking meter at street level. I'd happily forgo the remaining downtown gas stations if we were to go to that sort of setup.

 

[Admiral Beez]

That's potentially great for the neighbourhood, though I do wonder about how this impacts drivers.

I rarely fill up my cars or bike at that station. My normal fill up is at Laird on my way to Costco. I just hate the vibe at that Esso on Parliament. The few times I’ve used it I see the filth and litter, the dangerously darting cars, the beggars, guys pissing behind the Timmies, half broken down taxis, their drivers shouting at each other, and the noise of the place. It reminds me of a crazed market you might see in Raiders of the Lost Ark or something on Tatooine.

But really, within the next ten to fifteen years more than half of the new cars sold will be all-electric non-hybrid models. Gas stations will become as relevant as a farriers. Sign me up!

 

[AlbertC]

Parliament Street between Wellesley and Gerrard has remained low-rise mixed-use, so I'm curious what will eventually be built here. Going to estimate something between 8-12 storeys, maybe 15 max.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Parliament Street between Wellesley and Gerrard has remained low-rise mixed-use, so I'm curious what will eventually be built here. Going to estimate something between 8-12 storeys, maybe 15 max.

It’s calling for over 100 underground retail parking spaces. Must be something significant.

 

[Northern Light]

It’s calling for over 100 underground retail parking spaces. Must be something significant.

That's not in the sales brochure you linked to:

Its 101 residential parking spaces, 25 retail.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Which is still hilariously high for the location.

 

[UtakataNoAnnex]

Of all the many years I've been by there...why didn't I know there was a gas station there till now?

 

[Northern Light]

Which is still hilariously high for the location.

The parking supply you mean? Ya, to serve what's less than 6,000ft2 of retail you should not need 25 on-site spaces for retail, indeed, you really ought not to need any.

As to the residential supply, at 1 space per unit, on average, that's probably not far off the parking minimums for the area (though too high by a factor of 2, at least).

 

[innsertnamehere]

The parking supply you mean? Ya, to serve what's less than 6,000ft2 of retail you should not need 25 on-site spaces for retail, indeed, you really ought not to need any.

As to the residential supply, at 1 space per unit, on average, that's probably not far off the parking minimums for the area (though too high by a factor of 2, at least).

A typical 60/30/10 spread of unit sizes results in the base by-law rate for apartments in this location being about 0.65 spaces per unit. So it's even far above the base by-law parking requirements.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Which is still hilariously high for the location.

Not if they're planning to remove on-street parking to make way for separated bike lanes. Likely not in the plans, but it should be, all parking on mainstreets should be pushed into lots to free up space for bikes and wider sidewalks, etc.

 

[AlbertC]

Looks like the 7 storeys is a suggestion offered by Urban Strategies, who were engaged in the sales conception process. If I was a developer seeking this site out, I'd want at least 10 storeys to make my numbers work. But maybe 7 is a compromise to ease along the locals in an area that doesn't have much height precedent. Even though I don't live near here, I quite like Cabbagetown. Much of my early 20's was spent going to restaurants and bars in the area.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Looks like the 7 storeys is a suggestion offered by Urban Strategies, who were engaged in the sales conception process. If I was a developer seeking this site out, I'd want at least 10 storeys to make my numbers work. But maybe 7 is a compromise to ease along the locals in an area that doesn't have much height precedent. Even though I don't live near here, I quite like Cabbagetown. Much of my early 20's was spent going to restaurants and bars in the area.

At seven stories this will be the tallest building in all of Cabbagetown. Currently the Winchester Hotel building, with the Timmies at four stories plus the tower is the tallest. I wouldn‘t want anything taller. I hope the underground parking is off Amelia rather than Parliament, to keep pedestrians and cyclists safe. My greater concern is design, will it be a modern, steel and glass box or something with more traditional brick and casemate windows that suits CT.

 

[hawc]

I am so pleased that this blight in Cabbagetown is going to be demolished and replaced with residential units. In my 23 years living in CT I’ve always hated how this gas station broke up the pedestrian retail strip on the east side Parliament St. between Winchester and Amelia. I hated how cars would dangerously cut in front of walking pedestrians and endanger northbound cyclists. I don’t know why this corner of Amelia and Parliament attracted so many beggars, addicts and mentally ill street people but this gas station seems to be a beacon to them. I rarely fill up my cars or bike at that station. My normal fill up is at Laird on my way to Costco. I just hate the vibe at that Esso on Parliament. The few times I’ve used it I see the filth and litter, the dangerously darting cars, the beggars, guys pissing behind the Timmies, half broken down taxis, their drivers shouting at each other, and the noise of the place. It reminds me of a crazed market you might see in Raiders of the Lost Ark or something on Tatooine.

As a long time CT resident myself I completely disagree. All those people you've just marginalized are humans too. Just because they aren't the rich Cabbagetowners doesn't mean they don't have a right to be there also. The people experiencing homelessness who you call 'beggars, addicts and mentally ill' all have worth whether you find their presence a blight or not. I've always found them friendly and decent and if anything add some welcome character to the neighbourhood. Public urination points to a lack of city services. I find it equally offensive that you label the vibrant south-asian community that gathers at this station on warm summer evenings to swap stories as 'half broken down taxis and drivers shouting at each other like some crazed market from Tatooine'. Really??? Do you know how awful that sounds? The cars 'cutting dangerously in front of pedestrians' are simply people turning in and out of the station. I've never felt in danger. I feel much more danger by the cyclists riding on sidewalks and running the red lights at Carlton and Parliament. Good for you if you prefer to fill up your car near your favourite big box store, but some of us don't have that luxury. Perhaps you would be happier with a more suburban lifestyle the way you look down on your local neighbours. I've followed your posts on here for years, but this really changes my opinion of you. You're better than this.

 

[Admiral Beez]

As a long time CT resident myself I completely disagree. All those people you've just marginalized are humans too. Just because they aren't the rich Cabbagetowners doesn't mean they don't have a right to be there also. The people experiencing homelessness who you call 'beggars, addicts and mentally ill' all have worth whether you find their presence a blight or not. I've always found them friendly and decent and if anything add some welcome character to the neighbourhood. Public urination points to a lack of city services. I find it equally offensive that you label the vibrant south-asian community that gathers at this station on warm summer evenings to swap stories as 'half broken down taxis and drivers shouting at each other like some crazed market from Tatooine'. Really??? Do you know how awful that sounds? The cars 'cutting dangerously in front of pedestrians' are simply people turning in and out of the station. I've never felt in danger. I feel much more danger by the cyclists riding on sidewalks and running the red lights at Carlton and Parliament. Good for you if you prefer to fill up your car near your favourite big box store, but some of us don't have that luxury. Perhaps you would be happier with a more suburban lifestyle the way you look down on your local neighbours. I've followed your posts on here for years, but this really changes my opinion of you. You're better than this.

Fair points, and I am guilty of going over the top. Thanks for the reminder to be kinder. I’ve lived in CT for 23 years and am not going anywhere, especially as I watch the area change. The points you raise are good, and point to issues that need to be addressed, such as affordable and supportive house across the entire city, not only downtown east. Much of my frustration centres on how the city abandons its mentally ill, addicted and homeless disproportionally onto our neighbourhood. Toronto’s lack of public bathrooms has become notable since the restaurants closed. Regardless, this re-development can but improve the retail and pedestrian experience on Parliament, my intended central point.