W. K. Lis
Superstar
During WWII, the civilians fought with molotov cocktails, rifles, and whatever firearms they had.
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2022/23 Russian-Ukrainian War
- Thread starter Towered
- Start date
kEiThZ
Superstar
4 to start. More will follow. Part of the problem here is that this fleet has had serviceability issues and everybody wants parts to fix their Leopards right now. But we're the Leopard operator that's far from Europe. I expect we'll have at least a full company (14-15) by end of the Summer. And maybe even double that by year end.
There's no point sending them junk that breaks down. That's creating problems, not building solutions.
Bjays92
Senior Member
Europe aspires to wield it's economic might as a bloc. The problem is it's a collection of small countries that no one really wants to lead, that doesn't agree, and that doesn't really have a specific desire or roadmap beyond immediate economic gain. Europe cannot be trusted to lead the globe, they haven't shown the foresight or will to do so. It's why the risk of a falling US (especially under Republicans) is of such a pressing concern. A bit of a side tangent yes but we need US leadership frankly.
Europe is willing to sell out and become subservient to China, they don't really care about human rights or the effect that China could have in the Asia Pacific since it's not their backyard. You would think China's support of Russia would raise more alarm bells in Europe but alas not.
Richard White
Senior Member
kEiThZ
Superstar
It's not just Europe. How often do we hear that same contempt for the US in Canada?
People chafe at American leadership and then decry things like additional defence spending or troops commitments, because, "We can't be like the Americans." Yet, when the real decisive moments of history come? Crickets. They all wait for the US.
I'm honestly surprised at how generous the Americans are. I wouldn't be. I'd be tying trade policy directly to meeting other commitments. Keep in mind the very lack of social services in the US that Europeans and Canadians love to smugly hold over the Americans, is substantially driven by the need to spend on a defence umbrella, of which America's allies are major beneficiaries. I'd be far less generous to countries like Canada or Germany if I were an American voter.
By the way, if you have to deal with allies at all, you know this, if it's not polite to say it out loud:
Full interview here:
People chafe at American leadership and then decry things like additional defence spending or troops commitments, because, "We can't be like the Americans." Yet, when the real decisive moments of history come? Crickets. They all wait for the US.
I'm honestly surprised at how generous the Americans are. I wouldn't be. I'd be tying trade policy directly to meeting other commitments. Keep in mind the very lack of social services in the US that Europeans and Canadians love to smugly hold over the Americans, is substantially driven by the need to spend on a defence umbrella, of which America's allies are major beneficiaries. I'd be far less generous to countries like Canada or Germany if I were an American voter.
By the way, if you have to deal with allies at all, you know this, if it's not polite to say it out loud:
Full interview here:
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Admiral Beez
Superstar
The hodgepodge of armoured vehicles to be used by the Ukrainians must tax their logistics and maintenance resources. But I have no doubt they're up to the task.
Bjays92
Senior Member
Amid the smoke of war, power in Europe is shifting decisively to the east | Jonathan Eyal
While Germany’s Olaf Scholz was dragging his feet over tanks for Ukraine, the Baltic states and Poland gained moral ground
www.theguardian.com
Don't agree with everything in this article but it echoes some of what we've discussed here
lenaitch
Senior Member
Gettin' by with a little help from their friends:The hodgepodge of armoured vehicles to be used by the Ukrainians must tax their logistics and maintenance resources. But I have no doubt they're up to the task.
How to fix a howitzer: US offers help line to Ukraine troops
A MILITARY BASE IN SOUTHEASTERN POLAND (AP) — On the front lines in Ukraine, a soldier was having trouble firing his 155 mm howitzer gun. So, he turned to a team of Americans on the other end of his phone line for help.
apnews.com
Learning how to do titanium welding, in the field, under wartime conditions. Interesting that the US military is learning lessons as well since the Ukrainians are using equipment well past their intended service life.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
Hopefully you’re not on hold for an hour listening to polkas and “Vash dzvinok vazhlyvyy dlya nas, budʹ laska, zalyshaytesya na liniyi… / your call is important to us, please remain on the line…”Gettin' by with a little help from their friends:
How to fix a howitzer: US offers help line to Ukraine troops
A MILITARY BASE IN SOUTHEASTERN POLAND (AP) — On the front lines in Ukraine, a soldier was having trouble firing his 155 mm howitzer gun. So, he turned to a team of Americans on the other end of his phone line for help.
Learning how to do titanium welding, in the field, under wartime conditions. Interesting that the US military is learning lessons as well since the Ukrainians are using equipment well past their intended service life.
Towered
Senior Member
Germany's lack of leadership has been embarrassing to say the least. And the defence minister already said that sending jet fighters was "out of the question", with a dismissive attitude - "we just agreed to send them tanks!" - as if this foot dragging followed by reluctant drip feeding necessary weapons is enough. Pathetic.Amid the smoke of war, power in Europe is shifting decisively to the east | Jonathan Eyal
While Germany’s Olaf Scholz was dragging his feet over tanks for Ukraine, the Baltic states and Poland gained moral ground
Don't agree with everything in this article but it echoes some of what we've discussed here
Richard White
Senior Member
Thankfully, there are many more suppliers of planes out there. Germany is not the only one.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
kEiThZ
Superstar
I'm guessing there's a few dudes in the Kremlin who have a list....
Admiral Beez
Superstar
Isn’t Germany the second or third largest provider of arms to Ukraine?
Towered
Senior Member
Only now, very reluctantly, and only under extreme pressure from NATO allies. Countries in eastern Europe, particularly Poland and the Baltic states, have been the ones showing true leadership in this debacle, along with of course the US and the UK.
As the posters above have mentioned, the problem lies with the fact that the SPD went to bed with the Russian oligarchs in the 90's, although I'd give Merkel a good chunk of the blame too for not taking a much harder line against Putin. Disgusting all around really, and entirely predictable. And now they have to deal with the fallout of those idiotic decisions. The harsh truth that the Germans don't want to admit is that they've enabled Putin for more than 20 years by putting exorbitant amounts of money in Russian coffers, so now they have a moral responsibility to Ukraine in particular to undo that damage.
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