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2019 Ontario Liberal Leadership Race / Rebuild

animatronic

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#1
Thread for discussion of the Ontario Liberal Party post-Ford, replacement of Kathleen Wynne and rebuild for the 2022 general election.

Who's going to be interim leader? Will any feds drop down to provincial politics? Will they tack left or right?

Discuss!
 

adma

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#2
I wonder if there's schadenfreude on the NDP's part; after all, when the Dippers dipped to 7 seats in 2003, the Libs refused them official party status. So they went on to win the first byelection on the table...the victor: one Andrea Horwath...
 

MTown

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#3
I wonder if there's schadenfreude on the NDP's part; after all, when the Dippers dipped to 7 seats in 2003, the Libs refused them official party status. So they went on to win the first byelection on the table...the victor: one Andrea Horwath...
Ha! The Liberal Party is quite arrogant and self-serving so this is probably cosmic political justice.


What if.....no, seriously, what if Bob Rae waded into the leadership contest?
 

Towered

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#4
Ha! The Liberal Party is quite arrogant and self-serving so this is probably cosmic political justice.


What if.....no, seriously, what if Bob Rae waded into the leadership contest?
I personally like him, but that ship has sailed. He's too old, and carries too much baggage still.
 

BurlOak

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#5
Interim leader - one of the 6 remaining.
Future leader - someone who didn't run in this election, and likely someone who did not run in 2014 either. As much separation from Wynne as possible.
 

animatronic

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#6
Or a big city mayor - Jim Watson would go in with a big base of support and a ready-made team. And he'd be far enough removed from provincial politics by now. Fred Eisenberger is another option.
 

adma

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#7
Or a big city mayor - Jim Watson would go in with a big base of support and a ready-made team. And he'd be far enough removed from provincial politics by now. Fred Eisenberger is another option.
Is Eisenberger still a Conservative? I know he ran federally in 2004...
 

MetroMan

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#8
I hate to say this but if the Liberals want to win the next election, they'll have to have a male leader.

Wynne was held to a much higher standard than men and in fact ended up paying for her male predecessor's mistakes.
 

BurlOak

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#9
I hate to say this but if the Liberals want to win the next election, they'll have to have a male leader.

Wynne was held to a much higher standard than men and in fact ended up paying for her male predecessor's mistakes.
False, False, True.

Ernie Eves was also punished for Mike Harris. Paul Martin was punished for corruption under Chretien. That's the way it works.

It's strange that somehow nobody knew she was a woman in 2014 when she was elected, but then it became an issue this time.
 

TheKingEast

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#10
False, False, True.

Ernie Eves was also punished for Mike Harris. Paul Martin was punished for corruption under Chretien. That's the way it works.

It's strange that somehow nobody knew she was a woman in 2014 when she was elected, but then it became an issue this time.
It’s like people forgot that she generally stunk as premier. Why can’t some people acknowledge that? Her being a woman had nothing to do with why she was hated just like it had nothing to do with her getting elected. What we are seeing is backlash from leaning too far to the left. Justin’s going to suffer the same fate.

I’m just not down with liberals acting like a poor leader was somehow wronged. In the eyes of the public she was not a good leader.
 
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#11
Some great comments, they rise above the necessary partisanship of the election.
I hate to say this but if the Liberals want to win the next election, they'll have to have a male leader.

Wynne was held to a much higher standard than men and in fact ended up paying for her male predecessor's mistakes.
False, False, True.

Ernie Eves was also punished for Mike Harris. Paul Martin was punished for corruption under Chretien. That's the way it works.

It's strange that somehow nobody knew she was a woman in 2014 when she was elected, but then it became an issue this time.
A few journos commented on her sexuality working against her. If that was the case, I think it wasn't overt. I was impressed as to how it *wasn't* an issue, but something people grasped at to try and define why she became the lightning rod of derision.
Will they tack left or right?
This is something of incredible importance, and affecting politics in general in this and other nations, not just Ontario.

Ontario historically has been a bastion of Centrism, and the bellwether, rudder and ballast of this nation politically and motivationally. That's why Ontario, and Toronto especially is resented by the rest of the nation, as New York, London, Paris etc are to their nations. The influence is so great some regard it as a yoke.

But Ontario has gone off the rails in terms of the established parties positions on the 'left to right' scale. The Libs tacked hard left out of desperation. They should have known better. It was a case of "OK, do you like me now?" Obviously it didn't work. In fact, when Wynne played her "I won't win" ploy, that worked against them. If they had held centre, they would have won at least Official Status.

But realizing that is also to realize that the Dippers would also have won more seats if they had been pragmatic centrists instead of 'Solidarity Forever' organ grinders. It truly ticked me off, and it must have others too. Not to mention Horwath's 're-enlightenment' after her 'dirty dalliance with Centrism' in the election prior. Yikes, that woman could never have been anything but a shop steward union reactionary, and more than a few noted how she got truly nasty to Wynne in defiance of better political judgement towards the end.

For anyone who 'did well' this election, and as is the case in many elections, they overlook that many votes weren't for them, they were against their competition.

Andrew Coyne has opined on Howarth's ideological straight jacket, and how it may have snatched victory from her. It remains a very important point many are overlooking.

Back to the Libs: To try and regrow from the same roots will be a mistake. They've got to regrow from seedlings, and cross-pollinate for new blood and stronger more adaptive genes to happen. In the past, in this nation and many others, that meant merging with other nascent parties. It's early to tell, but I see the Greens greening the field for the Libs. It's time to consider a rebirth from the ground up for the Libs. Parachuting in Fed Libs won't work. The FedLibs themselves may also need a new genesis. That may require infusion of outside blood, and it would be a fatal mistake to not consider a merger with the Greens.

The real question would be 'Would the Greens be willing?' And that answer to that would be 'How much can the Libs shed their old ways and start again?'
 
Last edited:

syn

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#12
It’s like people forgot that she generally stunk as premier. Why can’t some people acknowledge that? Her being a woman had nothing to do with why she was hated just like it had nothing to do with her getting elected. What we are seeing is backlash from leaning too far to the left. Justin’s going to suffer the same fate.

I’m just not down with liberals acting like a poor leader was somehow wronged. In the eyes of the public she was not a good leader.
I think she did a fairly good job, all things considered.

After all this time she was clearly more qualified for the job than Ford or Howarth.
 

syn

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#13
I wonder if there's schadenfreude on the NDP's part; after all, when the Dippers dipped to 7 seats in 2003, the Libs refused them official party status. So they went on to win the first byelection on the table...the victor: one Andrea Horwath...
While it's true they didn't give them official party status, they did approve a certain level of the funding they would've received had they been an official party.
 

TrickyRicky

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#14
I was slightly proud when Ontario elected Wynne as a woman and openly lesbian politician. Outside of that, with respect to her policy positions I can’t tell you what upset me more, Wynne winning the Liberal leadership convention or Ford winning the PC leadership convention.
 
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#15
[...]Back to the Libs: To try and regrow from the same roots will be a mistake. They've got to regrow from seedlings, and cross-pollinate for new blood and stronger more adaptive genes to happen. In the past, in this nation and many others, that meant merging with other nascent parties. It's early to tell, but I see the Greens greening the field for the Libs. It's time to consider a rebirth from the ground up for the Libs. Parachuting in Fed Libs won't work. The FedLibs themselves may also need a new genesis. That may require infusion of outside blood, and it would be a fatal mistake to not consider a merger with the Greens.

The real question would be 'Would the Greens be willing?' And that answer to that would be 'How much can the Libs shed their old ways and start again?'
Supposition becomes quasi-reality:
Ontario Green Party leader and newly-elected Guelph MPP Mike Schreiner denied a media report Sunday he is considering joining the seven-member Liberal caucus at Queen’s Park to give it official party status.

“To be very clear, I am a Green MPP and will not be part of a coalition with another party” Schreiner tweeted in response to a report he was considering “joining forces” with the Liberals.

Schreiner said he is “open to cooperation with any party in the Legislature” but “cooperation not does equal coalition. I am reaching out to all parties at Queen’s Park this week.”

He said the confusion over his position started Friday when he was asked by media about a report that outgoing Premier Kathleen Wynne planned to reach out to him about the possibility of teaming up with the Liberals to give them official party status. [...]
http://torontosun.com/opinion/colum...ty-leader-denies-reports-of-liberal-coalition

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