Billy Bishop Airport Expansion?

[Ward8]

I'll add, Milan to Rome is a roughly similar distance as Toronto to Montreal. This source has milan-rome at 477 km, and Toronto-montreal at 504 km. The difference here is the service patterns, there are several non stop or limited stop trains that do the route in just about 3 hrs. And there's still approx 30 daily flights between the two

Milan/Rome is one of the best examples of rail being a massive disruption on flight routes. It's a famous example of air travel crashing after the opening of HSR. I think it went from 10% of all domestic seats to something like 1% or 2% of domestic seats.

There will certainly still be flights from Toronto to Montreal, but Pearson is going to be the hub for that, not BB.

 

[picard102]

The city should negotiate with Ford at this point, play ball and transfer airport ownership in a trade for protecting the beach and public areas of the island.

 

[generalcanada]

The city should negotiate with Ford at this point, play ball and transfer airport ownership in a trade for protecting the beach and public areas of the island.

Expropriation always means reimbursement. that part will happen. but as far as im concerned. it doesnt matter if ford pays us a billion for it. I dont think anyone would be happy

 

[SubHuman]

The NoJetsTO map (it's old and I can't verify the diagrams) seems to suggest the Hanlan's ferry will require a slight detour...

LOL that image has the runway just shy of 3.5km...
Current runway length is 1.2km
... proposing things like a220 which have a takeoff length of 1.5-2km.

Apparently Porter's E195-E2 and Air Canada's A220-300 jets with full load of fuel would probably require a runway of about 6500 ft (2 km) to be at a length that's at or close to being fully useful for them, and this would be similar to the longer runways at Chicago Midway Airport. This says the Runway End Safety Areas (RESA) would need to be at least 150m at each end.
This image shows the proportional total main runway length of about 2.3 km in relation to the rest of the satellite image, but of course we'll have to wait to see a real plan.

(Edit: And we're still waiting to hear if any airline wants to operate their jets from YTZ, never mind which particular planes it would be.)

 

[innsertnamehere]

Apparently Porter's E195-E2 and Air Canada's A220-300 jets with full load of fuel would probably require a runway of about 6500 ft (2 km) to be at a length that's at or close to being fully useful for them, and this would be similar to the longer runways at Chicago Midway Airport. This says the Runway End Safety Areas (RESA) would need to be at least 150m at each end.
This image shows the proportional total main runway length of about 2.3 km in relation to the rest of the satellite image, but of course we'll have to wait to see a real plan.
View attachment 723987

E195-E2s operate at London City airport with a runway length of 1,500m. I suspect they'll keep it closer to that length similar to what was proposed a decade ago.

but yes, we'll have to see. Right now I see a whole lot of histronics about it all.. lets see what the proposal actually is before we go claiming 3km long runways are proposed.

 

[nfitz]

Apparently Porter's E195-E2 and Air Canada's A220-300 jets with full load of fuel would probably require a runway of about 6500 ft (2 km) to be at a length ...

2000 metres? That seems longer than we were discussing here a few years ago.

Can you provide a reference? Or is this just coming from a Nimby fake news site?

 

[Thaboss]

This may well happen, but it won't be all that soon, unless there are schematic drawings complete and submitted, even then, it will likely be quite a while off

Sounds like an election issue down the line ?

I know it's early but I have a hard time seeing ford in power for a 4th time. The odds are just not in his favour for that which makes me believe this'll never get built

 

[afransen]

Sounds like an election issue down the line ?

I know it's early but I have a hard time seeing ford in power for a 4th time. The odds are just not in his favour for that which makes me believe this'll never get built

Ford will soon be the least popular Premier in Canada after a few other impending defeats in other provinces.

 

[Jonny5]

I don't know if we have a more appropriate thread here, but I just got this email.

So I assume this is going to hit across the whole industry soon the way things are going.

 

[nfitz]

Sounds like an election issue down the line ?

I know it's early but I have a hard time seeing ford in power for a 4th time. The odds are just not in his favour for that which makes me believe this'll never get built

It could still be over 4 years until the next, possibly 2030 ,election, unless Ford calls it early. I can see this being finalized before then.

 

[RapidTransit]

Would it be better to reignite Pickering Airport? The Federal Liberals could potentially lose liberal support from downtown Toronto over this. I'm actually surprised we haven't heard anything from the Federal NDP over this issue. I guess they see the long game of potentially supporting the liberals and being against them over the Island airport.

If Carney gets a majority government, which I expect he will get, I can see Carney playing hard ball with Ford. I believe Carneys tune will change right after the By-election.

 

[Civdis]

Apparently Porter's E195-E2 and Air Canada's A220-300 jets with full load of fuel would probably require a runway of about 6500 ft (2 km) to be at a length that's at or close to being fully useful for them, and this would be similar to the longer runways at Chicago Midway Airport. This says the Runway End Safety Areas (RESA) would need to be at least 150m at each end.
This image shows the proportional total main runway length of about 2.3 km in relation to the rest of the satellite image, but of course we'll have to wait to see a real plan.
View attachment 723987
(Edit: And we're still waiting to hear if any airline wants to operate their jets from YTZ, never mind which particular planes it would be.)

I am a supporter of the airport expansion, but not if the runway makes that much of an incursion into the harbour. I am not sure it needs to be that long, and if it does, why not extend it more westward toward Ontario Place where it will have less impact on downtown residents and harbour front.

 

[afransen]

It could still be over 4 years until the next, possibly 2030 ,election, unless Ford calls it early. I can see this being finalized before then.

April 2030 is the absolute latest the election can be called. I doubt they would wait that long.

 

[picard102]

Expropriation always means reimbursement. that part will happen. but as far as im concerned. it doesnt matter if ford pays us a billion for it. I dont think anyone would be happy

I mean I would be happy with a transfer of beach land to the city for expanding the airpot.

Sounds like an election issue down the line ?

I know it's early but I have a hard time seeing ford in power for a 4th time. The odds are just not in his favour for that which makes me believe this'll never get built

The other parties would need leaders able to win an election

 

[nfitz]

April 2030 is the absolute latest the election can be called. I doubt they would wait that long.

If you are confident they'd lose, then the polling will clearly show that, and they would indeed likely wait until late 2025, which certainly wouldn't be unusual back before the fixed elections era.

A bit earlier, 5-years was the norm federally ... 1930, 1935, 1940, 1945.

With the next federal election in October 2029, then my guess is that we'd see a spring 2029 election if the PCs foresees a win then. And if not, then early December 2029 or 2030.

Though I think the theory that the latest the election can be is 2030 may be wrong. The legislature can't sit after 5 years from the date of writs being returned (section 4 of the Charter of Rights)... was that March 3rd 2025? And the legislature must sit at least once every 12 months ... so it would be necessary to sit again until March 2031. Allowing an election as late as February 2031 ... almost 5 years from now, and almost 6 years after the last election.

That's my recollection of the logic from the 1993 media speculation on how long Mulroney and Campbell might hang on with defeat staring them in the face. Though perhaps my memory has failed. Though the speculation was also that such a move would defy convention and be political suicide - even if legal. Though in these dark days of Trumpian and Fordian politics, who knows what a desperate party might do.