Toronto Sugar Wharf Condominiums (Phase 1) | 231m | 70s | Menkes | a—A

It's plain old neglect of infrastructure. Planning is still far too autocentric. The idea of building high-density neighbourhoods without higher-order transit should be a non-starter, but it's a normal part of the city's development unfortunately even in certain masterplanned neighbourhoods.
 
This has to be a tough sell right now. There is no PATH access, no transit, busy highway to the north (24/7), industrial to the south and everything else is under construction. I'm guessing investors will be the largest takers here. But even that will be a difficult sell.

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To the logical person it seems like a tough sell but Menkes has had no issues selling their Sugar Wharf Phase 1 at almost $1,000 psf. To whom? Like you said, probably investors most likely. Foreign ones to be more specific, who have no clue about Toronto.

Big Daddy said:
This has to be a tough sell right now. There is no PATH access, no transit, busy highway to the north (24/7), industrial to the south and everything else is under construction. I'm guessing investors will be the largest takers here. But even that will be a difficult sell.

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Big Daddy said:
This has to be a tough sell right now. There is no PATH access, no transit, busy highway to the north (24/7), industrial to the south and everything else is under construction. I'm guessing investors will be the largest takers here. But even that will be a difficult sell.

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This project wont be a tough sell at all I can guarantee you that one. It's prime location, views of the waterfront, and proximity to the downtown core would be enough to attract hundreds of prospective owners.

Unfortunately it's these same buyers who take the city at their word for their empty promises when it comes to transit and they are naive enough to think that a transit being approved by city council means that it's going to get built. If only they looked at the city's bloating list of approved but unfunded projects:

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As we can see from the above image, the city can approve projects until the cows come home, ultimately project approval doesn't mean a single thing until the funds are made available.
 
Stefan said:
To the logical person it seems like a tough sell but Menkes has had no issues selling their Sugar Wharf Phase 1 at almost $1,000 psf. To whom? Like you said, probably investors most likely. Foreign ones to be more specific, who have no clue about Toronto.
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The myth of foreign investor dominated buildings lives on.

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marketed to investors, not end users. Many of the investors have never even been in the area before. They are buying based off of key fundamentals. Location and if it is a sound investment. Everything else is secondary.
 
Stefan said:
If you have any recent information that debunks this so-called "myth", I'd love to hear it. Until then, you can't dismiss it. I'm neither advocating nor dismissing this supposedly "myth" but rather acknowledging that it is an issue, irregardless of the magnitude of it.

For example, there was this survey that found out that foreign investors percentage is not as high as people may think:

https://www.thestar.com/business/re...-in-toronto-a-new-study-sheds-some-light.html

But this so-called study doesn't even take into consideration foreigners who use local family members to purchase properties, for example:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/new...uver-homes-in-past-two-years/article31892652/

Also, while not concrete enough and most definitely not substantial enough from a guy on an online forum, from personal experience and what I've heard from agents, foreign investors are a bigger part than you might think. For example, from what I heard (and of course this needs to be taken with a grain of salt but not 100% dismissed):

1. Half of the one-bedroom units in The Wyatt in Regent Park were sold to one single Asian investor
2. Approximately two thirds of the units at 75 The Esplanade were purchased for investment purposes, with at least half of this purchased by either Asian and Middle Eastern investors

If you want to remain oblivious to it, sure, go right ahead but your comment adds zero value to the conversation.
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I do remember back in the wild wild west of precon (before 2010) how people would buy entire floors of units. I am not doubting what you are saying one bit. It's fishy how quickly buildings get sold out. An entire building getting sold out in a day is not uncommon. Many of those investors are not from here. Builders are marketing overseas so there's clearly a large enough contingent of overseas investors.

I'm also well aware of the tactics used to purchase property in other peoples names. There at least was a lot of fishy tactics that went on back then and I'm sure they are still around now.
 
TheKingEast said:
We continue to make the same mistakes.
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Then these people who live there and others will bitch and moan that they don't have transit access and the city will solve the problem by shutting off lake shore to cars so that busses and streetcars will have the right of way.
 
TheKingEast said:
I do remember back in the wild wild west of precon (before 2010) how people would buy entire floors of units. I am not doubting what you are saying one bit. It's fishy how quickly buildings get sold out. An entire building getting sold out in a day is not uncommon.
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Sold out in a day is a bit of a misrepresentation. 90% of buyers of those buildings selected their units and submitted binding letters of intent months (sometimes years) before sales officially opened.

Selling out in a day is much easier when you can start pre-selling before even submitting the project to an architect to be designed.
 
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