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2018 Ontario Provincial Election Discussion

I don't think that's the case. I think the Liberals arrogantly think this is to their own benefit. They don't give a fuck about the NDP. They would probably prefer if the Conservatives win, they are frightened by the NDP winning and actually doing a good job (its not impossible).

They should hardly be surprised this would be the outcome given this is clearly a change election, and when you have spent that much effort wooing the left policy-wise they shouldn't be surprised if voters went for it without the baggage.

AoD
 
Given the sorry state of government in Ontario at present the NDP don't look all that crazy even to me (will be voting PC); However, I think it highly probable that the next four years will see Ontario heading into a possibly serious recession. It's at that point that people will remember, amid the credit downgrades etc. that fiscal mismanagement during good times is different than fiscal mismanagement during bad times. Tweaking income tax rates for a few high-income earners isn't going to solve the 30 billion dollar budget holes that will open up even without the new spend promises all the parties are handing out like candy. No party seems to care about this in their platform (well the PC's don't really have a platform).
But you'll vote for a party without a platform?
 
Given the sorry state of government in Ontario at present the NDP don't look all that crazy even to me (will be voting PC); However, I think it highly probable that the next four years will see Ontario heading into a possibly serious recession. It's at that point that people will remember, amid the credit downgrades etc. that fiscal mismanagement during good times is different than fiscal mismanagement during bad times. Tweaking income tax rates for a few high income earners isn't going to solve the 30 billion dollar budget holes that will open up even without the new spend promises all the parties are handing out like candy. No party seems to care about this in their platform (well the PC's don't really have a platform).

And yet you're fine voting for a party led by a charlatan who thinks getting he can save Ontario 6 billion dollars by getting rid of the 6 million dollar man and getting a cheaper supplier for pencils?
 
Given the sorry state of government in Ontario at present the NDP don't look all that crazy even to me (will be voting PC); However, I think it highly probable that the next four years will see Ontario heading into a possibly serious recession. It's at that point that people will remember, amid the credit downgrades etc. that fiscal mismanagement during good times is different than fiscal mismanagement during bad times. Tweaking income tax rates for a few high income earners isn't going to solve the 30 billion dollar budget holes that will open up even without the new spend promises all the parties are handing out like candy. No party seems to care about this in their platform (well the PC's don't really have a platform).

Based on the policies that Ford is promising the deficit is going to balloon no matter who wins.

It does feel like we will be heading into a recession though. It always feels that way when gas prices rise so much.
 
I don't think that's the case. I think the Liberals arrogantly think this is to their own benefit. They don't give a fuck about the NDP. They would probably prefer if the Conservatives win, they are frightened by the NDP winning and actually doing a good job (its not impossible).
You may be right but I would think only the lost ones may think that IMHO. The NDP platform is closer to theirs than the PCs... a win by association means not giving up, besides, let us not forget the white whale in the room.

I think the only thing that is becoming more and more certain is a Liberal decimation.

I still do think the final result is totally up in the air. But its between the NDP and Conservatives.
Agreed. But please forgive me for enjoying a good soap. :)
 
OPINIONS
Hang up the phone, pollsters
By Erin Kelly. Published on Apr 16, 2017 7:00am

Author
Erin Kelly
Erin Kelly is president and CEO of Advanced Symbolics, an Ottawa-based company that uses artificial intelligence for public opinion research. erin.kelly@advancedsymbolics.com

[...]
As the British journal Nature so aptly argued in an October 2016 article, telephone polling is so flawed that many governments have stopped using it. Consider the following:

  • Fewer than 10 per cent of respondents will agree to participate in a telephone survey. This creates what scientists call ‘opt-in bias’.
  • Low opt-in rates force pollsters to over-sample minority demographics. Since opt-in bias tells us they are likely outliers to begin with, this leads to a very distorted view of public opinion.
  • Merely posing a question to respondents creates question bias.
  • Small sample sizes are not representative. The government’s rolling survey will sample 500 people a week. That is not enough to tell us what people across the country — from every region, language and socio-economic group — think. Not even close.
  • Rolling or ‘windowed’ surveys are controversial because they are trying to mimic longitudinal studies which survey the same people over a longer period of time. With new technology, there is no need for this mimicry. Real longitudinal studies are already possible, for a fraction of the cost the government paid for this substitute method.
The 2015 Canadian federal election provides a good illustration of how telephone polls can lead to wrong insights, and cause politicians and policymakers to make the wrong decisions.

Polls released a week after the viral release of a photo of the body of three-year-old refugee Alan Kurdi washed ashore in Turkey showed a drop in Conservative support. The media immediately assumed that the drop in support was due to Kurdi’s death; “social media listening” on Twitter seemed to confirm this. Tweets about Kurdish and Syrian refugees increased 300-fold, as did criticism of the Harper government, which had been slow to let refugees into the country.

What Harper, the media and just about everyone else failed to recognize was that the fall in Conservative support had nothing to do with Alan Kurdi’s death. The day before Kurdi drowned, Statistics Canada published a report saying that Canada had entered a technical recession. It was this report — not the drowning — that caused the fall in Conservative support. People who voted Harper did so because they believed him to be a good steward of the economy. They were not concerned about his policies on refugees.[...]



https://ipolitics.ca/2017/04/16/hang-up-the-phone-pollsters/
 
I’m certainly not voting for Ford. I would be voting for the PC party. If you recall previous posts I have opposed the Fords for more than a decade.

Rationale: choice between NDP and PC party as a change agent. My primary concern is fiscal prudence. Probability of fiscal prudence in an NDP government...near zero although please surprise me. Probability of fiscal prudence under a Ford government...low but at least some members of his caucus would feel twangs of concern.
 
My primary concern is fiscal prudence. Probability of fiscal prudence in an NDP government...near zero although please surprise me. Probability of fiscal prudence under a Ford government...low but at least some members of his caucus would feel twangs of concern.
They're all bad. We haven't had a government make an net gain on government debt since before the 1980s.

Ontario-Debt.jpg
 
This morning a CTV reporter tried asking Doug Ford if he believes he broke any election rules as he arrived in Brantford. He didn’t answer but his rep stepped in: “we made it clear we’re not taking any questions.”

The act they had at City Hall isn't working.

Him and his brother were actually a good team. His brother had what a lot of people would consider an 'everyman' quality (I personally didn't see it that way), while Doug didn't have that charm but did have a certain 'seriousness' (for lack of a better term) which gave Rob some sort of legitimacy.

Without that dynamic, Doug just seems shady and is having a difficult time dealing with all the controversy.
 
If the PCs do lose, then they have a ready-made scapegoat in the form of the brutish oaf they "elected" party leader. And if they lose badly, well. That factor will be amplified significantly. I don't doubt that many people within the party already loathed him, and given the tactics the Cons have adopted under Dofo's supposed leadership thus far, I'll bet he's stepped on a lot of toes and has made more than his fair share of enemies. Not a situation where you inspire much loyalty, is it?

If he bombs out, he's going to get all the blame, fairly or not...and I think we all know he won't respond well to such a scenario. And won't that be fun to witness?
 
I’m certainly not voting for Ford. I would be voting for the PC party. If you recall previous posts I have opposed the Fords for more than a decade.

Rationale: choice between NDP and PC party as a change agent. My primary concern is fiscal prudence. Probability of fiscal prudence in an NDP government...near zero although please surprise me. Probability of fiscal prudence under a Ford government...low but at least some members of his caucus would feel twangs of concern.

So, you support the party that backs Andrew Lawton and wanted to make Tanya Granic Allen a cabinet minister?

https://ricochet.media/en/2217/why-canadas-white-supremacists-want-doug-ford-to-win

Look who supports Doug. Not sure why though, since his base is very multicultural.
 
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