innsertnamehere
Superstar
if the libs aren't in power at that time, it will be the cons. and they will be even less inclined, as it would mean a tax increase. (which they are against)
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OneCity Plan
- Thread starter AlvinofDiaspar
- Start date
Solid Snake
Active Member
One City EAST Critic
Well,well...I almost gave up hope for Rapid Transit to Toronto.
I'll call it a good start but seriously need a lot of fine tuning and focus.
East
1-Replace the Scarborough RT with a subway (Kennedy Station to Sheppard & McCowan)
Finally some common sense!!!
For an extra $484 million
-no shut down of the SRT for 4+ years
-no need for 43 Shuttle buses adding to our sadly famous gridlock
The SRT was in the middle of nowhere anyways and the subway will hopefully go east on Eglinton than north on McCowan to where "People actually live"
2-Build a Scarborough Express rail line (Steeles to Union Station)
My dear Karen... After hearing you saying how "OVERKILL" Sheppard East subway was, I can tell you right now how "Overkill" this line is. Quality or Quantity Karen...
This express line will overlap Don Mills LRT (Which Should be a Subway from Sheppard and not Eglinton). That line also overlaps the Bloor-Danforth Line, East GO line and Don Mills Subway at the very conservative cost of 6.9B$!!!!
My advice Karen, leave that corridor to GO and use the money to 100% grade Separate Eglinton LRT (elevated or trench).
3-Extend the Sheppard LRT line to: (A) Meadowvale (B) Malvern Town Centre (C) Toronto Zoo
LRT to the zoo is just overkill. Malvern Town Centre is so close to Sheppard Avenue East and the future B-D line. Surely a bus from Malvern Town Centre to "Sheppard East Station" (McCowan and Sheppard) would suffice...
Why not merge the Sheppard LRT with the Scarborough LRT creating an eastern Loop for the LRT. For smooth daily operations, keep it simple.
Saving: 453 Millions
Apply that money to the B-D extension to Scarborough Centre that's missing
4-Build a Scarborough Malvern LRT line (Kennedy Station to Sheppard & Morningside)
I would merge it with Sheppard LRT
5-Build an Ellesmere BRT line (Scarborough Centre to East boundary)
Is the Traffic that bad on that street? Maybe trying implementing an "Express Branch" first and see if it works... It does wonders on Keele
6-Build a Kingston BRT line (Victoria Park station to Eglinton & Kingston)
Same as above : Is the Traffic that bad on that street? Maybe trying implementing an "Express Branch" first and see if it works
So Dufferin still remains unattended? Wrong priorities...
Well,well...I almost gave up hope for Rapid Transit to Toronto.
I'll call it a good start but seriously need a lot of fine tuning and focus.
East
1-Replace the Scarborough RT with a subway (Kennedy Station to Sheppard & McCowan)
Finally some common sense!!!
For an extra $484 million
-no shut down of the SRT for 4+ years
-no need for 43 Shuttle buses adding to our sadly famous gridlock
The SRT was in the middle of nowhere anyways and the subway will hopefully go east on Eglinton than north on McCowan to where "People actually live"
2-Build a Scarborough Express rail line (Steeles to Union Station)
My dear Karen... After hearing you saying how "OVERKILL" Sheppard East subway was, I can tell you right now how "Overkill" this line is. Quality or Quantity Karen...
This express line will overlap Don Mills LRT (Which Should be a Subway from Sheppard and not Eglinton). That line also overlaps the Bloor-Danforth Line, East GO line and Don Mills Subway at the very conservative cost of 6.9B$!!!!
My advice Karen, leave that corridor to GO and use the money to 100% grade Separate Eglinton LRT (elevated or trench).
3-Extend the Sheppard LRT line to: (A) Meadowvale (B) Malvern Town Centre (C) Toronto Zoo
LRT to the zoo is just overkill. Malvern Town Centre is so close to Sheppard Avenue East and the future B-D line. Surely a bus from Malvern Town Centre to "Sheppard East Station" (McCowan and Sheppard) would suffice...
Why not merge the Sheppard LRT with the Scarborough LRT creating an eastern Loop for the LRT. For smooth daily operations, keep it simple.
Saving: 453 Millions
Apply that money to the B-D extension to Scarborough Centre that's missing
4-Build a Scarborough Malvern LRT line (Kennedy Station to Sheppard & Morningside)
I would merge it with Sheppard LRT
5-Build an Ellesmere BRT line (Scarborough Centre to East boundary)
Is the Traffic that bad on that street? Maybe trying implementing an "Express Branch" first and see if it works... It does wonders on Keele
6-Build a Kingston BRT line (Victoria Park station to Eglinton & Kingston)
Same as above : Is the Traffic that bad on that street? Maybe trying implementing an "Express Branch" first and see if it works
So Dufferin still remains unattended? Wrong priorities...
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MisterF
Senior Member
People might not make two switches, but lots of people would get on the DRL first and then transfer to the Yonge line. If the line goes as far as Eglinton (or even Sheppard), riders in that part of the city would get on the DRL first and not even use the Danforth and Yonge lines. That alone takes a lot of pressure off Bloor-Yonge.
You touched on why I support a Queen alignment instead of one further south: the busiest station on that section of the Yonge line is Dundas. Putting the line on Queen makes it serve a large swath of downtown from the financial district to the Eaton Centre. Let's face it, the DRL is the only new downtown subway that's going to be built in our lifetimes, so it should be as central to as much of downtown as possible.
I don't see any way the Stouffville line would have an actual third rail subway built along it. The only design that would make sense is regional rail - upgrading the infrastructure that's already there. With the demand provided by Markham Centre, it would be a worthy investment. Sure it would run parallel to the Danforth line more or less, but only for a relatively short distance. It would provide a faster trip catered to longer distances just like the Lakeshore and airport/Kitchener lines will.
...Anyway, these lines are just past projects or conceptual lines on a map at this point. Exactly what the Stouffville line would look like and the alignment of the DRL are subject to refinement in the future (the City really needs to partner with Metrolinx on this). The important thing here is that the city might finally be in a position to have a sustained, steady source of transit funding that's not subject to political whims. That alone is huge. That $2.7 billion per dacade isn't insignificant, and it doesn't include provincial and federal funding and additional funding sources that Metrolinx is working on. The details of the plan are just that: details. What's important is the money.
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Juan_Lennon416
Senior Member
I hope Ontario does not elect Hudak. Him and Ford working together would make me psychotic
denfromoakvillemilton
Senior Member
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Very true. This frankly makes Scarborough one of the most covered areas in the GTA.
Solid Snake
Active Member
One City West Critic
1-Build an Etobicoke Express line (Airport to Union Station)
This is an excellent idea. It's basically our DRL West and it's great new for Northern Etobicoke.
Since we require more information, is this line competing with the Province Air link or does the TTC expect the Province to surrender or sell those rails?
This remains to be seen since the province had already refused to add more stops. Maybe if that line was paid entirely by the city and feds with the TTC operating it. Feel free to clarify for for me.
2-Extend the Eglinton Crosstown LRT line (Jane to Pearson Airport)
Obviously a no brainer. On my critic of the Eastern plan, I said that the Scarborough Express line overlapping Don Mills to Union was too much and should be left alone so Metrolinx continues operating the GO Train. 6.9B$ could be use instead to make Eglinton 100% grade separated.
3-Extend the Finch West LRT line (Humber College to Pearson Airport)
Excellent idea. More efficient transit to the north-west part of the city.
4-Build a Jane LRT line (Steeles to Bloor)
I disagree with this one. With an impressive list of Rapid transit stops along this route (Steeles West, Eglinton LRT, Etobicoke express and the Bloor Line), how many people will use this line once the other projects are built? Surely the amount of time staying on the bus to reach a rapid transit line will have decreased.
This should be BRT at best. That's 1.4B$ should be used on Dufferin in all seriousness. There are streetcar tracks from Dufferin Gates to King. Extend them north or bury them but do something with Dufferin or use it to exted the Don Mills Express line farther north.
5-Extend the St. Clair streetcar line
again, an inexpensive no brainer
6-Build a Waterfront West LRT line (Union Station to Long Branch)
A much needed line to serve the Rogers Center, future Aquarium with service to City Place and Fort York. We need to bring transit to those new condo towers. No wonder we're in eternal gridlock...
7-Build a Wilson BRT line (Wilson station to Keele)
I had a good laugh out of that one.
Why would you stop it at Keele and not extend it to Jane?
Why would you have it start at Wilson Station and not York Mills? The 165 Bus is overlapping the 96 Bus for a reason.
Why not be bold and merge Wilson with York Mills and Ellesmere?
1-Build an Etobicoke Express line (Airport to Union Station)
This is an excellent idea. It's basically our DRL West and it's great new for Northern Etobicoke.
Since we require more information, is this line competing with the Province Air link or does the TTC expect the Province to surrender or sell those rails?
This remains to be seen since the province had already refused to add more stops. Maybe if that line was paid entirely by the city and feds with the TTC operating it. Feel free to clarify for for me.
2-Extend the Eglinton Crosstown LRT line (Jane to Pearson Airport)
Obviously a no brainer. On my critic of the Eastern plan, I said that the Scarborough Express line overlapping Don Mills to Union was too much and should be left alone so Metrolinx continues operating the GO Train. 6.9B$ could be use instead to make Eglinton 100% grade separated.
3-Extend the Finch West LRT line (Humber College to Pearson Airport)
Excellent idea. More efficient transit to the north-west part of the city.
4-Build a Jane LRT line (Steeles to Bloor)
I disagree with this one. With an impressive list of Rapid transit stops along this route (Steeles West, Eglinton LRT, Etobicoke express and the Bloor Line), how many people will use this line once the other projects are built? Surely the amount of time staying on the bus to reach a rapid transit line will have decreased.
This should be BRT at best. That's 1.4B$ should be used on Dufferin in all seriousness. There are streetcar tracks from Dufferin Gates to King. Extend them north or bury them but do something with Dufferin or use it to exted the Don Mills Express line farther north.
5-Extend the St. Clair streetcar line
again, an inexpensive no brainer
6-Build a Waterfront West LRT line (Union Station to Long Branch)
A much needed line to serve the Rogers Center, future Aquarium with service to City Place and Fort York. We need to bring transit to those new condo towers. No wonder we're in eternal gridlock...
7-Build a Wilson BRT line (Wilson station to Keele)
I had a good laugh out of that one.
Why would you stop it at Keele and not extend it to Jane?
Why would you have it start at Wilson Station and not York Mills? The 165 Bus is overlapping the 96 Bus for a reason.
Why not be bold and merge Wilson with York Mills and Ellesmere?
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DKsan
Active Member
Something I have to ask, being a 905er who loves Toronto:
I'm not crazy to think that Toronto City Council should ask York Region and Durham Region and Brampton and Mississauga to pitch in, right?
An electrified Etobicoke line is exactly what those in Malton and Brampton have been asking for to get rid of diesel trains. Scarborough Express is essentially Markham's I-METRO-E proposal. Extend the Yonge subway to Steeles? Ask York Region for money and we can extend to RHC. Same for the Don Mills LRT. Ellesmere BRT? Well, DRT is launching DRT Pulse on pretty much the same routing. WWLRT? Metrolinx's plan was for it to go to Port Credit, not stop at Long Branch. Would Mississauga pitch in?
I don't know whether they'd be willing to pay, but it'd be worth a try.
I'm not crazy to think that Toronto City Council should ask York Region and Durham Region and Brampton and Mississauga to pitch in, right?
An electrified Etobicoke line is exactly what those in Malton and Brampton have been asking for to get rid of diesel trains. Scarborough Express is essentially Markham's I-METRO-E proposal. Extend the Yonge subway to Steeles? Ask York Region for money and we can extend to RHC. Same for the Don Mills LRT. Ellesmere BRT? Well, DRT is launching DRT Pulse on pretty much the same routing. WWLRT? Metrolinx's plan was for it to go to Port Credit, not stop at Long Branch. Would Mississauga pitch in?
I don't know whether they'd be willing to pay, but it'd be worth a try.
Solid Snake
Active Member
One City North Critic
1-Extend the Yonge subway to Steeles (Finch to Steeles)
Crucial to remove all that Traffic from Yonge Street. The area is growing at a very fast pace and if York region wants to pay for the extension to Richmond Hill (and pay for their share of operating the line in York) after we get a DRL, they are more then welcome.
2-Build a Sheppard West subway (Sheppard Station to Downsview Station)
This is more than overdue. Mid rise condos are growing fast and bus service can no longer be improved due to the corridor being too narrow. This will give access to the Wilson yard for the Sheppard Line and a future RH line.
This will also provide some relief to the Yonge Line allowing riders to stay on the train and go farther West. The Sheppard-Yonge station won't feel overbuilt for nothing anymore.
3-Build a Finch LRT line (Keele to Yonge)
That's a waste of money. With the Sheppard line being extended with the Finch West Station being build, why would you overlap the service? There's nothing between Keele and Bathurst. A bus service between Scarborough and Keele is more than enough.
Saving 762M$
Make the Wilson BRT longer so I can stop laughing at it.
4-Build a Don Mills LRT line (Steeles to Eglinton)
This should be a subway. This 1.42B$ combined with the Jane LRT 1.488B$ should be use to push the subway farther north.
1-Extend the Yonge subway to Steeles (Finch to Steeles)
Crucial to remove all that Traffic from Yonge Street. The area is growing at a very fast pace and if York region wants to pay for the extension to Richmond Hill (and pay for their share of operating the line in York) after we get a DRL, they are more then welcome.
2-Build a Sheppard West subway (Sheppard Station to Downsview Station)
This is more than overdue. Mid rise condos are growing fast and bus service can no longer be improved due to the corridor being too narrow. This will give access to the Wilson yard for the Sheppard Line and a future RH line.
This will also provide some relief to the Yonge Line allowing riders to stay on the train and go farther West. The Sheppard-Yonge station won't feel overbuilt for nothing anymore.
3-Build a Finch LRT line (Keele to Yonge)
That's a waste of money. With the Sheppard line being extended with the Finch West Station being build, why would you overlap the service? There's nothing between Keele and Bathurst. A bus service between Scarborough and Keele is more than enough.
Saving 762M$
Make the Wilson BRT longer so I can stop laughing at it.
4-Build a Don Mills LRT line (Steeles to Eglinton)
This should be a subway. This 1.42B$ combined with the Jane LRT 1.488B$ should be use to push the subway farther north.
Solid Snake
Active Member
One City South Critic
1-Upgrade the Bloor-Yonge Station
It used to be my understanding that a DRL would prevent the need to spend 1B$. That price is insane. That money should be used to find a permanent solution for our downtown Streetcar routes. King, Queen, College and Dundas are a disaster.
Maybe we could do something like Chicago did. When I went in April, there was barely any gridlock ate rush hour. One ways combined with public parking both underground and above ground with a strict no parking rules worked for them.
Something must be done here
2-Build a Don Mills express subway line (Eglinton to Queen Station)
A must that should go farther north to Don Mills Station at the very least.
Hopefully the line will go Pape then farther south to reach Wellington. For the sake of being practical, shutting down Wellington or Adelaide is easier and less inconvenient than King or Queen...
3-Build a Waterfront East streetcar line (Union Station to Parliament)
Excellent line that will go through Don Lands and Distillery District connecting Union and the DRL
1-Upgrade the Bloor-Yonge Station
It used to be my understanding that a DRL would prevent the need to spend 1B$. That price is insane. That money should be used to find a permanent solution for our downtown Streetcar routes. King, Queen, College and Dundas are a disaster.
Maybe we could do something like Chicago did. When I went in April, there was barely any gridlock ate rush hour. One ways combined with public parking both underground and above ground with a strict no parking rules worked for them.
Something must be done here
2-Build a Don Mills express subway line (Eglinton to Queen Station)
A must that should go farther north to Don Mills Station at the very least.
Hopefully the line will go Pape then farther south to reach Wellington. For the sake of being practical, shutting down Wellington or Adelaide is easier and less inconvenient than King or Queen...
3-Build a Waterfront East streetcar line (Union Station to Parliament)
Excellent line that will go through Don Lands and Distillery District connecting Union and the DRL
datamouse
Active Member
Wasn't it foreseen that surface LRT on Jane south of Wilson would have significant problems with the available right-of-way?
W. K. Lis
Superstar
OneCity Plan is build 170 km of new transit lines at an expected cost of over $30 billion.
For comparison, New York City's 2nd Avenue Subway is expected to be over $17 billion for that one 8.5-mile (13.7 km) line.
For two times the cost, we will be getting more than ten times the coverage length.
For comparison, New York City's 2nd Avenue Subway is expected to be over $17 billion for that one 8.5-mile (13.7 km) line.
For two times the cost, we will be getting more than ten times the coverage length.
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W. K. Lis
Superstar
One option was for a single bored tunnel south of Wilson. Similar to how Montreal's narrow Metro trains share their single bored tunnels.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
mainly because it won't be under an extremely built up city, other than a small portion. though that small portion is still going to ring in a $5.4 billion for 10km...
Specifically for Durham, they really only have the Highway 2 BRT as far as local transit goes. Connecting that should be relatively easy.
As for York Region, they have a bit more on their plate, but connecting to Toronto for them should be a priority. The Yonge extension may be a bit further off, but hopefully they can find money for the Stouffville line electrification.
Peel also has a lot on their plate, but hopefully they can find some money for the Georgetown line electrification.
spider
Senior Member
This “One City†proposal is curious at best and comical at worst. My observations as a retired citizen of 70 years in this fair city who has used the TTC daily for many years when it made sense and driven my car when it did not.
I am sure that most TTC riders use the system because they have no alternative. I know many many people who never take the better way, never. Nothing will change this attitude. Nothing the TTC does will change the ridership habits of these 2 groups who probably together comprise a majority of the system customer base.
Neither the Federal or Provincial Governments are going to toss 20 billion dollars Toronto's way ever so let's get used to the idea that Toronto's taxpayers will have to foot the entire bill. As a Toronto taxpayer I don't mind paying an extra 10% or more on my tax bill but I have a few quibbles.
The TTC fare must increase to at least $4.50 a trip, why should everyone but the user be called upon to finance their ride? If the city must subsidize every ride why is it smart to try and increase the number of riders?
The extra tax income must be dedicated to subway construction only, no more bus or street car lines.
The TTC must not be allowed any authority whatsoever in the design, construction or management in the new projects.
I am sure that most TTC riders use the system because they have no alternative. I know many many people who never take the better way, never. Nothing will change this attitude. Nothing the TTC does will change the ridership habits of these 2 groups who probably together comprise a majority of the system customer base.
Neither the Federal or Provincial Governments are going to toss 20 billion dollars Toronto's way ever so let's get used to the idea that Toronto's taxpayers will have to foot the entire bill. As a Toronto taxpayer I don't mind paying an extra 10% or more on my tax bill but I have a few quibbles.
The TTC fare must increase to at least $4.50 a trip, why should everyone but the user be called upon to finance their ride? If the city must subsidize every ride why is it smart to try and increase the number of riders?
The extra tax income must be dedicated to subway construction only, no more bus or street car lines.
The TTC must not be allowed any authority whatsoever in the design, construction or management in the new projects.