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City Workers Strike 2009

cdr108 said:
i wonder if a private member's injunction could be submitted, and charges/arrests laid against the individual members and the union PER delay?
also, could illegal confinement charges be laid too?

it seems like those are the only tactics that seem to be noticed.

1 minute vs. 15 minutes is substantial ...
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Why can't the police just enforce the existing law without an injunction and fine and arrest picketers who obstruct citizens???
As I understand, the law states that picketers cannot stop or delay people.
 
The Toronto Police have had two big eggs on there faces this year. The first was the Tamil protesters debacles with the tying up of city streets particularly the Gardiner incident. Now siding with their union brethren and not helping out the general public at dump sites when the union members pull their bullshit.
 
lister said:
The Toronto Police have had two big eggs on there faces this year. The first was the Tamil protesters debacles with the tying up of city streets particularly the Gardiner incident. Now siding with their union brethren and not helping out the general public at dump sites when the union members pull their bullshit.
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Worse still is that their threatening to charge citizens who respond to the threats of union members.
 
From what I've seen on the news, the police intervened when the "Friends of Christie Pits" protestors prevented people from bringing their garbage to that site, but nothing appears to be done when the picketers prevent people from bringing their garbage to the sites. Unless I'm mistaken, it seems to me that if you go after one group you should go after the other that's doing the same thing.
 
mangasparky said:
Collective Agreement between city of Toronto and CUPE Local 79.

http://www.cupelocal79.org/Agreements/FT CA WG 2005 2008 FINAL with Wage Schedule.pdf

pay charts starting on 166..
sick pay gratuity on 23..
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I hope everybody has a good look before we go any further in the discussion.

If you feel sorry for these union staff then pray tell where the sympathy is for the privatized garbage collector working twice as hard getting less than the lowest paid occupation on the city's charts.

Some have pointed out here that it's okay to pay retail workers a little less since they are transient jobs. Well apparently the city doesn't feel that way. It pays cashiers 25 bucks an hour.

My social conscience demands that prices go up everywhere (its a crime that we don't pay 5 bucks for a medium double-double coffee at Tim's) and that we pay everybody who works at Walmart, Zellers, Gap, Mexx, etc. 50k a year regardless of their skill set and the market demands for that skill set. Who's with me?
 
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It appears to me that the hourly minimum pay is $20.19 for a cleaner light duty and the max is $55.82 for a senior planner urban design as of December 31, 2008.

I wonder if my brake lines will be cut for posting this PDF?

For the record, this changes nothing, I am still very pro-union. I just wanted people to argue over actual documents, not opinions. If there is a document to support the Etobicoke garbage worker cost effectiveness, post it, otherwise it is just not worthy.
 
I was in a community meeting today (unrelated to the strike) where a North York city councillor and a city gardener both thought It'd be over by the end of the week. Take it for what its worth.
 
mangasparky said:
It appears to me that the hourly minimum pay is $20.19 for a cleaner light duty and the max is $55.82 for a senior planner urban design as of December 31, 2008.

I wonder if my brake lines will be cut for posting this PDF?

For the record, this changes nothing, I am still very pro-union. I just wanted people to argue over actual documents, not opinions. If there is a document to support the Etobicoke garbage worker cost effectiveness, post it, otherwise it is just not worthy.
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was previously posted, but you may have missed it.

when the City of Etobicoke contracted out the services, they city saved more money beyond just the average salary. The contracted services uses 1/2 the number of workers too !

Here's an article from 2007 about what happened when the City of Toronto decided to bring back garbage collection in-house for York.

http://www.owma.org/db/db2file.asp?fileid=523




Toronto STar article says contracted workers get about $18/hour and does a comparison of benefits, etc.

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/655607

TURTLE ISLAND WASTE COLLECTORS


Pay: Varies depending on the kind of truck you drive and bonuses, workers say. One worker makes $23 an hour, while another said his base wage was $18 an hour, but that he typically makes around $21 with bi-weekly bonuses. Bonuses are based on how much weight he lugs and whether he gets to work on time.

Hours: Four-day week. One worker says he usually works 12-hour days.

Benefits: Include health care, dental and eye care.

Sick days: Unpaid. There are no bankable sick days.

Overtime: According to one worker, overtime pay does not begin until after 50 hours.



CITY OF TORONTO WASTE COLLECTORS


Pay: $25.11 an hour for drivers or loaders of solid waste, up 2.75 to 3.25 per cent annually since 2005.

Hours: Four 10-hour days a week.

Benefits: Extended health includes dental care, life insurance, eye care and physiotherapy.

Sick days: 18 sick days each year; unused days can be banked and cashed in on retirement, subject to certain limits.

Overtime: Time-and-a-half
 
nfitz said:
I finally picked up today's (Wednesday's) Star and there is an absolutely excellent article on the front page; the perspective of the strike from 16-year old summer student on strike. It's very well written, and absolutely worth the read:

http://www.thestar.com/article/666403
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It's a very well-written article (especially given her age), and I think that it provides a great perspective of a younger person on strike, but I think the analysis in the article suffers a bit from her lack of objectivity.

Under their current contract, which expires next year, Toronto police get a pay raise of at least 3 per cent each year, and had to make no concessions. Toronto firefighters got an increase of 3 per cent annually with no concessions. TTC workers got 3 per cent with no concessions. Toronto Housing workers got 3 per cent with no concessions. Even city councillors got a pay raise of 2.4 per cent while still arguing that the city cannot afford any more union pay raises.
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Her best point, and really what CUPE's hanging their hat on. I agree, it really does seem unfair that everyone got raises and they didn't, but if the raises were wrong for everyone, it's equally wrong to give them to CUPE workers. Two wrongs (or seven wrongs or whatever) don't make a right. It certainly seems unfair, though.

When initially discussing our contract with David Miller, Local 79 president Ann Dembinski reported back to the union that the city was initially offering something along the lines of a 0 per cent raise in the first year and a 1 per cent raise in the second year. As workers, we could lose money that first year because of inflation. That's pretty vile.
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Starting from here is where she started to lose me. Why is not getting a raise (and potentially having inflation eating away at your real-dollar salary) 'vile'? It sucks, sure, but 'vile'? I would think that the people losing their jobs in the private sector would be happy to accept this 'vile' compromise in order to hold on to their jobs.

Even so, in most of the cases when verbal fights did break out, they were started by people impatient about waiting an extra 15 minutes to dump their trash because of the picket. (When I was at Ingram, nobody waited for more than half an hour to drop off three bags of garbage.)
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Although that may be true in her case, it's been pretty well documented that waits at some dropoff locations have stretched into the multiple hour range. I agree that people having to wait an extra 15 minutes may not be justified in flipping out, but I have a lot more sympathy for people waiting four hours.

I can barely claim to understand the complexities of the labour dispute. However, I can say that it's mean and hurtful when a man parks his car and grinds his wheels against the pavement, releasing pungent fumes and causing the pregnant woman who was picketing with me to start coughing.
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I think it's unlikely that this guy purposely ground his wheels against the pavement in order to release these mysterious 'wheel fumes' that made the pregnant woman cough.

Anyway, I think her first sentence captures the essence of the article: She can barely claim to understand the complexities of the labour dispute. The article reads somewhat like a young girl who doesn't really get the larger picture, but really empathizes with the people on the picket line and through their shared experiences has started to share their viewpoints.

It's hard to argue with this:

I'm just pleading for a bit of respect, really. You don't need to agree with what the unions are fighting for. All you need to do is grant us the basic dignity any human being deserves.
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But then she ends off with this:

Don't get angry. You'll get to where you need to go ... just a couple of minutes later, that's all.
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which, if you replace "a couple of minutes" with "four hours", doesn't seem so easy to swallow.
 
Again,

It's becoming more and more clear that the most ideal solution is to open everything up and solicit bids.

The union can bid for garbage collection work and if it is successful then give them the work. However, I would say there's a 98% chance that the union would not win the bid, which is why Miller would not ever go for that idea.
 
By law, could Miller just call a press conference and say: We haven't been able to come up with an agreement: You're all fired. Request for Proposals for private contracting is up as of now.
 
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