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Whole Foods

I like them but do find them expensive. I'm not sure how forecasts of groceries becoming yet more expensive will impact their bottom line.
 
I'm finding that there are a lot of "Health Food" stores popping up everywhere now. Most aren't of the scale of Whole Foods but it is an increasing market.
 
They aren't in Toronto itself yet, but Farm Boy stores are starting to open. I find them to be more appealing and less pretentious than Whole Foods
 
Does anyone think Whole Foods will become quite popular in the city? I only started going to their store in Toronto after living in the US, as in Canada before I encountered the chain I always shopped at Canadian grocery stores. But I think that them having stores dedicated fully to organic and natural products fills a niche that wasn't present before in our city (where those kinds of foods were present but only in a section of other stores rather than the whole store).

Do you think Whole Foods competes with places like Loblaws etc. or attracts different people?

There were organic and natural grocery stores in the GTA before Whole Foods (like the Big Carrot), but Whole Foods was on a different scale (should note that Whole Foods isn't actually "fully" organic and natural). Whole Foods competes against everyone from Pusateri's to Loblaws to Noah's. As for their popularity, Whole Foods has been here since 2002, so it's fairly easy to gauge. They've expanded since then (and continue to do so), so presumably are doing well, but I don't think any of the Loblaws/Sobeys/Metro/Longos of the world will be supplanted by them anytime soon. In the U.S., Whole Foods is facing pressure from traditional supermarkets (and Walmart) putting even more emphasis on healthier as well as organic foods (has also been happening here for some time) and from specialty grocers like Trader Joe's (less of an issue here), so I am going to guess it isn't clear sailing for Whole Foods in Canada either.
 
They aren't in Toronto itself yet, but Farm Boy stores are starting to open. I find them to be more appealing and less pretentious than Whole Foods

I've said on these threads before, I love Farm Boy and I agree with PinkLucy's assessment. Unfortunately, Farm Boy actively seeks out suburban locations - vast surface parking is one of their key criteria for choosing new locations. Even in Ottawa, where Farm Boy is almost everywhere, they are strictly a suburban thing. So, Farm Boy may compete some day with Whole Foods in places like Oakville and Mississauga, we are (sadly) unlikely to see them in the city anytime soon.
 
I wouldn't say strictly suburban in Ottawa -- there are a couple on Bank, for example. So in more residential areas, but not restricted to Orleans, Nepean, Kanata, etc. Not right in the downtown either but certainly in Ottawa proper. It would be great if they could consider the growing urban population in both Ottawa and Toronto. I know someone who's pretty connected there; I'll see if I can find out if they've considered an urban concept store.
 
I've said on these threads before, I love Farm Boy and I agree with PinkLucy's assessment. Unfortunately, Farm Boy actively seeks out suburban locations - vast surface parking is one of their key criteria for choosing new locations. Even in Ottawa, where Farm Boy is almost everywhere, they are strictly a suburban thing. So, Farm Boy may compete some day with Whole Foods in places like Oakville and Mississauga, we are (sadly) unlikely to see them in the city anytime soon.

Isn't Farm Boy more or less like Longo's in the GTA? That's the vibe I got when I visited a Farm Boy for the first time while visiting my (now) in-laws. Maybe they'll eventually open a smaller, Market by Longo's concept for downtown.
 
Longo's is more like a traditional supermarket than FarmBoy. For example, FB has virtually no frozen food.
 
Isn't Farm Boy more or less like Longo's in the GTA? That's the vibe I got when I visited a Farm Boy for the first time while visiting my (now) in-laws. Maybe they'll eventually open a smaller, Market by Longo's concept for downtown.

Not really. I've only ever been to the Longo's in central Toronto, like the one at Maple Leaf Square or the lovely one on Laird, and those are not really anything like Farm Boy (I suppose they all sell food). Maybe how I imagine Longo's used to be -- older, smaller Longo's up north that focus on fresh foods, with not a lot of space for the so-called middle aisle goods? I've never been to those Longo's in the 905, so can't say.

Most of the floor space of Farm Boy is dedicated to produce, interspersed with food items that go with the produce (dressings, sauces, etc. - mostly the Farm Boy in-house brand), with great butcher, deli, fish, bakery counters and a hot food/prepared food area. Relatively very little in terms of other supermarket goods, and even then, mostly chosen to compliment the stuff Farm Boy does specialize in. You wouldn't go to Farm Boy to buy cereal, paper towel, granola bars, etc. But they do sell olive oils, marinating sauces, tomato paste, etc. - the kinds of things you would also need to complete your meal if you'd just picked up meat and produce elsewhere in the store.

Farm Boy stores are already relatively small (albeit larger than the typical Market by Longo's). I don't think they would need to have a different concept, like Longo's, to fit (space wise) downtown. But I've read interviews with the Farm Boy people about their expansion -- they do not seem interested at all in urban areas. They are focused on suburbia, and frankly, there are a lot of untapped markets in Ontario for them to enter before they need to adjust their thinking.
 
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I wouldn't say strictly suburban in Ottawa -- there are a couple on Bank, for example. So in more residential areas, but not restricted to Orleans, Nepean, Kanata, etc. Not right in the downtown either but certainly in Ottawa proper. It would be great if they could consider the growing urban population in both Ottawa and Toronto. I know someone who's pretty connected there; I'll see if I can find out if they've considered an urban concept store.

The stores on Bank are both quite far south - where Bank is an arterial road and the area is dominated by surburban-type, car-oriented plazas (the Blue Heron store on Bank is where my grandparents used to go - they lived near Kilborn and Alta Vista) - one of the Bank stores is even south of Hunt Club! The closest store to downtown Ottawa is the Train Yards outlet - which is a big box centre. By suburban, I mean the overall context (car-oriented, vast surface parking, pedestrian unfriendly, etc.) rather than necessarily being located in a former suburban city like Kanata. I can't think of a store they have which I would say is in an urban environment.

I know someone who works at Farm Boy HQ too, an old friend from high school, who looked at me funny when I once asked him if Farm Boy would ever move into central Toronto. (I would be interested in knowing what your friend says, Lucy, since I am not sure I trust the perspective of mine since he's never seen a big box mall he didn't love). But the news articles on their expansion seem to have focused on how the chain is looking for new locations with "lots of surface parking".
 
He got back to me already. They are going to test the urban market in Ottawa first before considering Toronto. Two totally different beasts, though. They need to come spend some time in residential, urban Toronto :) Having spent many years in the grocery business, I think it's a market waiting to be tapped and with room for growth and change.
 
I am delighted to hear that, and agree that the urban market in Ottawa is not the same as central Toronto. Farm Boy hasn't shown any interest (publicly) to date in urban areas, but it's good to hear that it is on their radar. I hope that what they mean by "urban market" is actually urban, though.
 
should note that Whole Foods isn't actually "fully" organic and natural

Yeah at first when I heard about Whole Foods and what it was known for, I assumed that it was fully that way, but then I realized that on many of the products, such as fruits and vegetables they have the label "Conventional" on it.

Whole Foods is pretty expensive, and probably especially so now with the Canadian dollar, but as a Torontonian who not that long ago moved to Chicago, I found shopping at the Whole Foods in the US affordable compared even with regular Canadian groceries for certain products that are not organic, and the difference was particularly noticeable when I returned to Toronto the past Christmas and New Years' to see family and walked into a Canadian Whole Foods to shop.
 
Well, if Whole Foods survived in Toronto the last time the dollar was this low, it should be able to do so now. I'm a little more worried about Nordstrom and Saks.
 
To those who say there are no Whole Foods in Toronto there are at least 2. One in Yorkville has been there since 2002 I believe and one just opened recently at Yonge and Sheppard. Both seem to be doing just fine. They are placed in locations that compete directly with Pusateris as they are a high end grocery store with good choices for healthier eating.
 

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