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What's the future for the Conservative Party?

The outreach isn't to them - but to the mushy middle that has limited attention span and tolerance, fair or otherwise of too much "isms" on the airwave. What gets the message across better - saying we will not tolerate discrimination against Muslims, or we will not tolerate Islamophobia? The former is far more direct, easy to understand and clearly identifies the target - it should be the goal of any public communication. This really isn't an academic debate.

AoD

They are both direct, easy to understand and clearly identify the target. People are feigning confusion and concern only because Muslims are involved.

We don't need to do this for Jews (nobody worries about the "ism" in anti-Semitism), we don't need to do it for other racialized communities (nobody worries about the "ism" in anti-racism), and we don't need to do for the LGBT community (nobody beyond the so-con fringe suggests that we can't use the word homophobia because the word in itself suggests that we ban all religious teachings on the subject). I find it hard to believe I am actually having a discussion with someone about how we have to spell out what we mean carefully when it comes to Muslims, in a way we don't do for any other group, so as to ensure no one thinks that about anti-discrimination efforts are too broad and to avoid offending those with "limited attention span and tolerance".

People have latched onto a trumped-up reason to oppose this motion, while the usual cast of characters are trying to raise hysteria through falsehoods (sharia law! limits on free speech!). This is nothing more than that. It has nothing to do with outreach or messaging, and pretending it does just feeds the hysteria.
 
I have to agree with both of you. Maybe it needs to be spelled out directly as anti-Muslim discrimination. But the fact that we have to go out of our way to do that because people caught us on a technicality is upsetting. Look at the most vocal opponents of this motion—the hysteric ones. The anti-Muslim sentiment is glaringly obvious.
 
Listening to O'Leary, with the exception of being an "outsider businessman" who "tells it like it is" he doesn't really sound much like Trump policy-wise. He just seems to be "fiscally conservative and socially liberal." Has he actually taken a hard-right stance on any non-fiscal issue? Can he get the CPC nomination by being "just" a fiscal conservative?

Maybe the parallel is more Mulroney than Trump? Or Trump pre-2010?
 
Say good-bye to Canadian ways. The moose-lambs are coming...

The Id of the Conservative Party:

http://www.therebel.media/freedom-to-offend-free-speech-not-sharia

In short: The Canadian government is preparing to silence anyone who criticizes Islam.

Their anti-Islamophobia motion (which will, in all likelihood, be voted on during this parliamentary session) resembles a kind of blasphemy law in favour of one preferred religion above all others. If this motion passes,

If this motion passes, Canadians can be persecuted for expressing any criticism of Islam, even when warranted.

This unfounded anti-Islamophobia legislation flies in the face of our Constitution and its embedded Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

Sharia law and it’s related speech codes are not a reasonable limit on my freedoms.

According to our charter of rights and freedoms — we’re all equal. Every individual (not a belief system or ideology) is equal before and under the law. We all have equal protections and benefit equally from the law.

Muslims do not get special treatment or protections.

Where was your outrage when we passed similar anti-semitic motions less than a year ago? How about Ontario? You are an islamophobe, and motion M-103 is meant for people like you.
 
Can anybody name a Muslim-majority country where gays aren't persecuted? I wonder how Canadian Muslims feel about gays?

gsi2-chp3-6.png


Hmm...maybe they're more progressive on abortion?

gsi2-chp3-4.png


Honour killings...

gsi2-chp3-11.png


Geez...maybe it's right to question the type of people we are bringing into Canada?
 
Nevermind the Catholics, Orthodox Jews or African Anglicans then. I mean, before we go all gaga about it, perhaps we should administer that test about the morality of abortion and homosexuality (nevermind honour killings) on homegrown Canadian Conservatives first and see how much of a Canadian value that is.

AoD
 
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Nevermind the Catholics, Orthodox Jews or African Anglicans then. I mean, before we go all gaga about it, perhaps we should administer that test about the morality of abortion and homosexuality (nevermind honour killings) on homegrown Canadian Conservatives first and see how much of a Canadian value that is.

AoD

Let's see the stats...

Oh right, you don't trade in facts. :D

BTW, Donald Trump supported gay marriage from day one of his presidency, unlike Obama.
 
Let's see the stats...

Oh right, you don't trade in facts. :D

BTW, Donald Trump supported gay marriage from day one of his presidency, unlike Obama.

Check out the stats yourself:

Slide5-3.png


http://abacusdata.ca/canadians-mora...tly-from-that-of-our-neighbours-to-the-south/

And oh, since we are on the topic of "facts" - from Pew in the US:

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http://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/views-about-abortion/

upload_2017-3-9_12-33-24.png

http://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/views-about-homosexuality/

upload_2017-3-9_12-35-0.png

http://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/views-about-same-sex-marriage/

I guess we better watch out for those evangelicals more than the Muslims if you want a simplistic view of values by religion or country of origin.

And since one is keen to cite reports and stats without links - here is the bit on Sub-Saharan Africa:

upload_2017-3-9_12-44-57.png

http://www.pewforum.org/files/2010/04/sub-saharan-africa-chapter-5.pdf

Note in particular: On social issues, Christians and Muslims alike express very strong opposition to abortion, prostitution, suicide and homosexual behavior, with nine-in-ten or more in many countries calling these practices morally wrong. Large majorities in nearly every country express opposition to sex between unmarried people, and substantial numbers (roughly four-in-ten or more) in every country say that AIDS is God’s punishment for immoral sexual behavior. Majorities in most countries oppose drinking alcohol; opposition is especially strong among Muslims. Divorce is also widely seen as morally wrong. In many countries, opposition to divorce is particularly strong among Christians.

Clearly, I don't do facts.

As to Donald Trump - his "support" after all the heavy lifting is done is about as meaningful as someone supporting the right of women to vote after it's been legal for years. It wasn't he who had to spend the political capital to put an end to DADT, stop enforcing the defense of DOMA, etc. Nice of you to lecture to the gays what Trump (or the Cons) has done for the community though, because apparently they don't know who stood up for them when the going was tough.

AoD
 

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