TOareaFan
Superstar
I would not imagine that is a significant number......that small group would be inconvenienced by having to go East one station to connect to a WB GO train at Bloor....I guess.
Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited
kEiThZ
Superstar
Check out UPE website. Fares are way too complicated. It's like some marketing major's homework.
$15 flat. Presto or not.
$10 13-29 and 65+
$40 Family pass. 2 adults and 3 kids.
I'm tempted to say they should just drop the cheaper zone fares. It'll focus the service much more on airport bound travelers. No dealing with 1 and 2 stop commuters.
That's a fare structure that is extremely competitive with taxis and Uber. Any single traveller will be riding UPE. Any 2 adults traveling together would find this cheaper than a cab. Any 3 travelers might find this appealing. But we'd still lose groups of 4 to taxis.
$15 flat. Presto or not.
$10 13-29 and 65+
$40 Family pass. 2 adults and 3 kids.
I'm tempted to say they should just drop the cheaper zone fares. It'll focus the service much more on airport bound travelers. No dealing with 1 and 2 stop commuters.
That's a fare structure that is extremely competitive with taxis and Uber. Any single traveller will be riding UPE. Any 2 adults traveling together would find this cheaper than a cab. Any 3 travelers might find this appealing. But we'd still lose groups of 4 to taxis.
Palma
Senior Member
I went to the website and for me to find out how much it costs. I selected union to Pearson and but am expected to log on. I just wanted to see the fares. Am I blind or something. I should be able to see the fares at a glance
nfitz
Superstar
I've never had to log on. But I've never had an account - perhaps there is a cookie issue.
https://www.upexpress.com/Tickets/Tickets
https://www.upexpress.com/Tickets/Tickets
Attachments
drum118
Superstar
New Way Find signs are to looked at for both Union and Pearson so people have a clue where to catch the train.
As a note, had a look at Union to see if the current station be expanded for more cars. Can't add to the west as it will interfere with switch clearance. Going east will see it on the curve.
As a note, had a look at Union to see if the current station be expanded for more cars. Can't add to the west as it will interfere with switch clearance. Going east will see it on the curve.
mdrejhon
Senior Member
Could the switch be moved to compensate? For a theoretical low-fare UPX that suddenly became popular, couldn't the station be lengthened by only 0.5 car length to add 1 car? The front-most and rear-most UPX doors aren't at the very tips of the train, so the station could technically be slightly shorter than the train. It looked like current station is almost barely long enough to reach all doors of a theoretical 4 car UPX, in this perspective. The existing station would need its doors shifted, but would limit lengthening of the station.
Realistically I think for a popular electric RER-ified UPX with low transit fare, it has to be relocated to a Union track converted to high platform, for quicker access and longer trains. With Metrolinx going full EMU, the high platform talk may need to begin.
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Admiral Beez
Superstar
Perhaps when we have road tolls on the Gardiner-427 and DVP-401 this will be a better option?
Woodbridge_Heights
Senior Member
Pearson is also offering 50% discounted parking at their daily park lots to coincide with the free UP rides this weekend.
With the max daily park rate at $30, the discounted rate would be $15. Cheaper than the $20+ charged at lots in the city. A group of 4 or more could use this and have a cheaper way to get into the city than say parking at a TTC subway lot and subway'ing in.
With the max daily park rate at $30, the discounted rate would be $15. Cheaper than the $20+ charged at lots in the city. A group of 4 or more could use this and have a cheaper way to get into the city than say parking at a TTC subway lot and subway'ing in.
LNahid2000
Senior Member
Why would anyone pay $15 to park at Pearson instead of parking at Kipling for free and being able to get anywhere in the city (imstead of just Union) for a a couple of dollars more per person.
Also, there are many downtown lots with $5 all day parking on weekends/holidays.
Woodbridge_Heights
Senior Member
Same reason a group of 4 would jump into a cab rather than pay individual fares (on say a UP Express), to spread the cost out over a larger group.
With the NBA All Star game in town I would not be surprised to see lots charge $20+
Anyway I'm just reporting what I saw.
smallspy
Senior Member
Because maybe people don't want to lug 2 weeks worth of luggage on the bus?
If I'm taking a short trip, I don't think twice about hopping on the bus/subway. But if I'm going away for longer than 7 days, forget that.
Dan
Toronto, Ont.
LNahid2000
Senior Member
Taking the bus to the subway is actually easier than taking the UP Express if your destination is anything but Union Station.
Going from the Union UP Express Station to the Union TTC Station involves a 400 metre walk with many staircases and ramps.
Taking the bus to the subway involves getting off the bus, going one level down, and getting on the subway. It's WAY easier.
If you're worried about carrying around luggage, it's probably best to just take a cab.
ShonTron
Moderator
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I created another series of charts, based on the same data that Steve Munro had. I posted these as well to my blog.
The TTC’s 192 Airport Rocket, which has its own dedicated bus fleet, carries 4,700 passengers on an average weekday. The TTC doesn’t have a special operating division or President for that route, even though it carries nearly twice the number of passengers as UP Express.
It's an embarrassment, and I don't think simply lowering fares is going to be enough to make the airport rail line truly useful.
The TTC’s 192 Airport Rocket, which has its own dedicated bus fleet, carries 4,700 passengers on an average weekday. The TTC doesn’t have a special operating division or President for that route, even though it carries nearly twice the number of passengers as UP Express.
It's an embarrassment, and I don't think simply lowering fares is going to be enough to make the airport rail line truly useful.
smallspy
Senior Member
I'm not disagreeing with any of that. I've taken UPX a number of times when it's been conducive to do so, but I generally take the TTC. And I do take cabs to the airport on a somewhat regular basis as well as necessary.
I'm just simply pointing out that the lowest cost is not the largest factor in most people's decision making process.
Dan
Toronto, Ont.
TOareaFan
Superstar
The slow (no?) growth in UP usage (while still early) is causing me some concern about the future of a lot of our province's transit plans...and is a bigger issue than UP itself (after all, the UP specific costs were fairly modest when compared to our other spending plans).
I have used UP...and I see value in it....but that does not change the fact that it seems many don't. I have also read/heard many of the individual reasons people give (here and elsewhere) for not using it and while I may disagree it does not change the fact that they are very valid for those individuals on their own level....and ridership is built up of a lot of personal/individual decisions.
UP, at it's core, was predicated on a behaviour modification model.....we have an airport and a lot of people use it (locals and visitors) and they have their ways of getting to the airport. For UP to be successful it has(had?) to convince a decently significant (but not huge) number of people to change their method of getting to the airport. Partly it had to convince some who use public transit (rocket or GO buses) to pay a bit more for a more comfortable/direct ride to the airport but, mostly, it had to convince drivers/parkers and cab users to switch. In the very short term it has not reached those people enough to significantly change their behaviour.
This is where my growing concern is. This province is spending billions of dollars on a bunch of transit lines that have that very same objective....that is change your behaviour. Don't drive to Port Credit or Cooksville GO...take the LRT! Hamiltonians, get on the LRT! Everyone coming to Toronto, ditch the car and get on one of those GO trains that will be every 15 minutes each direction! etc.
If behaviours are that entrenched and if a fairly modest goal of 5k riders to the airport is so difficult to achieve....how realistic are the ridership projections on those lines (and others)? Is transit less a "build it an they will come" proposition than we believe (or are told)?
I have used UP...and I see value in it....but that does not change the fact that it seems many don't. I have also read/heard many of the individual reasons people give (here and elsewhere) for not using it and while I may disagree it does not change the fact that they are very valid for those individuals on their own level....and ridership is built up of a lot of personal/individual decisions.
UP, at it's core, was predicated on a behaviour modification model.....we have an airport and a lot of people use it (locals and visitors) and they have their ways of getting to the airport. For UP to be successful it has(had?) to convince a decently significant (but not huge) number of people to change their method of getting to the airport. Partly it had to convince some who use public transit (rocket or GO buses) to pay a bit more for a more comfortable/direct ride to the airport but, mostly, it had to convince drivers/parkers and cab users to switch. In the very short term it has not reached those people enough to significantly change their behaviour.
This is where my growing concern is. This province is spending billions of dollars on a bunch of transit lines that have that very same objective....that is change your behaviour. Don't drive to Port Credit or Cooksville GO...take the LRT! Hamiltonians, get on the LRT! Everyone coming to Toronto, ditch the car and get on one of those GO trains that will be every 15 minutes each direction! etc.
If behaviours are that entrenched and if a fairly modest goal of 5k riders to the airport is so difficult to achieve....how realistic are the ridership projections on those lines (and others)? Is transit less a "build it an they will come" proposition than we believe (or are told)?