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Toronto St. Clair West Transit Improvements | ?m | ?s | TTC

Re: Court Decision Expected Today

You would never know these people lived in the inner city, by how anti transit they are.

Anyway maybe this will be a lesson for the TTC, to actually fix what is wrong with SPADINA before trying to push this ROW on other communities.
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

Well, may I suggest a countersolution?

Stop running streetcars along St. Clair and provide no alternate TTC route. Afterall, NOT providing transit service is always a policy option not subjected to the courts.

I would love to see the results in a few weeks time.

GB
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

I am seriously considering seeing if there is legal action that could be filed against SOS in relation to this matter just to demonstrate that there are people on the other side also willing to kick up a ruckus to get it through.

I am moving to Fleet Street next year and want to be damn sure it goes through without any delay.
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

Looks like someone at the City's legal dept. f<cd up.
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

That would be interesting rbtaylor. Almost like a lawsuit for better transit.
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

Now Toronto's transit advocates feel the same way that a lot of Christians (not generalizing, of course) felt about the courts ruling on same-sex marriage. Perhaps this block is another example of why judges have too much power in this country.
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

I wonder what can the provincial government do in this instance. Does the minister have the authority to waiver EA requirements?

wylie:

Now now, while I can understand the agony of defeat is similiar, there is a difference between a ruling with explicit effects on the lives of area residents from one that has absolutely no effect on anyone other than those immediately involved, other than some nomenclatural issues.

GB
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

Was the EA conducted for the St. Clair project consistent with the EAs conduced for Spadina and Queen's Quay? That should be far more important than an argument over semantics and what some city cartographer chose to put on a map years ago.

I can say with utmost confidence that the ROW is NOT rapid transit.
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

cdl:

The EA for St. Clair is truncated (Class EA). Not 100% sure, but I believe Spadina is Individual EA.

Here is the def'n for Class EA, from Ministry of Environment:

Not all undertakings subject to the Environmental Assessment Act (EAA) need to go through the Act's review and approval process as previously described. There are some groups or "classes" of projects which are:

carried out routinely; and
have predictable and mitigable environmental effects,

and therefore, do not warrant an individual Environmental Assessment (Individual EA). These are known as Class Environmental Assessment (Class EA) projects.
Click to expand...

I believe St. Clair satisified both characteristics.

GB
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

GB:

there is a difference between a ruling with explicit effects on the lives of area residents from one that has absolutely no effect on anyone other than those immediately involved, other than some nomenclatural issues.
Click to expand...

Funny (but not funny ha-ha) how this came down to nomenclatural issues too...
 
Re: Court Decision Expected Today

Yes a Class B EA was done and it was a very detail one as well as a long one. I have been to every EA meeting as well taking part in getting petitions sign for the support of the ROW. I even visited and talked with these empty airhead business folks along St Clair.

Cutting streetcar service will only add to SOS gout for this ruling as it this is what they want in the first place. Also, what is going to happen to the riders who use this service now? TTC does not have the 100 buses or the drivers for them to replace the streetcars in the first and it will be 2 years before TTC gets those buses.

Hummm!!! $60 million for buses, $25 million for Drivers, and $35 million for a bus garage to store them which works out to be $120 million up front cost to put buses on the road in place of streetcars. Nice bill for the SOS folks.

If the SOS wants buses on this route or the subway they prefer to see built in the first place, then let them pickup the full cost of doing so. These wells change their tune fast.

It is time for transit riders to start taking legal action for the lack of service cause by SOS groups, but the City also for catering to the cars in the first place.

TTC made a mess on Spadina and they need to fix those problems now, otherwise forget about seeing anymore ROW let alone St Clair.

TTC is caught in a bind now as what to do about the tracks that are almost 2 years past replacing. Oct 19 TTC meet will be a hot one.

I am sure the Government is following this very closely as it well depend how the government write the new Toronto act to deal with this EA issue. The government will have to rewrite the EA process also. I see the government stepping in to resolve this issue.

Now this has happen, expect to see more legal issues surround transit within Ontario.

Oh!!, don't forget theses judges are car folks!

Dave
 
CHUM-FM (which I'm forced to listen to at work) has been saying for the past two hours that The City won in court today against the S.O.S. group and that Mayor Miller is saying "full steam ahead for the R.O.W."

Fantastic news! However, I still can't find any word of it on any of the regular sites (Star, CP24, CBC, etc.)
 
OMG, too funny. Three of us posted the news simultaneously at 17:35. LOL.
 
I posted first! What do I win? (Other than a more reliable trip to the gelato store?)
 
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