narduch
Senior Member
Murray killed one person, Muzzo killed 4.
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Roads: Increase Ontario 400-series Highway Speed Limit
- Thread starter chrison
- Start date
Murray killed one person, Muzzo killed 4.
TOareaFan
Superstar
Each was one incident/crime....but, the way we sentence in Canada (for all crimes) it does not matter....we don't do consecutive sentencing we do concurrent sentencing (for the most part) so even if he was given four 10 year sentences he would serve them all over the same 10 (or less) years.
narduch
Senior Member
The judge took that into account in the Muzzo case. He probably gets 3-4 years had it been one person.
TOareaFan
Superstar
how many years did Melissa Ann Shepard get for manslaughter (the second time she was convicted of killing a spouse)? Again, I am not arguing that the sentincing for killing people while drunk behind the wheel is appropriate...but the sentencing seems pretty consistent with other forms of manslaughter to me.
What (IMO) is out of whack with other crimes is the sentencing in cases where no one is hurt/killed. If I take a gun (don't worry, I don't have one and never will) and shoot at someone and miss I am charged with attempted murder and likely gonna spend some time behind bars.....if I get in my car drunk (no need to worry about that either) and the law intervenes before I hurt someone I am gonna get off much more lightly. I think a major deterrent to drinking and driving could be achieved if we significantly increased the consequences in those cases.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
One problem is the electronic speed limiters that cap large trucks speed at 105 km/h. From link:
That means that the right lane should remain limited at 100 km/h, for trucks. For automobiles, they'll should be able to use the left lane at 120+ km/h.
The bad news is that Ontario highways are not designed to have the right lane be continuously used for 100 km/h. Not when the right lane either becomes an exit lane or is forced to merged left.
The Ontario highways have to be redesigned and rebuilt for a continuous right lane, so that trucks can drive at 100 km/h in the right lane.
Else, they'll have to increase the truck governors to a higher speed.
That means that the right lane should remain limited at 100 km/h, for trucks. For automobiles, they'll should be able to use the left lane at 120+ km/h.
The bad news is that Ontario highways are not designed to have the right lane be continuously used for 100 km/h. Not when the right lane either becomes an exit lane or is forced to merged left.
The Ontario highways have to be redesigned and rebuilt for a continuous right lane, so that trucks can drive at 100 km/h in the right lane.
Else, they'll have to increase the truck governors to a higher speed.
Steve X
Senior Member
Kinda a random post from the middle of no where.
NOOOOOOOOOOO! Trucks don't need to be going faster than 100km/h. Many states have pretty much posted signs disallowing tucks above 60-65mph on highways faster than 65mph for safety reasons. Europe doesn't allows trucks to be faster than 100. Many are only allowed 80 or 90km/h with a label clearly shown in the back. I'm not sure why you think they need a higher speed. They can drive slower if they need it to merge safely.
I don't know what a continuous right lane is going to solve if there are a million trucks on the 401 driving on whatever lane they feel like (except the left most lane). I do agree with the move that European countries do with left lane ends, merge right. The left lane shouldn't even be a driving lane, especially on rural freeways.
For safety sakes, I would like to see MTO introduce variable speed limit on 400 series highways in the city. In traffic jam situations, many cars try to go from 0 to 100km/h when space permits and rear ending the next car in the next standstill. It's rather bad when people are on their phones too. I don't mind if they use photo cameras to enforce the variable limit. This would allow higher speed limits like 120-130km/h only when the road is completely free with no interference with trucks. Lanes wouldn't have to be redrawn as trucks would have plenty of space to merge when a 120+ km/h limit is allowed. It also permits a safer higher than having cars speed from 0 to 130+km/h in congested areas and possibly creating more serious rear ending accidents.
MisterF
Senior Member
Why? The speed limit is a maximum, not a minimum. There's no reason for trucks to have to be able to reach the maximum legal speed. Trucks driving 105 while other traffic goes 120+ is common worldwide and is already the reality on our highways today.One problem is the electronic speed limiters that cap large trucks speed at 105 km/h. From link:
That means that the right lane should remain limited at 100 km/h, for trucks. For automobiles, they'll should be able to use the left lane at 120+ km/h.
The bad news is that Ontario highways are not designed to have the right lane be continuously used for 100 km/h. Not when the right lane either becomes an exit lane or is forced to merged left.
The Ontario highways have to be redesigned and rebuilt for a continuous right lane, so that trucks can drive at 100 km/h in the right lane.
Else, they'll have to increase the truck governors to a higher speed.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
There should be a minimum. Can't have an automobile driver doing 95 km/h in the left lane with a truck doing their maximum 105 km/h in the right lane, because there is no minimum at the moment.
MisterF
Senior Member
Some jurisdictions do have a minimum. In Quebec it's 60. Not sure about Ontario or other provinces. The scenario you describe would be solved with the simple "keep right except to pass" rule.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
Except I never see it enforced.
Steve X
Senior Member
I believe it's also 60km/h in Ontario for limit access highway and the vehicle must keep right. The vehicle should also have the 4-way flasher on if it was to be that slow.
Some places like Michigan has a minimum of 55mph which is significant higher than 60km/h. The German autobahn does allow speed as slow as 62km/h.
crs1026
Senior Member
Highway Traffic Act, Section 132
132. (1) No motor vehicle shall be driven on a highway at such a slow rate of speed as to impede or block the normal and reasonable movement of traffic thereon except when the slow rate of speed is necessary for safe operation having regard to all the circumstances. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 132 (1).
Do a little googling and you will find posts from (very surprised) people who actually have been charged under this section, so I guess it happens.
My personal complaint is not so much with slow driving on open highways, as with overloaded/underpowered/badly driven trucks entering 400 highways and being unable to accelerate smartly from the on ramp. I see this constantly at the Park Lawn on-ramp to WB QEW, thanks to all the Food Terminal truck traffic. Also happens at Kipling Avenue to QEW westbound. Dump trucks going way over the limit does not average this out! I would like to see police ticketing trucks that can't/don't/won't accelerate at a reasonable rate.
- Paul
132. (1) No motor vehicle shall be driven on a highway at such a slow rate of speed as to impede or block the normal and reasonable movement of traffic thereon except when the slow rate of speed is necessary for safe operation having regard to all the circumstances. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 132 (1).
Do a little googling and you will find posts from (very surprised) people who actually have been charged under this section, so I guess it happens.
My personal complaint is not so much with slow driving on open highways, as with overloaded/underpowered/badly driven trucks entering 400 highways and being unable to accelerate smartly from the on ramp. I see this constantly at the Park Lawn on-ramp to WB QEW, thanks to all the Food Terminal truck traffic. Also happens at Kipling Avenue to QEW westbound. Dump trucks going way over the limit does not average this out! I would like to see police ticketing trucks that can't/don't/won't accelerate at a reasonable rate.
- Paul
BurlOak
Senior Member
Our family had a Volkswagen van back in the day. When entering from highway 400 onto 401 eastbound, I could not attain a speed of 110km until Dufferin. It is uphill all the way to the Barrie GO line (due to the long uphill that starts at Humber River) and just didn't have the power to accelerate.
Steve X
Senior Member
People driving at unnecessary slow rate are at a high risk of a collision. They shouldn't even be on the highway in the first place.
Trucks are also more difficult to pull over. Since they are professional drivers, there should be a better system to fine them without risking the safety of others.
MisterF
Senior Member
Well, the 100 km/h speed limit is never enforced either, but since we're talking about changing it we might as well talk about other changes that would go along with it. If the speed limit is increased to 120, we should enforce the drive right rule as well. The two went hand in hand when BC increased their speed limits to 120, although I have no idea how much the police are actually cracking down on left lane hogs.
Still, I just don't think that a speed limit change will have any significant impact on how people actually drive. The speed limit today is almost universally ignored and traffic routinely moves at 120 or more.