Mississauga Mississauga Transitway | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | IBI Group

[ShonTron]

So can anyone speak to how buses operate at Erin Mills? It seems to me that they use the Erin Mills/403 interchange to access the station. Do they use the rapidway at all, or is it more like a pull-in/pull-out like a carpool lot?

It's pretty bad for eastbound buses, having to go through two left turns at Highway 403 and Erin Mills Parkway to enter and exit the bus loop; it's added 2-3 minutes to the 25 and 29 routes. The 25 would be a pretty quick ride, if it wasn't for all the pull-offs at Erin Mills, Milton, Aberfoyle, Cambridge DumbCentre, Sportsworld.

 

[smably]

The 25 is a mess, especially with the Erin Mills stop. I wish they'd run every second bus express or something -- skip Sportsworld, Aberfoyle, Erin Mills, say? I'm sure those stops could get by with bi-hourly service.

 

[Markster]

The 25 is a mess, especially with the Erin Mills stop. I wish they'd run every second bus express or something -- skip Sportsworld, Aberfoyle, Erin Mills, say? I'm sure those stops could get by with bi-hourly service.

I have a friend who takes advantage of Aberfoyle, by using it to transfer between the 25/29. To get from Guelph to Kitchener/Waterloo.

Because intercity transit between Guelph/KW is so bad, that the GO bus with an untimed transfer well out of the way actually makes more sense than Greyhound.

 

[ShonTron]

I have a friend who takes advantage of Aberfoyle, by using it to transfer between the 25/29. To get from Guelph to Kitchener/Waterloo.

Because intercity transit between Guelph/KW is so bad, that the GO bus with an untimed transfer well out of the way actually makes more sense than Greyhound.

Aberfoyle actually makes sense as a stop; but it's a bit farther from the 401 than it should be, and not close enough to amenities like Tim Hortons to make it a pleasant place to wait.

I wish Greyhound gave up the Kitchener-Guelph market and let GO, or a Guelph-GRT joint operation take it over.

 

[smably]

I have a friend who takes advantage of Aberfoyle, by using it to transfer between the 25/29. To get from Guelph to Kitchener/Waterloo.

Because intercity transit between Guelph/KW is so bad, that the GO bus with an untimed transfer well out of the way actually makes more sense than Greyhound.

Yeah. Likewise, I always use the GO between Toronto and KW, even though it's a milk run with a transfer in Mississauga, because Greyhound is just that bad. Though that route sounds even worse.

 

[nfitz]

Aberfoyle actually makes sense as a stop; but it's a bit farther from the 401 than it should be, and not close enough to amenities like Tim Hortons to make it a pleasant place to wait.

I hadn't realized the GO Aberfoyle was all the way up at McLean Road. Though if you've got a long wait, it's less than a 10-minute walk to the Tim Hortons (and A&W) down at the next traffic light 450 metres to the south. Though the lack of sidewalk would make it unpleasant in the winter.

Yeah. Likewise, I always use the GO between Toronto and KW, even though it's a milk run with a transfer in Mississauga, because Greyhound is just that bad. Though that route sounds even worse.

I haven't taken Greyhound recently - but what is wrong with it? Especially if you catch the express to Kitchener from downtown.

 

[Markster]

I hadn't realized the GO Aberfoyle was all the way up at McLean Road. Though if you've got a long wait, it's less than a 10-minute walk to the Tim Hortons (and A&W) down at the next traffic light 450 metres to the south. Though the lack of sidewalk would make it unpleasant in the winter.

The Aberfoyle stop sure could use a little park-and-ride bus loop right at the highway like the Milton stop has. And then I guess a renaming to Morriston.

 

[smably]

I haven't taken Greyhound recently - but what is wrong with it? Especially if you catch the express to Kitchener from downtown.

Smelly, dirty, falling apart buses, surly drivers, the godawful Toronto Coach Terminal, bad schedule adherence, ridiculous fare rules (you can only buy a ticket with your own credit card, you have to print a dead tree copy of your ticket instead of showing it on your phone like every other civilized service on the planet, you have to book in advance for a particular trip or take your chances with the bus you want being sold out), half the trips go through Guelph and take two hours anyway...

And it's still more expensive than the GO unless you're a student, last I checked. I refuse to give them my money on principle. Don't even get me started on the outrageous state of intercity bus service regulation in Ontario. We grant a monopoly to these scumbags on most routes!

 

[Amare]

Smelly, dirty, falling apart buses

If you think Greyhound Canada buses are like that, try taking the ones in the U.S and you'll see what smelly and dirty are truly like. The problem with Greyhound Canada is that they get the "dirty" second hand buses passed from the U.S, while Greyhound U.S is updating their fleet with newer Prevosts and MCI's. Sometimes the American Prevosts find their way up to Canada and those buses are a real pleasant ride.

But I wont argue with you on the other things you stated.

 

[nfitz]

Smelly, dirty, falling apart buses, surly drivers, the godawful Toronto Coach Terminal, bad schedule adherence, ridiculous fare rules (you can only buy a ticket with your own credit card, you have to print a dead tree copy of your ticket instead of showing it on your phone like every other civilized service on the planet, you have to book in advance for a particular trip or take your chances with the bus you want being sold out), half the trips go through Guelph and take two hours anyway...

Sounds like your overplaying it. Terminal isn't that bad - seems like night and day after the renovations. I'm pretty sure they take more than credit cards - I can't imagine they don't take cash. Last time I tried to show my phone for a Blue Jays game they insisted on paper (perhaps they fixed this now, didn't go this season). And why take a trip through Guelph - the schedule shows which ones are the express.

Surly it's better than having the taxpayer subsidize service, like with GO.

 

[reaperexpress]

The 25 is a mess, especially with the Erin Mills stop. I wish they'd run every second bus express or something -- skip Sportsworld, Aberfoyle, Erin Mills, say? I'm sure those stops could get by with bi-hourly service.

Exactly. I travel frequently between KW and the GTA and I avoid the 25 local like the plague. For me it's either the train, a GO express bus or the car. I literally had a nightmare once where I mistakenly got on a local bus at Square One and had the crushing realization that I'd be stuck on the bus for the next 1h45 (it's now 1h50 with the addition of Erin Mills).

One of the few times I had the misfortune of taking the 25 local, I timed the delay caused by serving Aberfoyle: it was 10 minutes from getting off the highway to getting back on. As awful as the Kitchener-Guelph Greyhound service is, I still don't think stopping in Aberfoyle is worth the inconvenience it causes to people travelling through, because GO isn't significantly better for those trips anyway. It's cheaper and more frequent, but it takes much longer.

From Kitchener Centre terminal to Guelph Central Station:
Greyhound runs 6 trips per direction which take 45-50 min.
GO runs hourly and takes between 55 min and 1h55 depending on the transfer time.

I did take Greyhound once from Kitchener to Toronto and it was fine. The bus was just as comfortable as a GO bus, and it was on time. However this was during Pan-Am so there were HOV lanes on the Gardiner. Without them, there's no way the bus could have kept to the rather ambitious schedule. The main reasons I never end up taking Greyhound are:
- You need to book a ticket in advance to get a cheap ticket (I don't plan far enough in advance for this to be practical)
- You need to print the ticket (I don't have a printer)
- They actually charge significantly more than the price advertised on the website (add tax and service fee), and they don't tell until after you put in your credit card info, which is seriously not cool. VIA on the other hand actually rounds up the prices on the website (including tax, and there is no service fee) so you actually end up paying less in the end.

Surly it's better than having the taxpayer subsidize service, like with GO.

That's not the choice we have here. If Greyhound makes a profit providing bus service between KW and Guelph, then GO could too. And then the profits could help offset the unprofitable routes GO does run rather than going into a private company.

 

[nfitz]

That's not the choice we have here. If Greyhound makes a profit providing bus service between KW and Guelph, then GO could too. And then the profits could help offset the unprofitable routes GO does run rather than going into a private company.

There seem to be an assumption here that GO would improve service, improve facilities, and decrease fares.

That would then eliminate the profit.

 

[drum118]

This has got nothing to do with this thread. Take the conversation to the right thread.

 

[reaperexpress]

There seem to be an assumption here that GO would improve service, improve facilities, and decrease fares.

That would then eliminate the profit.

It depends. A GO trip from Kitchener bus terminal to Guelph Central station is $7.16 Presto, $7.95 cash. Greyhound charges anywhere from $7.20 to $16.70 before tax. My guess is that the average fare is closer to the lower price in both cases, so it's actually not that much of a reduction in revenue per rider. It shouldn't take too much ridership growth to offset that cost alone.

Improving facilities doesn't come out of the operating budget so it doesn't figure into the operating subsidy. And in any case, there is no need for it. Guelph Central station is brand new, and the intercity bus portion of Kitchener's new transit hub is being paid for by the Region of Waterloo.

Improving service is the main area that would eat in to the cost recovery. I expect that a certain amount of service expansion could be paid for by the increased ridership (maybe a couple trips per day) but providing hourly service likely would completely eliminate any profit.

To me the solution to the KW-Guelph intercity transit issue is the railway that Metrolinx just bought. Once the slow zones in Kitchener and Guelph are addressed, we'll see travel times under 20 minutes. At that speed (50% faster than driving, over twice as fast as the bus), we'd see massively increased demand, and an hourly service could be provided with a single vehicle shuttling back and forth.

 

[nfitz]

This has got nothing to do with this thread. Take the conversation to the right thread.

I'm sorry, I thought this thread was about services that could use the Mississauga Transitway, like the service to Kitchener. Perhaps a mod can move the posts.

Agreed, this conversation should be moved to the GO Transit Service thread.

I don't see how non-GO services that could use the transitway work any better in the Metrolinx GO thread rather than the Metrolinx Transitway thread.