Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

[nfitz]

So if you ride the TTC a hundred times a month you don't get a UPX reduced fare but if you buy a Presto card to use once a year then you get the reduced UPX fare.............hell of a way to get people to take transit by charging those who take the most with the biggest fare.

Am I the only one who sees how completely warped that is?

I fail to see the link between TTC fares and UPX fares. Why if you took the TTC 100 times would you get reduced UPX fare?

Obviously anyone taking TTC 100 times in a month will be using a Presto card ... because the only alternative will be $280 of exact change.

 

[Napoleon]

So, if I get on the King car and tap on, and then I go into the King subway station and tap on, it knows I'm still on the same trip.

It is hard to imagine a system in which they don't program the current transfer rules into the cards. I mean they can either switch to time-based fares or program transfers. Either way, people will have a fit if a second fare is deducted when you hop on the subway.

In Amsterdam currently enjoying great transit. Here you pay a base fare plus a distance traveled (no, it's not expensive...around 1.30 euros for a typical trip I've taken). You tap on and off of every vehicle. When you switch trams, it's smart and knows you've already been on. When you tap off the second streetcar it adds the extra fare for the extra distance traveled (usually negligible). All incredibly easy and fast.

 

[CDL.TO]

In Amsterdam currently enjoying great transit. Here you pay a base fare plus a distance traveled (no, it's not expensive...around 1.30 euros for a typical trip I've taken). You tap on and off of every vehicle. When you switch trams, it's smart and knows you've already been on. When you tap off the second streetcar it adds the extra fare for the extra distance traveled (usually negligible). All incredibly easy and fast.

It really drove home how well fare-by-distance can work. You can just travel around and feel confident that you're going to be charged a fair and appropriate fare, no worrying about transfer rules and a lot less trying to figure out whether the cost is worth it.

 

[TOareaFan]

So if you ride the TTC a hundred times a month you don't get a UPX reduced fare but if you buy a Presto card to use once a year then you get the reduced UPX fare.............hell of a way to get people to take transit by charging those who take the most with the biggest fare.

Am I the only one who sees how completely warped that is?

I am gonna go out on a limb and guess that you are....or are at least one of very few. It is not shocking that a brand new service use the most up to date fare medium we currently use while a older, complicated, legacy system needs time to transition/implement that fare medium.

It also totally ignores that the 100 ride metropass user can actually get to the airport for free if they think buying a Presto to save $11 on their first round trip (and more on each one thereafter) to the airport does not make sense.

 

[NotMathematical]

It really drove home how well fare-by-distance can work. You can just travel around and feel confident that you're going to be charged and fair and appropriate fare, no worrying about transfer rules and a lot less trying to figure out whether the cost is worth it.

The biggest misconception of fare-by-distance by some in Toronto are high fare prices similar to those of GO. I support it fully, but with some additional perks .

 

[TheTigerMaster]

What is the procedure when a fare inspector (on GO, TTC and other agencies) gives a ticket, but the person who they're ticketing doesn't have ID? Someone without ID could just give false information. I've been told that fare inspectors would put persons without ID under arrest until they can get a positive ID, but that seems a little absurd to me.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

What is the procedure when a fare inspector (on GO, TTC and other agencies) gives a ticket, but the person who they're ticketing doesn't have ID? Someone without ID could just give false information. I've been told that fare inspectors would put persons without ID under arrest until they can get a positive ID, but that seems a little absurd to me.

That's a good question I know on Campus PD a(a tv show that flowed various campus police) they would radio in with someones birth date and where they were born to find out who they were if they didn't have ID on them. I wonder if they would be allowed to use a health card for ID?

 

[NotMathematical]

What is the procedure when a fare inspector (on GO, TTC and other agencies) gives a ticket, but the person who they're ticketing doesn't have ID? Someone without ID could just give false information. I've been told that fare inspectors would put persons without ID under arrest until they can get a positive ID, but that seems a little absurd to me.

It's not necessary on OC Transpo when a fare inspection officer asks you for ID,but this was during the transition period for PoP routes that use Articulated Buses for all door boarding.

This is all I could get,
http://m.metronews.ca/#/article/new...ector-you-dont-need-to-give-id-says-city.html

 

[nfitz]

So basically they can't get your ID. But the special constables can. And of course everyone is on video.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

That's a good question I know on Campus PD a(a tv show that flowed various campus police) they would radio in with someones birth date and where they were born to find out who they were if they didn't have ID on them.

That's what I figured. Do special constables have a database with everyone that has ID cards?

I wonder if they would be allowed to use a health card for ID?

It's not necessary on OC Transpo when a fare inspection officer asks you for ID,but this was during the transition period for PoP routes that use Articulated Buses for all door boarding.

This is all I could get,
http://m.metronews.ca/#/article/new...ector-you-dont-need-to-give-id-says-city.html

You really shouldn't be giving your health cards to anyone but police (including special constables) or health workers anyways. People being too eager to hand out their health card to anyone who asks is why health fraud has been such a big problem. I wouldn't be surprised if the fare inspectors(civilian) refused to use health cards as ID, to protect themselves from liability. In the past I've even had police refuse to use a health card as ID (in a non-emergency, of course).

 

[Megaton327]

What is the procedure when a fare inspector (on GO, TTC and other agencies) gives a ticket, but the person who they're ticketing doesn't have ID? Someone without ID could just give false information. I've been told that fare inspectors would put persons without ID under arrest until they can get a positive ID, but that seems a little absurd to me.

By law, you are not required to give ID when a police officer, or fare inspector or whatever, asks you for it--there is no law in Canada that says you must carry ID on you. When an officer asks, you are required to give them your full name and your home address, that is it. If a fare inspector puts you under arrest for not having ID, that would be an unlawful arrest and you could press criminal charges and file a civil suit against them for that; they would quite certainly lose their job, face quite a fine and have to pay you a fair bit of money, and quite likely face jail time.

So yes, a GO/TTC rider can just give false information. That would be criminal, and if they were able to find out they would be in very serious trouble, i.e. several years in prison.

 

[TOareaFan]

By law, you are not required to give ID when a police officer, or fare inspector or whatever, asks you for it--there is no law in Canada that says you must carry ID on you. When an officer asks, you are required to give them your full name and your home address, that is it. If a fare inspector puts you under arrest for not having ID, that would be an unlawful arrest and you could press criminal charges and file a civil suit against them for that; they would quite certainly lose their job, face quite a fine and have to pay you a fair bit of money, and quite likely face jail time.

So yes, a GO/TTC rider can just give false information. That would be criminal, and if they were able to find out they would be in very serious trouble, i.e. several years in prison.

So, if you choose not to pay your fare and get caught....just tell them you have no id but your name is Bob Smith of 123 Anywhere Street, Cambridge Ontario.

By the time they find out you are not that person you are long gone?

 

[nfitz]

So, if you choose not to pay your fare and get caught....just tell them you have no id but your name is Bob Smith of 123 Anywhere Street, Cambridge Ontario.

By the time they find out you are not that person you are long gone?

But you are still on camera. And chances are you'll see the same fare inspector again.

 

[TOareaFan]

But you are still on camera. And chances are you'll see the same fare inspector again.

I still think the most powerful tool in PoP fare collection is that the vast majority of people believe that they should pay the fare for the service they receive.

 

[nfitz]

I still think the most powerful tool in PoP fare collection is that the vast majority of people believe that they should pay the fare for the service they receive.

Works world-wide. Some too poor or crooked to pay will get away with stuff.

The occasional high-profile arrest, and loss of employment, will keep most people in line. There's losses now ... and no reason to believe that the $ lost in the future will be any larger than it is now.