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Taxis and ride-sharing in Toronto

Not only that, but bad/aggressive/rude drivers are filtered out of the system. 9 times out of 10, I prefer the driver and vehicle of Uber to a taxi. As a pedestrian and cyclist, I've rarely noticed an Uber driver stopped in the bike lane, making crazy turns, jumping the green to turn right, etc. As a pedestrian and cyclist, I find taxis to be the scourge of the road. Good riddance to them.
This is also true - all my Uber experiences have been positive.

Drivers are chatty, interesting, all seem to have normal 9-5 jobs and do this to supplement their income. Recently rode with someone working in my field and we had a great conversation about the commercial payments landscape in Canada.
 
I think the introduction of Uber is a wake-up call to the taxi service industry as a whole. Hopefully the additional competition will force existing businesses to improve their image, provide better customer service and offer more incentives (tangible or intangible) for customers to usetheir services over another transportation service.
That would be the logical approach. Instead, we get veiled threats and protests. Brilliant marketing.
 
Passengers are also rated, which improves their behaviour too.
I did have an Uber driver recently mention that he likes it because the passengers are better than when he used to drive a taxi. But then, I felt a bit uncomfortable when he described what made them "higher class" in his terms. He noted that to use Uber, you had to have a credit card, a smart phone, and a data plan. There is a little bit of intrinsic economic discrimination here against people without that, so I felt a bit guilty. I think there will always be a niche for normal taxi services
 
I did have an Uber driver recently mention that he likes it because the passengers are better than when he used to drive a taxi. But then, I felt a bit uncomfortable when he described what made them "higher class" in his terms. He noted that to use Uber, you had to have a credit card, a smart phone, and a data plan. There is a little bit of intrinsic economic discrimination here against people without that, so I felt a bit guilty. I think there will always be a niche for normal taxi services
Though you do need a smartphone and a data plan, those things are becoming more and more affordable. I think taxis, at double the price of UberX, are more exclusive and harder to swallow for most.
Uber is allowing Paypal too now, so the credit card thing is a non-issue.
 
Though you do need a smartphone and a data plan, those things are becoming more and more affordable. I think taxis, at double the price of UberX, are more exclusive and harder to swallow for most.
Uber is allowing Paypal too now, so the credit card thing is a non-issue.

Don't forget the seniors though - it may not be an issue in the future, but it certainly could be right now.

AoD
 
Looks like the Judge agrees that Uber is not a taxi broker under current regulation.
Seems like the City goofed - the judge said that the organization who runs Uber's servers and who therefore could have been asked to testify to what they do was not named in the suit. It might have also helped the suit if the California decision that Uber drivers were employees had come in before the hearing.

Given articles like this and this about Uber in Portland, I simply have no illusions that Uber will come to City Hall to discuss a new relationship with anything in mind beyond a complete victory for them (either immediately or after a short period of forbearance) and a determination to ensure neither the City or the Province will succeed in tightening any regulations after UberX is legitimized.
 
Help me understand what's going on here... So the Ontario Courts have ruled that Uber is not a taxi service, but the city is fining Uber drivers for operating a taxi service without license?

And that asshat councillor Karygiannis just threatened PanAm tourists that they will be fined too. Great way to show the world how pleasant we are and encourage them to visit more, with threats.
 
Help me understand what's going on here... So the Ontario Courts have ruled that Uber is not a taxi service, but the city is fining Uber drivers for operating a taxi service without license?

And that asshat councillor Karygiannis just threatened PanAm tourists that they will be fined too. Great way to show the world how pleasant we are and encourage them to visit more, with threats.
I think the logic goes that since they're not a taxi service, they're now a limousine service. And they're fining them for not having the appropriate limo service licenses. As for Karygiannis, he's clearly 100% in the pocket of the taxi interests. Is there no conflict of interest law in Toronto?
 
According Highway Traffic Act, also know as the All Powerful Act, the city seems to be using the subsection that if the city hasn't regulated it, it's still illegal.

Ontario Highway Traffic Act said:
(3) No person shall arrange or offer to arrange for a passenger to be picked up in a motor vehicle other than a bus for the purpose of being transported for compensation except under the licence, permit or authorization that is required to do so, as described in subsection (1). 2005, c. 26, Sched. A, s. 4.

Looks like the province/city may have had the last laugh, the law is so broadly written that it seems to have anticipated this. If I was Uber, I would go after the city for harassment and a restraining order until it got its by-laws up to date.
 
Can someone explain to me why City of Toronto can't apply the taxi license fee and taxi inspection regulations to Uber. It seems fundamentally unfair to me that a taxi service is operating without having these regulations applied to them.
 
Can someone explain to me why City of Toronto can't apply the taxi license fee and taxi inspection regulations to Uber. It seems fundamentally unfair to me that a taxi service is operating without having these regulations applied to them.
Although I believe some rules are needed -- I must point out that the taxi regime was created for a yesterday's era.

It's easy to become a Uber driver today.

You just sign up. Then after some basic vetting by Uber, all you need to do is install the "UberPartner" app.

That's it.

The driver's phone GPS puts their car symbol on the user's phone Uber map. The app software handles the payments for both of them. The app notifies you when someone wants a ride and automatically displays a GPS map leading to your pickup.

No other equipment
No cash machines
No fare tracking machines.
No credit card readers
No in-person transactions, no cash

The driver only has an app
The customer only has an app
Uber simply mails you a check once in a while.

This doesn't fit with 19th century taxi regulations.
Yes, we need rules. Maybe more vetting, yes. BUT the existing rules is like using a shotgun to kill a fly, full stop.

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...And let's seriously consider 30 years from now, we'll have driverless cars -- imagine "DIAL-A-BUS" (reborn) type services that carpools users to the nearest mass-transit station. Micro transit services as last mile connectors. Run by parties like Hertz, ZipCar, Beck, Uber, TTC, GO, Toyota. Or all of them. Large numbers to the point that it takes less than 2-3 minutes for a suburbanite to hail a public microtransit carpooled dynamic minibus via a Uber-style app released by TTC or Uber or Hertz. There's no difference between a taxi, a minibus, a carpool, a rented car, a carsharing service, if they are all driverless and driving for you anyway. And apps can facilitate quick carpools that scales up to shuttlebus levels. It is possible taxi drivers will be obsolete in 50 years. From this perspective, it seems stupid to apply existing taxi laws to DIAL-A-BUS type services that could fluorish and improve our road's capacity and efficiency. More than over 100x (one hundred) as many "taxi" licenses may be needed to be active concurrently within 50 years to accomodate such a shared-vehicle-economy transition away from single-occupant vehicles -- when drivereless carpooled taxi becomes part of public transit. Given the pace of innovation, I strongly seriously suggest that's a fallacy of an idea to use existing onerous taxi rules without first modifying the outdated rules.

...In 30 to 50 years from now, taxi drivers (except for higher end chauffering) may be extinct and we could have fleets of driverless cars/minibuses/transit that's controlled by uber-like and uberPOOL-like apps. Maybe owned by GO or TTC as last-mile connectors like DIAL-A-BUS but massively more efficient, cheaper, faster, more availability of vehicles, and more efficient, more-people-per-vehicle (unless you pay more to go solo), where even distant suburbs is as easy to hail as a New York City street. With so many hailable vehicles, you can instantly hail an existing already-enroute carpool whose existing GPS route overlaps your waiting location.

Heck, unused owned driverless cars could be opted-in to automatically join the TCC/GO/Uber/Beck/Whatever "DIAL-A-BUS" fleet to reduce the car owner's monthly bill (automakers are now aware of this potential. But now imagine driverless cars! Imagine letting your owned driverless car temporarily join TTC automatically while it's unused, in exchange for a free citywide transit pass for the whole family, if you lost your job and want to eliminate the car bill for a while!).

Now you understand how stupid the taxi rules look, when we look at tomorrow's driverless ridesharing economy, potentially operated municipally, provincially, and privately. In tomorrow more-average-people-per-car driverless era where there is no difference between a taxi, a rental car, a carshare car, somebody else's carpool car, a dial-a-bus vehicle, etc. To help taxi drivers, give them a transition schedule (10 or 20 years) with progressive rules that prevent perpetuating undesirable status quo. Fresh ideas are needed. The slow transition has begun, thanks to the likes of Zipcar, AutoShare, Car2Go, Uber, UberPOOL, Lyft, Ford automobile company's "eliminate your car bill by letting others borrow your car" initiative, etc, etc, etc. Be forewarned, other cities are going to rabbit ahead of Toronto in the next few decades unless we fix the lobbyist-enforced junk of taxi regulations, while admirably served its purpose, doesn't make sense in the coming years without serious amendments for the public good.

The transition is not going to stop, especially if all of these services (i.e. ZipCar, Car2Go, and eventually driverless Uber/Hertz/Avis vehicles) eventually become more taxilike with robocars. And super easy one-button carpool hailing when you want to pay less fare and get a vehicle almost instantly because a quarter to a half of all cars on the road are hailable carpools. Boom. Why hail taxi?
 
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Can someone explain to me why City of Toronto can't apply the taxi license fee and taxi inspection regulations to Uber. It seems fundamentally unfair to me that a taxi service is operating without having these regulations applied to them.

In an nutshell, Toronto by-laws regulating taxi's system dates back to amalgamation and doesn't define Uber as a taxi service. The judge has said the city can simply update it's by-laws and bring Uber under the taxi license fee system legally, but the holdup is the taxi association doesn't want to see Uber regulated, they want them gone, and so does members of city council.

What Councillor Karygiannis rants about arresting tourist and citizens is referring too is how laws in this province are written. Basically, since you are a independent adult, you should know the Highway Traffic Act inside out and that not knowing isn't an excuse. It's stupid, but that how messed up are laws are in the province.
 

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