Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited

[mdrejhon]

It looks like from the picture they've added a few more signals along Platform 3. Would that assist with triple berthing? Was this a one-off thing or will it become a regular occurrence?

There were a few extra signals, yes.

Also I think they may have been using an inactive (empty) train as a buffer between two boarding trains. Not sure.

I knew UPX could double berth with VIA but I had never seen triple-berthing before.

VIA staff did reroute me off Platform 3, alas. Inconsistent. Some staff still need to be reminded Platform 3 is not a fare paid platform as it is a through route for the bus terminal. It's the only time (post-reopening of Platform 3) that I have been shooed off to a detour.

 

[wopchop]

If you ask for directions, GO / Metrolinx staff in the York Concourse will tell you to take Platform 3 to get to the bus terminal, so I don't see why we should listen to anything the VIA staff have to say on the matter at all.

 

[vegeta_skyline]

That is surprising, given that was the track where two GO trains collided in '97.

That incident really had little to do with the track itself and more to do with the lax policies and operating procedures in place at CN at that time. There are countless locations across the system with poor sight lines, basically almost any curve - that incident could of happen on any one of them. The crew was operating under a restricting signal which require the train to "stop within one half the range of vision of equipment"(i.e. a train). Meaning if your range of vision is diminished, as it was for that train approaching track one at Union, the speed of the movement must be reduced by a corresponding amount to continue fulfilling that obligation. Crew members are also required to be in constant communication to control the movement, which was not the case there. Honestly it's amazing more didn't go wrong when CN was around. Their half-assed adherence to the rules and operating procedures was shocking to say the least.

However I'm a bit disappointed with the speeds and capacity resulting from the project. I took the evening Via train from Kitchener yesterday and it spent nearly the entire GTS at 72 mph (116 km/h) even though the limit was supposed to be 80 - 90 mph (129 - 145 mph) and the train was 20 minutes late. It actually sped up to 75 mph (121 km/h) going into the Weston tunnel whereas the 75 mph speed limit there is a slow zone compared to the surroundings.

Via trains are limited to a zone speed of 75mph across the entire Weston sub(vs 80 for GO & UP). Probably sped up to 75 PSO at Weston just due to gravity.

But the annoying part was that we got held for 10 minutes at Liberty Village to allow a westbound UP leaving Union to cross our path. I'd really like to see Metrolinx look into a grade separation near Pearson junction to bring UP trains from the north track down to the south. That would allow westbound UP trains to stay on the north side of the USRC the from their north side platform, crossing only the Barrie line, rather than both the Barrie and Kitchener lines currently. Plus operating a single 4-track railway rather than two parallel 2-track railways would would allow for much more operational flexibility, allowing trains to switch tracks without affecting oncoming traffic and decimating the line capacity. That would also make mitigating delays a lot more practical.

I think eventually the plan is the use the flyunder in the USRC for that purpose. Seems like that is difficult to do right now with 3 tracks and having 2 used almost exclusively for the UP - which is nonsensical.

 

[smallspy]

I think eventually the plan is the use the flyunder in the USRC for that purpose. Seems like that is difficult to do right now with 3 tracks and having 2 used almost exclusively for the UP - which is nonsensical.

The bigger issue is that they haven't even opened up the third track in the flyunder. PNR is really behind the 8-ball on all of their projects right now, and not just in the GTA, thanks to the Metrolinx push to get the UPX running.

On the bright side, it looks like there's an end in sight. The rest of the CTC on the Newmarket is supposed to go live before the end of the year, and they're pretty darn close to finishing the signal bungalow installations of the south end of the Weston Sub. They're also getting caught up on a number of other non-Metrolinx projects that have fallen behind.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.

 

[TOareaFan]

Had a conversation with a guy from Chicago today....made me feel better about the world. Hasn't been to Toronto in a couple of years so this would be his first trip here since the UP opened. His comments were, essentially:

1. Took the train...seems a no brainer compared to a $55 cab fare
2. (after I asked him what he thought about the $27.50 fare) Who pays that? I bought one of those cards and saved the money.
3. Wish we had one of these in Chicago! (when I pointed out people here wish we had a subway to airport like they do) Sure, but who wants to take an hour to get to/from the airport ...express trains are the way to go.
4. (after I asked/commented that he must be staying at one of the hotels attached to union/UP/path) No...staying at the Omni (which if you don't know is what the King Edward is branded as now)...it's a real easy walk from there to to train.

 

[gabe]

Had a conversation with a guy from Chicago today....made me feel better about the world. Hasn't been to Toronto in a couple of years so this would be his first trip here since the UP opened. His comments were, essentially:

1. Took the train...seems a no brainer compared to a $55 cab fare
2. (after I asked him what he thought about the $27.50 fare) Who pays that? I bought one of those cards and saved the money.
3. Wish we had one of these in Chicago! (when I pointed out people here wish we had a subway to airport like they do) Sure, but who wants to take an hour to get to/from the airport ...express trains are the way to go.
4. (after I asked/commented that he must be staying at one of the hotels attached to union/UP/path) No...staying at the Omni (which if you don't know is what the King Edward is branded as now)...it's a real easy walk from there to to train.

From the Washington Blue line subway station ("L") to O'Hare is a 45 minute ride. From downtown to Midtway, it's 25 min. Cost $2.25. http://www.transitchicago.com/airports/

Chicago's mayor wants a high-speed up scale express trains from the airport to downtown. There is lots of room for both. Business travelers use the express train and the airport workers and people on a budget can use the subways.

 

[TOareaFan]

From the Washington Blue line subway station ("L") to O'Hare is a 45 minute ride. From downtown to Midtway, it's 25 min. Cost $2.25. http://www.transitchicago.com/airports/

Chicago's mayor wants a high-speed up scale express trains from the airport to downtown. There is lots of room for both. Business travelers use the express train and the airport workers and people on a budget can use the subways.

I did not question him on the "hour by subway" time as a) have no idea where he is starting his journey from and b) it's his city not mine and far be it for me to question him on it......point of my post was, simply, to point out that a total outsider was seeing the benefits of the service and actually "got" the pricing model and was able to see that all he had to do was get a presto card to reduce his fare....also that some of our earlier impressions that only those staying at certain hotels would use it....all in all, if this guy's impression starts to be shared by others perhaps the service will be fairly well received.

 

[Napoleon]

Chicago's mayor wants a high-speed up scale express trains from the airport to downtown. There is lots of room for both. Business travelers use the express train and the airport workers and people on a budget can use the subways.

Exactly, let's give people a choice. Nonetheless, given that the UPX is essentially empty right now, the fare level will have to change to support the express service.

Out of curiosity, where did he buy a Presto card at Pearson? Is there a machine near the train station? I've never seen it advertised.

 

[nfitz]

From the Washington Blue line subway station ("L") to O'Hare is a 45 minute ride.

I did O'Hare to Washington (or was it Monroe) once. Seemed closer to an hour than 45 minutes. Though (and I arrived about 9:30 AM or so), the trains only ran every 10 minutes (hard to believe on a weekday). By the time you have 2-3 minutes to get in and out of the station at each end, an hour isn't hard to believe. Unless you get lucky and they stop the train at the top of the escalator down to the platform.

 

[crs1026]

In Chicago's defense, an hour on the subway (it's plausible - it's about 20 stops to downtown) is less than what it would take by car under the usual heavy traffic conditions. The subway runs down the expressway median for a good distance, so it's a direct apples to oranges comparison. The ride to Midway is much shorter.

It took me an hour to reach Russell Square by tube from Heathrow last month. While the Heathrow Express is cool, there is no one spot in London that it could terminate at that would meet all needs - the 22 min ride to Paddington will have a cab or transit ride appended to it. The tube in contrast crosses a good bit of London stoppng along the way - and offers lots of connections - so while seeming slower it's quite time competitive The biggest problem with the tube was that at 8:30 in the morning, it was stuffed solid, and it's a very small vehicle to be wielding a suitcase in. Life will be very different, though, after Crosslink is completed.

So, yes, in comparison UPX is a marketable and useful way to access much of downtown Toronto.

I still have not seen a reliable statement of what UPX's under-use translates into in dollars. It would be helpful to know what the unplanned 'burn' is.....it translates into how long ML should stay its course versus beginning to experiment with other pricing.

- Paul

 

[salsa]

In Chicago's defense, an hour on the subway (it's plausible - it's about 20 stops to downtown) is less than what it would take by car under the usual heavy traffic conditions. The subway runs down the expressway median for a good distance, so it's a direct apples to oranges comparison. The ride to Midway is much shorter.

Fun Fact: the Blue Line which services the airport has an average weekday ridership of 186,796. For comparison, the Bloor-Danforth Line (with almost same number of stations but only half as long) carries 519,180.

 

[TOareaFan]

Exactly, let's give people a choice. Nonetheless, given that the UPX is essentially empty right now, the fare level will have to change to support the express service.

We have choices too....we have UP...we have GO buses....we have subway/192 combo.....we don't have a direct subway but not sure the ridership would support the cost of supplying that now.

Out of curiosity, where did he buy a Presto card at Pearson? Is there a machine near the train station? I've never seen it advertised.

I never asked ...I presume there is a customer service desk there like there is at Union?

As I write this it took me about 16 seconds to find this online

https://www.upexpress.com/Tickets/UpPrestoPDF

 

[nfitz]

"All four UP Express stations have a service counter where you can purchase PRESTO cards, and your card is immediately ready to use."

Seems easy enough.

 

[Admiral Beez]

I'm flying to Atlanta in a few weeks and will try the UPE (upx?). The test is with a Presto Card and taxis from/to Union to Cabbagetown am I saying much time or money vs. airport limo? My neighbour uses Uber X to get to the airport and it costs him, IIRC, about $40.

 

[nfitz]

Depends on time of day really. And where your taxi drops you at Union. Reading the timings on the comparison in the Toronto Star, I can only think that the taxi dropped the person at the corner of Bay and Front or something, instead of Station Street between York and Simcoe.