nfitz
Superstar
It's shorter than the tunnel as well though.
I thought in the new presentation, they'd also reduced the bridge to 2 tracks.
Toronto GO Transit: Davenport Diamond Grade Separation | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx
- Thread starter vic
- Start date
drum118
Superstar
Until you see the real detail of the bridge and elevation detail design, one can only assume it maybe 2 tracks. If Metrolinx is looking at 3 tracks for the line, it possible this area could be a pinch point going to 2 tracks, but knowing them, expect 3. They can build it for 2 tracks today with provision going to 3 with the retaining pier support for the bridge.
The trench could be shorter, but the residents still loose out for the upgrade as currently been proposed. Still higher cost than the elevated design.
mdrejhon
Senior Member
The centre track can be transparent and unobstructed at first. And when the ties finally come for the 3rd track, it would straddle the opening, still being open (between the ties) as the trains go over.
crs1026
Senior Member
It was raised in 2009, the community expressed objections at that time, and Metrolinx went silent for a few years. That had the effect of leaving the community believing the issue was dead. Then, when it's raised again, ML says they are in a rush.
Even not-particularly-politically-astute people like me know where that kind of on-and-off dynamic gets you.
I seriously wonder about ML's community relations people. They seem to think that a few glossy tweets and a little pixiedust is all you need to get everyone singing happily like the munchkins in Wizard of Oz.
ML doesn't want it, and the community doesn't want it, so it's everyone's least favourite option.
If you measure the linear feet of trench required, it impacts far more residents than either the tunnel or the bridge. On a linear feet basis, the tunnel option actually is a trench option, just one with a fairly short tunnel in the middle.
- Paul
Wrenkin
Active Member
I wouldn't want to be standing under that when a train passes over at 100km/h and something falls through the cracks.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
What? They don't dump toilet contents on the tracks anymore? At least here they don't. They may do so in third world countries, but not in Canada.
Wrenkin
Active Member
I was thinking more in terms of debris, pebbles, etc.
nfitz
Superstar
They don't for VIA and GO carriages, but don't act like it's a third world thing. It's not been that long since we stopped in southern Ontario - I'm not 100% sure they've modified all the passenger carriages on remote Canadian railways yet. - for that matter, I don't know if all the locomotives have been modified yet! I certainly have clear memories of the signs not to flush while the train was in the stations, or walking along train tracks and encountering little piles of toilet paper.
crs1026
Senior Member
Chunks of ice would be the most prevalent and dangerous ...... but only if the undersides were open. As I understand the renderings from the last public meeting, the undersides are solid, like the UXP and the Line 2 overhead bridges. The "open space" is the gap left between tracks, not underneath a single track.
I don't ever recall being worried about anything falling on me when I park my car at Keele station on the TTC.
- Paul
I don't ever recall being worried about anything falling on me when I park my car at Keele station on the TTC.
- Paul
BurlOak
Senior Member
The suggestion was that in future they would bridge the area between the two tracks to run the third rail. As a joke, it was suggested that it would be open.
robmausser
Senior Member
What are you talking about? The tunnel option is by FAR longer than the trench option and was highlighted by Metrolinx to impact the most people.
I find it funny that the Tunnel option just makes a trench almost as long as the trench option north of Davenport area.
Such a selfish NIMBY attitude to want this option. "Oh WE get a tunnel! oh, but our neighbours north of us get a trench? Oh well! Not our problem!"
You know what will happen if the tunnel goes through, the people in the area north of davenport will complain just as much about a trench. This will be never ending NIMBYism.
crs1026
Senior Member
I was looking only at the length of the trench segments, and admittedly judging by eye.
You are correct, the tunnel option impacts more people end to end, and passes the buck from the immediate community to the community further north and south.
The cry from the politicians to delay the TPAP is really irresponsible. Will anything have changed in a year? I would say, complete the study, and let's make a decision. The option they are asking for takes the longest to build, so adds urgency.
- Paul
You are correct, the tunnel option impacts more people end to end, and passes the buck from the immediate community to the community further north and south.
The cry from the politicians to delay the TPAP is really irresponsible. Will anything have changed in a year? I would say, complete the study, and let's make a decision. The option they are asking for takes the longest to build, so adds urgency.
- Paul
BurlOak
Senior Member
How expensive is a station at grade on the south side of St. Clair?
Just give the locals their station and the whole thing could've been approved without incident.
It can easily be seen that that station is not possible with the trench or tunnel - meaning their is more benefit to locals to chose elevated.
Just give the locals their station and the whole thing could've been approved without incident.
It can easily be seen that that station is not possible with the trench or tunnel - meaning their is more benefit to locals to chose elevated.
The rail bridge at the mouth of the Rouge River is open and you can walk or cycle beneath while the train passes over. Me and the kids had a bunch of fun there last summer.
cplchanb
Senior Member
Ive always stood by the fact that these consultations for projects that are done on public lands are really just a goodwill gesture, and all people do is complain and complain (there are legitimate issues, but most of the times its camp a and camp b having ideological battles). Metrolinx should not bound to the citizens for every little item, but to the government regulations pertaining to their construction and operation. If these nimbys have a problem, they are welcome to move out and save the heartache from the rest of the majority who would welcome paying less for perpetual debates, studies and add on costs for luxuries catering to everyone's minute concerns. If this was like this back in the 50/60s, we would never have had a subway built to the current meagre extent.