King of Kensington
Senior Member
What about Little Italy?
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Areas that have seen less gentrification than expected
- Thread starter King of Kensington
- Start date
What about Little Italy?
wild goose chase
Active Member
Doesn't the age of the ethnic neighbourhood, or perhaps its newness influence its chances of gentrification? I feel like ethnic enclaves where many members of that ethnic group still concentrate, are still mainly first or second generation, speak English not as first language etc. aren't going to gentrify yet while old enclaves going on multiple generations or where many are starting to leave to go to the "ethnoburbs", or where many of the kids of the first immigrants are "assimilated" leave the enclave ripe for gentrification.
Also, it seems like not continuing to be an immigrant gateway tends to mean that ethnic enclaves would fade over time anyway with or without gentrification, right? Little Italies in many North American cities are on the decline due to assimilation, not ncessarily gentrification. If Italians aren't immigrating to North America, then it could just stay working class but just with another immigrant group (eg. Manhattan's Little Italy becoming more Chinese) rather than gentrify so there must be something that makes some ethnic enclaves gentrify but not others which might stay affordable enough just to continue to be an immigration gateway for yet another group of newcomers to form their own enclave. I think Chinatowns hold out longer than Little Italies in many North American cities simply because even though Chinese immigrants by far prefer ethnoburbs, there are still more recent Chinese to maintain Chinatowns than recent Italians to maintain Little Italies.
Also, it seems like not continuing to be an immigrant gateway tends to mean that ethnic enclaves would fade over time anyway with or without gentrification, right? Little Italies in many North American cities are on the decline due to assimilation, not ncessarily gentrification. If Italians aren't immigrating to North America, then it could just stay working class but just with another immigrant group (eg. Manhattan's Little Italy becoming more Chinese) rather than gentrify so there must be something that makes some ethnic enclaves gentrify but not others which might stay affordable enough just to continue to be an immigration gateway for yet another group of newcomers to form their own enclave. I think Chinatowns hold out longer than Little Italies in many North American cities simply because even though Chinese immigrants by far prefer ethnoburbs, there are still more recent Chinese to maintain Chinatowns than recent Italians to maintain Little Italies.
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Johnny Au
Senior Member
The reason why Manhattan's Little Italy is becoming more Chinese is because Manhattan's Chinatown is slowly pushing north from Canal Street at the expense of Little Italy (and many of the original inhabitants either died or moved out); Canal Street was the traditional boundary between Chinatown and Little Italy; nowadays, the boundary between Chinatown and Little Italy is less clear, though it is consistently north of Canal Street, sometimes even at Hester Street, one block north of Canal Street.
The northeast corner of Canal and Baxter in Manhattan; it is odd that the flag of Quebec is prominent in that image
At the northwest corner of Canal and Mulberry, the boundary between the two neighbourhoods blur completely; sometimes, even Chinese businesses show up between Italian businesses and yes, many Italian businesses rely on Chinese clientele for survival, such as Avari Beauty (note its second sign using Chinese characters) and Little Italy Discount Corner (most of its merchandise are made in China, not Italy, ironically enough).
Centre Street in Manhattan passes through both neighbourhoods as well (and yes, that street is spelled "Centre" despite all other uses having "Center" being the correct spelling there; the sentence "The World Trade Center and Centre Street are a walking distance from each other" is correctly spelled in all varieties of English)
Toronto's Little Italy is becoming more Portuguese even; it is one block north of Little Portugal for a few blocks and there are no shortage of Asian businesses even, since finding Chinese characters on a storefront in Toronto's Little Italy is not difficult at all.
Unlike Manhattan, Toronto's Little Italy and Chinatown are kept apart from each other by Kensington Market (though almost half of the people who live in Kensington Market are ethnically Chinese).
The northeast corner of Canal and Baxter in Manhattan; it is odd that the flag of Quebec is prominent in that image
At the northwest corner of Canal and Mulberry, the boundary between the two neighbourhoods blur completely; sometimes, even Chinese businesses show up between Italian businesses and yes, many Italian businesses rely on Chinese clientele for survival, such as Avari Beauty (note its second sign using Chinese characters) and Little Italy Discount Corner (most of its merchandise are made in China, not Italy, ironically enough).
Centre Street in Manhattan passes through both neighbourhoods as well (and yes, that street is spelled "Centre" despite all other uses having "Center" being the correct spelling there; the sentence "The World Trade Center and Centre Street are a walking distance from each other" is correctly spelled in all varieties of English)
Toronto's Little Italy is becoming more Portuguese even; it is one block north of Little Portugal for a few blocks and there are no shortage of Asian businesses even, since finding Chinese characters on a storefront in Toronto's Little Italy is not difficult at all.
Unlike Manhattan, Toronto's Little Italy and Chinatown are kept apart from each other by Kensington Market (though almost half of the people who live in Kensington Market are ethnically Chinese).
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Admiral Beez
Superstar
Danforth east of Greektown has entirely passed on gentification. Back in the 1980s I worked at the Shoppers Drug Mart at Main and Danforth, and back then it was a sesspool. Today I don't think it's much better, while other areas of the city have really revitalized. With excellent subway access, lots of single family homes, lots of store fronts and a mall nearby, why is Danforth east so troubled? It can't all be Crescent Town's fault.
christiesplits
Senior Member
Early gentrification in East Danforth started in the residential areas north and south of the main drag in the late 90s. There were (and still are) some upper-middle class pockets north of the Danforth, between Greenwood and Coxwell, and south of the Danforth, between Woodbine and Main, where people priced out of Riverdale and the Beaches could find century-old semis and detached homes. It is only in the last five years that gentrification has been evident along the main strip, with a number of new coffee shops and bars popping up, particularly between Greenwood and Coxwell.
West of Main (by your old workplace), gentrification noticeably halts.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
It does seem that high-rise rental, versus condos (including condos with large rental ratios), seems to drag down neighbourhoods that would otherwise gentrify.
This article covers the topic, https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2011/01/12/torontos_poor_concentrated_in_aging_highrises.html
This article covers the topic, https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2011/01/12/torontos_poor_concentrated_in_aging_highrises.html
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