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Roads: Increase Ontario 400-series Highway Speed Limit

isaidso said:
Much of the 400 wasn't designed well enough to allow safe travel beyond 80km/h let alone 120km/h. Signs are terrible. By the time you get to the sign you realize you have 1 or 2 seconds to switch lanes. Some curves are far too severe, and Ontario is the only place I've ever been where you need to change lanes to stay on the same highway. Exiting to stay on the same highway? Really?

I understand New Brunswick having 110km/h speed limits; I'd even support 130km/h on some of their highways. Many of Ontario's 400 highways have serious design flaws and are dangerous enough at the limits we have now.
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That's strange...I've driven all over the world and I think Ontario's highways are designed to among the highest standards I've ever seen. There are certainly some areas with flaws, particularly on the 400, but they're no worse than many other roads. I'm always happy to be back on Ontario roads after driving on American Interstates, where changing lanes to stay on the same highway is quite common. They also have much poorer acceleration and deceleration lanes.
 
isaidso said:
Much of the 400 wasn't designed well enough to allow safe travel beyond 80km/h let alone 120km/h. Signs are terrible. By the time you get to the sign you realize you have 1 or 2 seconds to switch lanes. Some curves are far too severe, and Ontario is the only place I've ever been where you need to change lanes to stay on the same highway. Exiting to stay on the same highway? Really?

I understand New Brunswick having 110km/h speed limits; I'd even support 130km/h on some of their highways. Many of Ontario's 400 highways have serious design flaws and are dangerous enough at the limits we have now.
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The Toronto-centric view seems to appear in a few comments. Just because highway 400 is a bit confusing near 407, does that mean that the stretch from King Road to Barrier, and Barrier to Coldwater, should not be eligible for a higher speed limit. All highways may contain a few complex interchanges where speeds would stay at 100, but other areas are safet at much higher speeds and 120 is not unreasonable at all.
 
Absolutely! Even if some stretches/ramps or what have you are not the greatest, that does not mean that the vast majority of our 400-series highways are not plain excellent and able to offer a limit of 120 to 130 (simply keep the 100km/h limit in the most dangerous - or shall I say - less safe places). I've also travelled much in Europe, Germany, Austria, Italy and all over the USA and can say with a strong convicion what we say on our www.stop100.ca web site: we have some of the best highways in the entire world. That truly is not an overstatement. Highway 401 Express in GTA is one example. Brilliant engineering many decades ago which offered less frequent ramps and much longer ones for increased safety (ie - much higher speed permitted, which our politicians clearly do not understand, or simply haven't bother to change). Why would the 401 Collectors be limited at the same speed as Express? (which has "express" in the name in case Queens Park has not noticed and all the extra safety features that it offers). Anyhow, yes, Ontario should be extremely proud of its roads. Those in the GTA as well as outside. I am as the Ontario resident. And yes, I've been on the Autobahn and seen many others.

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you'd have to increase Transport speed as well. Not that I'm opposed to it.

But the amount of times a line of cars going 140 have to come to a screeching halt (well not halt, but to 100) because a transport saw an opening just smaller than his transport truck is ridiculous. I drive from Belleville to Toronto all the time. And the 2 lane stretch scares me at times.
 
Just voted......voted for mainting the 100km/h limit.....mostly because I surprised there was no "lower it to 90" option.
 
I just drove back to Pickering from Toronto on the DVP and 401 in a pickup truck. Average speed on DVP: 110. Average speed on 401: 140. Wait, shouldn't I be dead according to some of you? Are we living in the same dimension is my next question.
 
Precisely, this is what this campaign is all about - not changing any existing habits drastically - but simply TO RECOGNIZE OUR CURRENT DRIVING PRACTICES which as you've stated, do not leave that many dead on the road - quite the contrary - Ontario has some of the highest practiced speeds anywhere in North America, yet one of the lowest casualty rates... We want the Gov't and MTO to recognize that. We want to ALLOW THE DRIVERS TO DRIVE THE WAY THEY ALREADY ARE - LEGALLY, so they can focus more on the road and not get ticketed for something that's clearly working quite well.
 
A lot of this thread is missing a key point: enforcement.

The reason everybody drives 20 kph over is because that's what is enforced. Not that I would support a limit that high, but we could set the limit at 130kph if we wanted to and we'd be fine, as long as it was enforced. Higher speed limits can be implemented in Ontario with higher enforcement.

I say make it 120 kph and bring back photo radar. The only reason photo radar was unpopular the last time was because the average Joe doing 120 got a ticket. If he's not getting a ticket, and he's not breaking the law driving 120, he'll be happy as a clam.
 
I have an idea to add: can we also get higher enforcement of "SLOWER TRAFFIC KEEP RIGHT"? Kthanksbye!

In any case, I'm one driver who will never change his habits, regardless of what the laws are. I was just hoping for a logical law to be put in place as far as speed limits are concerned. When Fantino as newly-minted chief of the OPP said, "Driving is not a right; it is a privilege", I shook my head. I mean, I knew he was a fascist, but I didn't need to hear about it from him.

All this being said, I have great respect for the OPP (the only police force I have any respect for, mind).
 
MTown said:
I have an idea to add: can we also get higher enforcement of "SLOWER TRAFFIC KEEP RIGHT"? Kthanksbye!
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Methinks a more stringent and costly means to obtain a driver's license should accomplish this along with mandatory testing (theory & practical) before renewing your driver's license. Considering the idiocy I see during my daily commute, I really wonder how did they manage to pass their driving test.
In other news..GET OFF MY FRONT LAWN!
 
kEiThZ said:
A lot of this thread is missing a key point: enforcement.

The reason everybody drives 20 kph over is because that's what is enforced. Not that I would support a limit that high, but we could set the limit at 130kph if we wanted to and we'd be fine, as long as it was enforced. Higher speed limits can be implemented in Ontario with higher enforcement.

I say make it 120 kph and bring back photo radar. The only reason photo radar was unpopular the last time was because the average Joe doing 120 got a ticket. If he's not getting a ticket, and he's not breaking the law driving 120, he'll be happy as a clam.
Click to expand...


I am not 100% sure if I agree with the notion of enforcement being the key. Do we really need the authorities to always tell us what to do and force behaviour by fear and punishment? I don't think so.

I'll present a few examples. Snowy morning. Do we need the cops to know that if the conditions are slippery and 5 inches of snow have just gotten dumped on the ground, it is wiser to drive 40 or 50 in a 60 zone? Of course we don't. Most people will just crawl along regardless of speed limit posted. We slow down automatically because this is what "feels" safe at the moment. Sure, you may hit black ice or other unexpected conditions at times and crash, but then even a cop won't save your life. We naturally drive at a safe speed and can adjust driving behaviour to the conditions outside. No enforcement is necessary to get us to act that way. Why are we going at 100 in heavy rain vs 130-140 on a bright and sunny? Not because of the OPP....

German Autobahn - why in sections with no speed limits, majority of drives hardly exceed 130-140 km/h? The reported average speed is 140 km/h. Even thought they could all "fly" at 170, 220, or 300... Because 130-140 range is what feels safest to most people and once again, no cops on the shoulder are needed to get people to feel that way. Sure, with 120 km/h limit, some of us will drive at 140 and 145 which is what happens anyway (with no dramatic results, by the way, as expected), but still - the majority will be very close to the limit (especially if you make it 130 outside of the cities). So, I think you'd be positively surprised at no significant change in driver behaviour with increased speed limits here in Ontario, regardless of enforcement. Vast majority of us are not crazy, suicidal drivers, and we will drive at a prudent speed by default. Just picture a speed limit of 160 km/h for a second. I am dead certain that 99% of the drivers wouldn't even need the tolerance and would stay below it. 100km/h is simply a horribly inadequate limit for the quality of our roads and it is due to a complete absurdity of such of a bad law, that most of us exceed it by a lot (20-40km/h), it does not mean that we are all crazy speeders by nature. We are served a ridiculous law that MAKES us all speeders (imagine if they set the limit at 80km/h...). Set the limit at 120-130 and most of us (85% percentile theory and other examples such as the autobahn) will be very close to limit with small tolerance applied. Speeds will hardly change and safety might actually improve (as the drivers won't have to eye the police parked on the sides)

If you would like to READ MORE and SUPPORT the cause, LIKE our facebook page at www.facebook.com/stop100

Have your voice and vote at www.stop100.ca/choose.html

Also, please read some FAQs about the topic on www.stop100.ca/faq.html
 
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On the drive home from work today the traffic wasn't very heavy and I was going 120. Sure enough, I was one of the slower cars on the road.

Keithz, I'd totally support photo radar coupled with a limit of 120+.
 
LordWanker said:
Methinks a more stringent and costly means to obtain a driver's license should accomplish this along with mandatory testing (theory & practical) before renewing your driver's license. Considering the idiocy I see during my daily commute, I really wonder how did they manage to pass their driving test.
In other news..GET OFF MY FRONT LAWN!
Click to expand...

Tell me about it. Meaning I agree with you.
The number of times I've almost died because some retard (yes, I AM going to use that word in this case) can't check his mirrors twice to see at what speed I'm approaching before getting into my lane is a number I lost track of a long time ago and I'm only 27. That's just one condition on my daily commute I hate dealing with. I'm not even going to get into the people who don't use their mirrors or those who think it's bloody hilarious to cut in front without speeding up to match your speed or those who are afraid of passing trucks so they block the left lane for kilometre upon kilometre.
I hate driving to and from work and wish I didn't work construction so I wouldn't have to because, hold me gently, it's just bloody mental out there. S'why I drive the way I do.....to gtfo out of there as soon as possible and hit the beach around the corner from my place so as to forgot I just had to go through that.
 
For years I've been driving 117 km/h, the "real speed limit" stated by Jim Kenzie on one of the Motoring shows, which apparently was told to him by an OPP officer. However, lately I've been realizing how much more efficient it is to drive closer to 100 km/h, and have been attempting to slow down when I'm not late or in a hurry. Slowing down to 100 km/h on my last trip to Quebec City made my 40 L fillup last the whole 800 km trip, rather than the more typical 600 km I usually see from 40 L. (2011 Chevy Cruze Eco manual)
 
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