Mississauga Celebration Square Redevelopment (CS&P Architects)

[taal]

Why will it cost so much, nothing seems to elaborate here?

[jks]

This is welcome news, no one ever goes to that square! I will miss the little park behind the *extremely stupid* wall, on the western part of the square.

[Anth]

larger skating rink - strange, considering the current one is only busy for a few hours a day, a few months of the year.

True, but a larger one would likely attract far more people since Mississaugans would then be less inclined to go downtown or to Brampton's beautiful Gage Park to get their outdoor skating fix.

The current rink really is tiny.

[bleeepbluuup]

True, but a larger one would likely attract far more people since Mississaugans would then be less inclined to go downtown or to Brampton's beautiful Gage Park to get their outdoor skating fix.

The current rink really is tiny.

And really hidden from view. You'd never know it was there until you walked right up into the square; you can't see it from the street or the sidewalks.

[mjl08]

The idea of a "public piazza" just doesn't fly with the suburbs. This is the realm that believes in the private realm... private schools, private cul de sacs, private swimming pools, private swimming lessons. Its one thing to physically change a landscape to make it more European and pedestrian-friendly, but its another for the locals to jump on board.

Anyone been to the "bustling" streets of Cornell lately?

[doady]

The idea of a "public piazza" just doesn't fly with the suburbs. This is the realm that believes in the private realm... private schools, private cul de sacs, private swimming pools, private swimming lessons.

Is this a joke? How many people in Mississauga have actually gone to private school? Or lived in on a private cul-de-sac? Or taken private swimming lessons in a private pool? Probably less than 0.01% of the population for any of the above.

[Observer Walt]

The idea of a "public piazza" just doesn't fly with the suburbs. This is the realm that believes in the private realm... private schools, private cul de sacs, private swimming pools, private swimming lessons. Its one thing to physically change a landscape to make it more European and pedestrian-friendly, but its another for the locals to jump on board.

Anyone been to the "bustling" streets of Cornell lately?

You apparently don't live in Mississauga. Not everyone lives in Lorne Park and sends the kids to private school. Miss. is pretty resolutely middle class, and there are in fact actual pockets of poverty not far at all from this location.

Attend the farmers' market, the outdoor concerts, Ribfest, New Year's Eve, etc.... all held at or very close to the Civic Square, even in spite of its present, admittedly second-best, configuration. I think people are actually hungry for a "people place" in the middle of the city. This was the whole impetus behind the re-visioning exercise two or three years ago, which has been enthusiastically embraced. The "locals" (did you mean: yokels?) actually have "jumped on board".

[mjl08]

You apparently don't live in Mississauga. Not everyone lives in Lorne Park and sends the kids to private school. Miss. is pretty resolutely middle class, and there are in fact actual pockets of poverty not far at all from this location.

Let me rephrase myself. By private I wasn't necessarily referring to an affluent lifestyle (poorly using private schools and pools as an example), but rather as a spectrum-wide preference for the private domain. As someone who has spent nearly half his life in the burbs, I can tell you that I did not visit a community centre until the age of 9, and only used a public park under the watchful eye of soccer moms in houseleague soccer, only to be whisked away in a Caravan the moment nightfall hit. In my life, the TV rec room was the area of play, not the front yard or the local parkette.

Mind you, these spaces do get used for the odd festivity such as Canada Day or a flashy "summer concert series," but unlike their counterparts in Toronto, they are not as tightly wooven into the urban fabric or used as regularly. Rather, they are merely used for the odd montly event and for economic development posters showing how a nearly-barren city hall and empty courtyard are "moving the city forward."

[Brian69]

This is a great idea and goes towards mitigating some of McCallion's development-minded initiatives that has given Mississauga some nice green/public spaces parks here and there but missed the boat anywhere in central Mississauga. I lived across from the square for over 2 years and often walked around there. The square is dead most of the time as is most of the surrounding area. It doesn't help that it adjoins the parking wasteland that is Square One.

Now, if council could encourage some really big daylong or night events centered around the square (free weekend concerts were nice and the ethnic festivals were decent but it's tough to compete with what Toronto puts on) maybe Mississauga could go forward in developing its own identity.

[owen]

it seems any attempt at change in mississauga is met by the constant criticism of ceaseless suburbanism.

sure, the suburban realm is in itself a rejection of the public realm in favour of the private. but mississauga is, officially anyhow, attempting to reject this idea/identity itself. at least in the city centre. whether or not this can/will be achieved is certainly a matter for debate.

however, the assertion that creating conditions for change is futile is a tired one.
mississauga is changing, like all things.

[junctionist]

It's definitely a worthy investment, but the contrast in imagery is quite conspicuous. The concept is related to the spaces in dense, old cities where people of different ages have lived in small apartments for centuries and take advantage of those large and open outdoor spaces frequently. That space is a very valuable amenity and tends to be full of history. Then there's Mississauga, a suburb where most people live in houses and have backyards and a space like that seems only significant once in a while to a few people.

But Mississauga is intensifying and transforming itself and there's a lot of potential for an interesting city as well.

[wyliepoon]

I, too, wonder at how well-used this square will be used. We can take a look at one square in the GTA that is already in this configuration and in almost the same environment... Mel Lastman Square in North York Centre. It's got a reflecting pool/rink and a bandshell, and it's located next to a civic complex, a library, and is within walking distance of many condo towers and Yonge Street, which has a level of urbanity that MCC is looking for. However the square is usually empty outside of special events (and some events only draw a handful of people).

I hope Mississauga can do better, but "build it and they will come" rarely applies to civic squares outside the downtown area.

[W. K. Lis]

I, too, wonder at how well-used this square will be used. We can take a look at one square in the GTA that is already in this configuration and in almost the same environment... Mel Lastman Square in North York Centre. It's got a reflecting pool/rink and a bandshell, and it's located next to a civic complex, a library, and is within walking distance of many condo towers and Yonge Street, which has a level of urbanity that MCC is looking for. However the square is usually empty outside of special events (and some events only draw a handful of people).

I hope Mississauga can do better, but "build it and they will come" rarely applies to civic squares outside the downtown area.

Nathan Phillips Square (Toronto City Hall) has three hotels next to it, along with residential within a block of it, which supplies a little bit of the people needed.

[doady]

Let me rephrase myself. By private I wasn't necessarily referring to an affluent lifestyle (poorly using private schools and pools as an example), but rather as a spectrum-wide preference for the private domain. As someone who has spent nearly half his life in the burbs, I can tell you that I did not visit a community centre until the age of 9, and only used a public park under the watchful eye of soccer moms in houseleague soccer, only to be whisked away in a Caravan the moment nightfall hit. In my life, the TV rec room was the area of play, not the front yard or the local parkette.

Just because you had an unsatisfying childhood doesn't mean everyone else had the same. The fact is that there is a lot private space in the city as well. After all, isn't Dundas Square private as well?

[MisterF]

Just because you had an unsatisfying childhood doesn't mean everyone else had the same. The fact is that there is a lot private space in the city as well. After all, isn't Dundas Square private as well?

You're missing the point. In central Toronto the parks and public spaces tend to be more widely used and better integrated into their communities than in the suburbs. People use the public realm more in central areas, while in suburban areas people are more restricted to the private realm. This is well documented and not exactly controversial. And it's one of the main reasons that the design of suburbs has been changing to a more traditional built form, like in Cornell or Oak Park.

To be fair, the same criticisms can be made of places like Etobicoke and Scarborough. It's not a municipal boundary issue, it's an issue of built form and how people use the spaces around them.